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Old 11-17-2017, 06:31 AM
 
9,254 posts, read 3,586,584 times
Reputation: 4852

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NY_refugee87 View Post
Providing current laws are still in effect for the purchase of firearms, 4473 and NICS check. No arbitrary bans on magazine capacity, visual appearances. Enforce the current laws in existence. We can add one more law. Come back denied on a NICS check, retailer notifies police immediately. In the case of the Orlando scumbag, my gun store didn't make a sale to him, they denied to sell to him and reported his suspicious behavior to the FBI. They didn't follow through, he purchased the gun he used elsewhere legally.
No more gun laws until the ones on the books are enforced. Remove suppressors from NFA too. Can either be sold like an accessory or like a lower receiver requiring a 4473 filled out and NICS check filled out. I'll be a little lenient on that if that makes you feel any better.

Treat violent offenders like they're on probation. This California scumbag possessed weapons. Wasn't supposed to. Following an arrest and the guidelines under Lautenberg act, all weapons should have been seized. I say, have follow ups just like a probation officer follows up to ensure other criminals aren't doing dope. Etc.

In my ideal society. It would suck to be a scumbag wanting to do harm to others.

Should anyone draw on you, demanding your vehicle, demanding your wallet, stand your ground. Should someone try to hold you against your will and force themselves upon you sexually, stand your ground.

Should you be in an area and gunfire erupt, remain calm, communicate with others, find the scumbag, stand your ground. Vegas. If you were on the floor with that scumbag, stand your ground. If you were on the ground and could get to a rifle to return fire, communicate with those around you, and law enforcement either upon their arrival or call in to report your identity, stand your ground. Communication is key. Maintaining composure is key. Otherwise you wind up shooting the wrong person.
In a case like vegas, you're armed with a pistol, you aren't shooting and nailing the scumbag with a standard 4 inch barrel 9mm anything at that distance. have a rifle in your truck? Go get it if you're confident you can identify and eliminate the threat.


If in a school. You're a teacher and choose to exercise your 2nd Amendment rights? You elect to take training for those scenarios. Make it a tax deduction or have sheriff's train as part of protecting and serving.
Should Gunfire erupt, carry out your typical lockdown drill. Then stand ready for whatever comes to the door with a weapon, stand your ground if it breeches the door.
If the shots are coming from the outside in, and you have an opportunity. Stand your ground. Want to bend a little and say use a "smart" device like an rfid chip, or a fingerprint recognition interface to unlock the trigger? We can do that specifically for teachers. If being disarmed by students is a worry. Extend a law that would cause a student to be charged as an adult for attempted murder. 1 count per person in the room.

If you carry it concealed like I do, you won't print or have a bulge. Then again I'm not fat, nor do I wear skin tight clothing. I carry 2 pistols in my waistband and spare magazines for both. Could have a magazine failure. Floor plate get snagged and rip off dropping the spring and ammo. Take a shot through the hand and wipe out the magazine well and magazine switch hands eject the mag and it's parts, rip a spare mag out stand it up slam the pistol on it rack the slide on a door frame, ledge, table, whatever is nearest to catch the slide I'm back in business.

In your home. It's 3am. You wake up to a crash of a broken window or door being kicked in. Stand your ground.

The training I partake in, doesn't simply focus on shot placement.
Communication. It's key.

Say you're married, it's 3 am. Kids are asleep. Someone busts down the door. You fetch your weapon of choice, your spouse has theirs ready should you not succeed.
You go down the hallway, yelling get out of my house while your spouse goes to get the kids, hopefully you're not a fool and fix a flashlight to whatever it is you're carrying instead of shooting blindly in the dark...

Bad guy is armed? Stand your ground. But before you return to where your spouse is waiting. You'd better have a phrase or password before entering or coming near there. Your spouse is going to be tuned up adrenaline flowing and ready to shoot whatever comes within sight of where they are.

