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Between federal, state and local laws, the United States has over 20,000 laws on the books pertaining to firearms. Exactly none of them prevented this shooting, so by all means, give me an example that a) prevents this shooting and b) does so without violating the US Constitution.
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Originally Posted by Retroit
We also need to treat the mentally ill better. Lack of parent involvement plays a big part, especially in this Florida case as there are no parents (he was adopted and both adoptive parents are deceased). Hollywood and video games play a big part in brainwashing people, especially the mentally weak.
So what would you suggest? Government control of families? Government censorship of speech/expression that is considered violent, like a 2nd grader being suspended for chewing a PopTart into the shape of a pistol and being suspended for 3 days as a result? (Actually happened)
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Originally Posted by Retroit
Why didn’t this happen 50 years ago?
The massive welfare state was in its infancy 50 years ago, so we had only just started seeing each other as resources for our personal consumption. Also, divorce, fatherless households and lack of discipline in the lives of young men in particular were all much more rare 50 years ago.
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Originally Posted by Retroit
Were semi-automatic weapons prevalent 50 years ago?
Not prevalent, but available. Prior to 1984, fully automatic weapons were legal for sale.
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Originally Posted by Retroit
What percentage of kids grew up in broken homes 50 years ago?
What was the most violent TV show 50 years ago? Cowboys and Indians shooting revolvers out west?
Were violent movies prevalent 50 years ago?
There were no video games 50 years ago.
There were mental hospitals (asylums) 50 years ago.
Again, these bullet points suggest that in order to deal with gun violence, we have to use government to engineer American behavior. What would you suggest?
All of the solutions offered when these shootings occur involve taking away our rights. Rights that we've had for centuries, without these shootings happening like they do today. What has changed in our society? Why can't we handle our rights in a civilized manner anymore? Maybe John Adams said it best:
"Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious People. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other."
Maybe our society has (d)evolved to the point where we must either accept that these kinds of incidents are going to happen from time to time, or accept that we are no longer fit to hold the rights our forefathers held. A shame either way.
I think reasonable gun regulations are necessary. We also need to treat the mentally ill better. Lack of parent involvement plays a big part, especially in this Florida case as there are no parents (he was adopted and both adoptive parents are deceased). Hollywood and video games play a big part in brainwashing people, especially the mentally weak.
Why didn’t this happen 50 years ago?
Were semi-automatic weapons prevalent 50 years ago?
What percentage of kids grew up in broken homes 50 years ago?
What was the most violent TV show 50 years ago? Cowboys and Indians shooting revolvers out west?
Were violent movies prevalent 50 years ago?
There were no video games 50 years ago.
There were mental hospitals (asylums) 50 years ago.
Yes semi-autos were widely used 50 years ago. I had one in elementary school.
The mental hospitals stared getting closed late 60s to early 70s, same time mass shootings increased.
What was the most violent TV show 50 years ago? Cowboys and Indians shooting revolvers out west?
watch "The Rifleman" with Chuck Connors.
There were many broken homes.
Violent movies were very common.
It ain't rocket science; a culture obsessed with guns and little access to mental health treatment.
Yep. And what do we do about it? We make sure no laws are written that could even minimally restrict access to guns by people who are mentally ill. Nope, the 2nd Amendment never said anything about mental competence, so it's every nutjob's right to own as many guns as he wants.
Then we make sure to cut access to healthcare for those mentally ill people, because, you know, that makes sense.
Unfortunately, Columnbine started a cultural fascination with school shootings among young people in this country. There is no way to unring that bell. I think we are doing what needs to be done. The problem is that the government is not doing its job. The FBI was warned about this kid; everyone knew what he was going to do, and the government failed to act.
All of the solutions offered when these shootings occur involve taking away our rights. Rights that we've had for centuries, without these shootings happening like they do today. What has changed in our society? Why can't we handle our rights in a civilized manner anymore? Maybe John Adams said it best:
"Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious People. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other."
Maybe our society has (d)evolved to the point where we must either accept that these kinds of incidents are going to happen from time to time, or accept that we are no longer fit to hold the rights our forefathers held. A shame either way.
Rights can change. The world has changed. The constitution was written a very long time ago when the world was entirely different.
I think using the rights argument against changes is as weak as those who say to abolish guns altogether. If you can't simply admit something has to change then you're just wrong. And the right BS is way overused. Peoples toes will have to get stepped on with change, toes on both sides of the fence.
Hey, gun fetishers, you don't need to pull out the NRA talking points. You won. You have your guns and they're not going anywhere. You can have as many as you want with cop killer bullets, too.
Gun massacres will continue. There will be another one within a couple months. We'll all talk about it for a day and a half, politicians will offer their "thoughts and prayers," the NRA will strike more fear and send more money to Congress, and then we'll all get back to normal because we accept all this. Kids are collateral damage and will not interfere with your rights.
Yep. And what do we do about it? We make sure no laws are written that could even minimally restrict access to guns by people who are mentally ill. Nope, the 2nd Amendment never said anything about mental competence, so it's every nutjob's right to own as many guns as he wants.
Then we make sure to cut access to healthcare for those mentally ill people, because, you know, that makes sense.
That's American logic when it comes to guns.
Then how do you account for all the mass shootings in Europe, Scandinavia, Asia, and elsewhere where guns are banned, illegal, or a severely limited?
Unfortunately, Columnbine started a cultural fascination with school shootings among young people in this country. There is no way to unring that bell. I think we are doing what needs to be done. The problem is that the government is not doing its job. The FBI was warned about this kid; everyone knew what he was going to do, and the government failed to act.
Why does a 19 year old have automatic weapons? Who failed there?
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