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Old 10-31-2017, 12:42 PM
 
36,539 posts, read 30,879,493 times
Reputation: 32823

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Quote:
Originally Posted by GotHereQuickAsICould View Post
"The project is enormous, and Whitefish is a two-year-old firm that until recently had just two full-time employees."

"Whitefish then subcontracted with utilities including Jacksonville Electric Authority and Kissimmee Utility Authority to help it with transmission system restoration — the same thing a mutual aid agreement might have arranged at a lower cost. It's unusual for electrical utilities to work under a contractor."

"For subcontractors, the bulk of Whitefish's workforce, the prices go even higher. A general foreman costs $336 an hour and a lineman, $319."

"The per diems are also expensive: almost $80 a day for meals, and $332 a day for lodging. Employee flights are billed at $1,000 each way."

There is some unusual language in the contract regarding what can and cannot be audited. Also, FEMA disputes the language indicating it had FEMA approval.

"Any language in any contract between PREPA and Whitefish that states FEMA approved that contract is inaccurate," the agency said in a statement.

Here's What's In That $300 Million Whitefish Contract : The Two-Way : NPR

So yes, Whitefish, being a company of just two full-time employees did not have the personnel or equipment to handle the job of restoring power to Puerto Rico.

So they subcontracted work out and charged a boatload for it.

The whole thing sounds fishy.

I'm surprised you couldn't find this information. It popped right up for me.
Yes companies very often subcontract. My environmental firm is a subcontractor for many government agencies and private companies. White fish had 350 people in PR and another 550 standing by, plus the heavy equipment and helicopters already in PR. There have been no complaints concerning the work they have completed to my knowledge. This does not sound like a company that is unable to do the work. As well Whitefish was one of several companies contracted to do the enormous project. As I understand their specialty is working in hazardous terrain.

As I understand Jackson and Kissimmee had issues and concerns and would not commence work until Whitefish had already got things underway per an article linked in this thread.
I have no idea about the costs, what the going rate is what it should be. I do know that being the first to jump in, get started and take the financial risks involved allows one to charge higher rates. Its like paying more for credit card or instant and secured payment and giving cash discounts but thing is you have to have the cash.

None of the information you posted shows Whitefish did not get personnel there quickly, did not have the equipment or means or failed to do the job they were contracted to do.

 
Old 10-31-2017, 01:02 PM
 
45,584 posts, read 27,203,264 times
Reputation: 23898
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
Yes companies very often subcontract. My environmental firm is a subcontractor for many government agencies and private companies. White fish had 350 people in PR and another 550 standing by, plus the heavy equipment and helicopters already in PR. There have been no complaints concerning the work they have completed to my knowledge. This does not sound like a company that is unable to do the work. As well Whitefish was one of several companies contracted to do the enormous project. As I understand their specialty is working in hazardous terrain.

As I understand Jackson and Kissimmee had issues and concerns and would not commence work until Whitefish had already got things underway per an article linked in this thread.
I have no idea about the costs, what the going rate is what it should be. I do know that being the first to jump in, get started and take the financial risks involved allows one to charge higher rates. Its like paying more for credit card or instant and secured payment and giving cash discounts but thing is you have to have the cash.

None of the information you posted shows Whitefish did not get personnel there quickly, did not have the equipment or means or failed to do the job they were contracted to do.
Ramos has said they have done a good job.

Regarding financial risks... just like with anything else, the one providing the service is taking a risk that the money will be paid, and therefore are likely to charge more for their services.

I am curious about how much it costs to reside on the island right now. It is probably pretty pricey to find a fully functioning room right now.
 
Old 10-31-2017, 01:29 PM
 
Location: Starting a walkabout
2,691 posts, read 1,668,513 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by albion View Post
The "company" had only two employees, that's a fact isn't it.
I wanted to expand on it a bit. Yes they have only 2 employees but they are a contracting company. They find subcontractors and arrange them to do all the work and make sure the job is done. They don't have the subcontractors and their employees under their direct payroll.

Just like the office of Berkshire Hathaway has been having only 25 core employees for a very long time even though the companies they own have 350K+ employees. I know it is not a direr comparison but one that shows that a small core operation can direct huge number of people.


Berkshire Hathaway Omaha office staff - Business Insider
 
Old 10-31-2017, 01:34 PM
 
36,539 posts, read 30,879,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
Ramos has said they have done a good job.

Regarding financial risks... just like with anything else, the one providing the service is taking a risk that the money will be paid, and therefore are likely to charge more for their services.

I am curious about how much it costs to reside on the island right now. It is probably pretty pricey to find a fully functioning room right now.
Seems in one of the articles it was mentioned that even finding a hotel or any place to stay with electricity, running water and food is difficult and I'm sure pricey. I't would be interesting to know what it costs and if the establishments are gouging the customers.
 
Old 10-31-2017, 02:39 PM
 
16,212 posts, read 10,828,810 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
From articles I read prepa states contractors were reluctant to work under (sign contracts) the mutual aid agreement as well a couple of representative of contractors voiced concerns over pay and other issues with housing, food, insurance coverage. Whitefish was apparently johnny on the spot.
Maybe its all lies from PREPA, IDK, but thats what has been stated in articles I have read thus far.
Honestly, I don't buy any of that. I saw that the head of PREPA said the bold, but those statements were contradicted by the fact that officials in FL offered to help PR under the mutual aid agreements before Maria hit, which is usually what occurs.