But. I will say this. You own what you shoot. Select your ammo and weapon choice wisely. You own whatever your bullet hits. Shoot through a wall and strike the neighbors house? You're responsible for whatever that bullet hits. Choose wisely.
I'd suggest subsonic and a suppressor as well as you won't be going deaf nearly as bad as a standard bang. Your ears will still ring but you won't be deaf.


As I've said before. It's not pleasant but it would work. What scumbags want to do to others isn't pleasant either. Remove the laws and incentives that protect them. They'll be the ones begging for firearm legislation as its cutting into their enterprise.
I'd say, lift all restrictive firearms laws that infringe on rights.
The most violent cities with the highest rates of homicide, all those areas to have access to firearms. And arrest those that come back denied for trying to purchase a weapon when they legally cant. 30 years minimal.

In an urban or city environment, make it illegal to discharge a weapon within the limits unless it's in defense of life or property. Seems hypocritical to allow firearms to Chicago Baltimore etc etc but if gunshots are ringing out, it damn sure isn't because someone's target practice is going on in an alley way at 2 or 3 am...

I'm not suggesting gun down dope dealers and gang members in cold blood. But if they present a clear and evident danger by all means, stand your ground.
The only policy I see laid out in this fascinating narrative is the expansion of stand your ground laws, expanding laws preventing violent felons from having guns, making training tax deductible, and arming teachers. That’s it? That’s the foolproof solution? Are you counting “when gunfire erupts, remain calm” and “make it suck to be a scumbag” as public policy? Lol

I thought you had some grand plan to deal with psychos and criminals

 
Old 11-17-2017, 06:38 AM
 
Location: PSL
8,224 posts, read 3,497,598 times
Reputation: 2963
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEPLimey View Post
The only policy I see laid out in this fascinating narrative is the expansion of stand your ground laws, expanding laws preventing violent felons from having guns, making training tax deductible, and arming teachers. That’s it? That’s the foolproof solution? Are you counting “when gunfire erupts, remain calm” and “make it suck to be a scumbag” as public policy? Lol

I thought you had some grand plan to deal with psychos and criminals
By giving the ability to exercise your 2nd Amendment rights instead of relying on police to do it for you.
 
Old 11-17-2017, 06:39 AM
 
Location: Long Island
57,294 posts, read 26,206,502 times
Reputation: 15645
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY_refugee87 View Post
Your opinion of Australias measure differs significantly.



Paranoia?
Who wants a ban or limitation? That's why we can't have reasonable discussion.
Then there's others who proudly announce they'll elect politicians to "come for our guns"
Because it's already been stated that any gun restriction however small is only the first step in a total ban.


Quote:
Originally Posted by NY_refugee87 View Post
I did-to get an understanding of your sides argument. And it has been proven it isn't the concern of public safety no to preserve life. It's okay to sacrifice 35k because society and economy.

My point stands without any challenge.

You only fear what's being reported.
Widespread deaths pertaining to drugs, cars, no biggie.
The formation of new biological weapons. No biggie.
Guns. Big problem.

Your side of the argument is so flawed it's not even funny.

You don't focus on what matters. Incentive and intent.
Your side focuses solely on the implement.

You don't seek to save lives what so ever.

Those bent on chaos fury destruction will simply find ways around the laws. Or simply change their implement.

Then what?

Take guns, get knives. Stabbing rates increase. Okay then what? Ban assault knives? Regulate to a certain fixed blade length and declare certain class of knives as assault knives? Then steak knives? Then require background checks on silverware purchases? Then when you've had enough plastic knives? Pre cut food since we can't trust knives?

Then transition to other implements. A car a truck mows down a crowd of people? Matching or exceeding vegas? Then what? Back ground checks before car purchases? Declare a certain platform of vehicle as an assault vehicle? Reduce fuel tank capacity?

Household cleaning agents. Gasoline. So on and so forth.


You don't see the gigantic flaw in your logic.
You don't focus on removing the incentive nor deterring the intent.
The implement will change.

