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Very mature and you think you are so above us in here. How dare the mod put this post in here. You are just p!$$ed because you did have everyone agreeing with you here.
Actually, it was a very mixed discussion before, but without the usual BS you see in the P&OC forum. There are also a million and one different healthcare threads in here, so this thread could very easily get "lost".
Anyway, you don't like Michael Moore; you don't like Sicko. That's your opinion, but I consider it to be a pretty decent film. It does the job by 1) highlighting the plight many of the under-insured and 2) showing us that UHC works just fine in other countries. My only criticism is that the image he portrayed of other countries was little too rosy, but he probably had to make it that way in order to get our attention, since we're so used to being told that UHC is a disaster, waiting lists, Socialism, Communism.....doom! He is a filmmaker, after all....Sicko was never meant to be just a boring documentary and Michael Moore is pretty good at what he does, IMO.
I will admit that the government can at times be inept but I will guarantee that a profit driven system will always try to cheat the customer if it gains profit by the fraud.
BTW- according to my calculator $400 billion divided by 43 million amounts to around $10,000 pr patient. Considering the age and infirmity of the Medicare population that is not much money. BTW – these people are uninsurable in the private market. So what do we do? Just let them be denied care so they will die off sooner? That is the business solution after all.
I tend to avoid this particular forum on CD, unless I see a specific thread that interests me. I'm all for opposing views, but a lot of people in here (on all sides) can be downright hostile....you cannot debate with a barking dog.
Regardless of how you feel about Micahel Moore and / or where you stand politically, i highly recommend the documentary "Sicko".
And, if after watching this film you don't feel strongly that the U.S. needs universal health care, .... well, i'd be amazed and i'd truly wonder why.
The health care system in this nation is insane and bordering on evil.
The health insurance companies are (evil!).
It's the worst capitalist poison i've ever seen or been aware of.
Outrageous.
I felt sick and sad in my heart while watching this ... sad for the victims of this system and sad for this country.
Regardless of how I feel about Michael Moore?
How about that I feel that he uses selective statistics, creative editing, leaves out relevant facts, uses manipulative tricks whenever he doesn't have a real argument, and completely hates virtually all criticism of him or his movies?
How about that? I tend to avoid getting my information from conmen. In case if you think I am just another right-wing nut who is railing against Michael Moore because he has different beliefs, no. I used to quite like him despite the differences in opinion, I even own Bowling Columbine that I purchase inspite of his views on gun control and I also own two of his books. It was rather the fact that man has a nasty habit of using people for his own gain, ever notice how many people he has interviewed hate his guts because he either outright lied about what they were going to be interviewed about or he cut out relevant excerpts of their interview (like the entire five day waiting period in that bit where he gets a gun in the bank and the bank manager's response to his question of whether or not it is a good idea to hand out guns in a bank). Or how he tried to paint Charlton Heston a racist because he (rather passingly) mentioned that the US has several large minority groups that suffer from a number of social problems and that they commit and suffer from a disproportionate amount of violent crime and that most European countries do not have minority groups with such problems on as large of a scale and that might explain why the US has a murder rate that is between twice to four times as high as most Western nations. Now, "the minorities commit a lot of crimes" is a common argument among the stupid and racist, but Heston stated it a lot gingerly to than that and seemed to try to avoid saying something along those lines. The problem I have with Moore trying to turn him into a racist is that it is an argument not without its merits and that during the 50s and 60s Charlton Heston was a Civil Rights activist. He believed that blacks should be treated as equals during a time when that was actually controversal in much of the country and a belief that could get you killed and to have some two-bit hack like Moore try to make into Klansman to fan his little racist NRA fantasies is downright sick.
Ask your senator/rep. Do they like their government run plan? And while at it, also ask if they're on the same plan as the Gitmo detainees, better or worse.
If you think you will be treated the same as your "senator/rep" it's time to wake up from your dream!
I tend to avoid this particular forum on CD, unless I see a specific thread that interests me. I'm all for opposing views, but a lot of people in here (on all sides) can be downright hostile....you cannot debate with a barking dog.
Yeah, it's annoying that a thread can be moved.
Posting it on the health and wellness forum was appropriate.
This is not a forum i've spent anytime on and i definitely wouldn't have started a thread here and not because people disagree but because the energy/vibe over here is nasty.
How about that I feel that he uses selective statistics, creative editing, leaves out relevant facts, uses manipulative tricks whenever he doesn't have a real argument, and completely hates virtually all criticism of him or his movies?
How about that? I tend to avoid getting my information from conmen. In case if you think I am just another right-wing nut who is railing against Michael Moore because he has different beliefs, no. I used to quite like him despite the differences in opinion, I even own Bowling Columbine that I purchase inspite of his views on gun control and I also own two of his books. It was rather the fact that man has a nasty habit of using people for his own gain, ever notice how many people he has interviewed hate his guts because he either outright lied about what they were going to be interviewed about or he cut out relevant excerpts of their interview (like the entire five day waiting period in that bit where he gets a gun in the bank and the bank manager's response to his question of whether or not it is a good idea to hand out guns in a bank). Or how he tried to paint Charlton Heston a racist because he (rather passingly) mentioned that the US has several large minority groups that suffer from a number of social problems and that they commit and suffer from a disproportionate amount of violent crime and that most European countries do not have minority groups with such problems on as large of a scale and that might explain why the US has a murder rate that is between twice to four times as high as most Western nations. Now, "the minorities commit a lot of crimes" is a common argument among the stupid and racist, but Heston stated it a lot gingerly to than that and seemed to try to avoid saying something along those lines. The problem I have with Moore trying to turn him into a racist is that it is an argument not without its merits and that during the 50s and 60s Charlton Heston was a Civil Rights activist. He believed that blacks should be treated as equals during a time when that was actually controversal in much of the country and a belief that could get you killed and to have some two-bit hack like Moore try to make into Klansman to fan his little racist NRA fantasies is downright sick.
See, where I'd butt heads with Mr. Moore would be on the issue of gun control -- I am very much pro-gun (believe it or not).
Yeah, it's annoying that a thread can be moved.
Posting it on the health and wellness forum was appropriate.
This is not a forum i've spent anytime on and i definitely wouldn't have started a thread here and not because people disagree but because the energy/vibe over here is nasty.
Perhaps it would have been better placed in the entertainment/movies thread, despite the fact that it's more of a documentary.
See, where I'd butt heads with Mr. Moore would be on the issue of gun control -- I am very much pro-gun (believe it or not).
So I am. But I can still like people I disagree with. For example, I would only agree with Ted Nugent on meat and guns (Booze? No. Smoking? No. Legalization of drugs? No. War on Terror? Sorta, but he's too extreme), but I would still love to spend a day with him and I'd think he'd be a blast (no pun intended) to be around.
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You are just p!$$ed because you did have everyone agreeing with you here.