Again, I think that the head of PREPA is to blame and not the contractor. I also am not one who automatically thinks they got the work because of the relationship with the White House; however, if I were in charge of procurement at PREPA that relationship would have precluded me from awarding them any work because any suspicion of corruption makes the agency look bad and causes delays on the work. And the work is the most important aspect of this IMO.

Mutual aid governments know that PR will get FEMA aid and due to that, they will be paid so there was no reason to not go to the mutual aid agreements. Maybe the head of PREPA did have something going on with Whitefish, but IMO he was just a poor contracting officer. There are a lot of them unfortunately who don't know what they are doing and don't think about the consequences of awarding to certain entities.
 
Old 11-01-2017, 03:13 AM
 
Location: England
3,261 posts, read 3,706,414 times
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I read that Whitefish energy holdings is primarily financed by HBC the private equity company. A general partner at HBC is Joe Colonnetta, who, as it happens, was a major donor to the Trump presidential campaign.

It sure looks somewhat "Whitefishy" don't you think?
 
Old 11-01-2017, 04:32 AM
 
51,654 posts, read 25,836,151 times
Reputation: 37894
Quote:
Originally Posted by albion View Post
I read that Whitefish energy holdings is primarily financed by HBC the private equity company. A general partner at HBC is Joe Colonnetta, who, as it happens, was a major donor to the Trump presidential campaign.

It sure looks somewhat "Whitefishy" don't you think?
"Whitefishy" indeed.

Got to wonder what's behind those posting in support of this two-guy, two-bit company getting a $300 million dollar, time-and-materials contract through LinkedIn.
 
Old 11-01-2017, 04:46 AM
 
51,654 posts, read 25,836,151 times
Reputation: 37894
Ryan Zinke, another fellow with big dreams who hails from Whitefish, is under scrutiny for a number of questionable activities, including taxpayer-funded trip to the U.S. Virgin Islands that involved a Republican Party fundraiser where donors paid up to $5,000 for a photo with him.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/...nterior-243470

Seems he often combines government, political, and personal business on such trips. Claims it is all on the up.

Though Zinke knows Whitefish owner Andy Techmanski and Zinke's son worked for him for a time, Zinke claims he had absolutely nothing to do with the contract.

Claims it is all on the up and up.
 
Old 11-01-2017, 05:54 AM
 
46,305 posts, read 27,117,053 times
Reputation: 11133
Quote:
Originally Posted by GotHereQuickAsICould View Post
"Whitefishy" indeed.

Got to wonder what's behind those posting in support of this two-guy, two-bit company getting a $300 million dollar, time-and-materials contract through LinkedIn.

Can someone please explain to me how you get a contract through LinkedIn?


Even that drivel you posted earlier did not state that, they meet through LinkedIn...but they did not get the contract that way...
 
Old 11-01-2017, 08:02 AM
 
36,539 posts, read 30,879,493 times
Reputation: 32823
[quote=residinghere2007;49988373]
Quote:
Honestly, I don't buy any of that. I saw that the head of PREPA said the bold, but those statements were contradicted by the fact that officials in FL offered to help PR under the mutual aid agreements before Maria hit, which is usually what occurs.
I'm just going by what they actually said.

Concerns before and after

Power companies described a wide variety of concerns before they were willing to sign a contract.
Ivy, of the Lakeland utility, said his company had to work through insurance coverage for equipment that would be traveling by sea to Puerto Rico. He needed to get guarantees that his workers — who would be working 16-hour days, seven days a week — had somewhere safe to sleep, reliable supplies of food and security for them and their equipment.
"We just wanted to make sure that we’re sending our guys into as known a situation as we could make it," Ivy said.
Officials at the Kissimmee (Fla.) Utility Authority had so many questions that they didn't sign an agreement until they spoke directly with workers from Jacksonville to verify that Whitefish employees were on the ground in Puerto Rico and holding up their end of the bargain.
"That was a roadblock," said Chris Gent, vice president of the Kissimmee company. "Jacksonville took that initial leap for all of us. They said, 'Yes, the port is fine. The lodging is fine. There is food and fresh water being provided.’ That put us at ease to feel we could sign this contract."

I dont recall reading there was an offer by officials under the MAI before maria hit. Maybe so but I didnt read that anywhere.


Quote:
Again, I think that the head of PREPA is to blame and not the contractor. I also am not one who automatically thinks they got the work because of the relationship with the White House; however, if I were in charge of procurement at PREPA that relationship would have precluded me from awarding them any work because any suspicion of corruption makes the agency look bad and causes delays on the work. And the work is the most important aspect of this IMO.

Mutual aid governments know that PR will get FEMA aid and due to that, they will be paid so there was no reason to not go to the mutual aid agreements. Maybe the head of PREPA did have something going on with Whitefish, but IMO he was just a poor contracting officer. There are a lot of them unfortunately who don't know what they are doing and don't think about the consequences of awarding to certain entities.
I dont disagree. Maybe we will find out or maybe they are just wasting a lot of time and energy that should be focused on getting all the power back on in PR.
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