If only we could come to an agreement to remove incentive and intent, and make criminals and the insane as scared of guns as you all are...
Already been beaten to death but the point is we need things like cars in our every day life, and when something is being misused or unsafe then we take action. The DWI laws that resulted in fewer deaths on our highways, safety regulations on pools and other appliances changed our lives. Guns are not the only problem but when it comes to any type of change in regulation it is a non-starter.
 
Old 11-17-2017, 06:40 AM
 
9,254 posts, read 3,586,584 times
Reputation: 4852
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY_refugee87 View Post
By giving the ability to exercise your 2nd Amendment rights instead of relying on police to do it for you.
Expand on this. We already have the ability to exercise our Seond Amendment rights. Do you vigilantism?
 
Old 11-17-2017, 06:44 AM
 
Location: Morrison, CO
34,231 posts, read 18,584,601 times
Reputation: 25802
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEPLimey View Post
Expand on this. We already have the ability to exercise our Seond Amendment rights. Do you vigilantism?
Legal self defense of yourself, and your family is NOT VIGILANTISM. It is SELF DEFENSE. Nobody is OK with people roaming the streets looking to shoot criminals, but when they attack you violently, and/or enter your home illegally we have a right to defend ourselves here in the U.S.
 
Old 11-17-2017, 06:46 AM
 
9,254 posts, read 3,586,584 times
Reputation: 4852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilot1 View Post
Legal self defense of yourself, and your family is NOT VIGILANTISM. It is SELF DEFENSE. Nobody is OK with people roaming the streets looking to shoot criminals, but when they attack you violently, and/or enter your home illegally we have a right to defend ourselves here in the U.S.
Nearly every state has a stand your ground law, whether or not written in statute. Every state permits the use of firearms to defend against home invasion. I want to know what this great, perfect solution to gun violence is other than codifying what already exists.
 
Old 11-17-2017, 06:49 AM
 
Location: PSL
8,224 posts, read 3,497,598 times
Reputation: 2963
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEPLimey View Post
Expand on this. We already have the ability to exercise our Seond Amendment rights. Do you vigilantism?
National stand your ground with no duty to retreat = giving the individual the ability to act with impunity to thwart the threats as they arrise instead of waiting for police to arrive for them to handle it.

Until there is technology that can predict exactly who and when they want to carry out heinous acts, and detain them long before they can carry out their evil, the solution is to have a society ready and willing to protect themselves and others.
 
Old 11-17-2017, 06:56 AM
 
Location: PSL
8,224 posts, read 3,497,598 times
Reputation: 2963
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight View Post
Because it's already been stated that any gun restriction however small is only the first step in a total ban.




Already been beaten to death but the point is we need things like cars in our every day life, and when something is being misused or unsafe then we take action. The DWI laws that resulted in fewer deaths on our highways, safety regulations on pools and other appliances changed our lives. Guns are not the only problem but when it comes to any type of change in regulation it is a non-starter.
Exactly my point, you're not concerned on the basis of preserving life. You're okay with and can justify 35k deaths for people to have the privilege to own and operate vehicles.

If the media reported the death rates and plastered car accident deaths and photos/videos of such, maybe your attitude would certainly change about automobiles.
Since it isnt, and there's no inflammatory reporting on vehicle accidents such as assault vehicle was used to slay 86 in Nice France, or 2 toddlers and their mother were mowed down by an assault vehicle, equipped with a high capacity fuel tank etc etc You can justify the sacrifice of 35k for vehicle related deaths.
 
Old 11-17-2017, 07:11 AM
 
24,411 posts, read 23,070,474 times
Reputation: 15018
Its a good thing nobody is trying to ban women from owning firearms and making them vulnerable to these kinds of assaults.
 
Old 11-17-2017, 07:18 AM
 
Location: Charlotte
3,869 posts, read 4,080,558 times
Reputation: 2378
The 2nd isn't going anywhere, guns will never be confiscated..........move on everyone, nothing to see here.
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