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It wouldn't surprise me at all to find out that some communities start taking Diwali as an official holiday instead of an excused absence. When I did a Google search, I did see that some other countries with have started closing schools for Diwali. Where I work it is not a holiday for everyone yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if it became one.
When I Googled on the the Jewish holidays, I saw that there were schools around the country that were closing for the holidays. I assume those are in districts with large Jewish populations.
What I'm arguing is that school districts need to be responsive to the realities of the communities that they serve. While I don't want religious celebrations in the public schools, I see no reason why the schools can't make reasonable accommodations for the religious practices of the communities they serve. As I stated previously, this may be tougher when the students represent a small minority of the community, but I think accommodations can and should be made.
Keeping our Communities Informed about our Customs: Diwali, by Sanchay Jain | Tattva (http://www.hinduyuva.org/tattva-blog/2008/11/keeping-our-communities-informed/ - broken link)
Do those school districts that serve predominantly Jewish students also get the Christmas holiday off as well? Do those schools not cater to the minority of students that are Christian in that particular school (you claimed Christian students were a minority in the school(s) you referenced) So if that school can cater to a minority of students who are Christian then why can't other schools cater to a minority of students who Jewish, Hindu, Muslim, Buddhist and close their school for holidays as well? You are essentially arguing it's okay to allow schools to close for Jewish, Hindu and other religious holidays only if their students make up a sizable portion but schools should always be closed for Christmas regardless if their Christian student population makes up a minority. Do you feel that is fair?
The point I'm making is that schools don't close for Christmas out of accomodation as you are arguing. If that was the reason then they would stay open in districts in which schools had a minority of Christians. Christmas is a nationally recognized holiday and will be embraced by all schools regardless if its student body consists of a minority of Christian students. That is evidence that our culture embraces and imposes Christianity on a large scale. That's why I find this post to be silly and irrelevant. If anyone can claim there is a war against their faith, it's non-Christians including aetheists and agnostics. I think our country is becoming more educated, gaining more exposure to religious minorities and are increasing tolerance for these other faiths by trying to eliminate religious symbols from schools and other govt sponsored activities. I don't see it as a war on Christmas but rather an embracing of the American ideal namely the separation of church and state and respect for those who may not be of Christian faith.
And we've only addressed schools. What about the post office? It's a government entity. Does it close for Yom Kippur, Ramadan and Diwali? They certainly close on Christmas and Easter. Do they close in sizable Jewish communities to accomodate their community?
Last edited by azriverfan.; 10-08-2009 at 03:15 PM..
Are you arguing this is generally accepted practice in the country even among areas with significant Jewish populations because this occurred at your school? What about other religions. Do schools in New Jersey with heavy Indian populations shut down for Diwali?
Nope I live in Edison, NJ one of the most predominate towns for Indians and the schools are NOT closed but they are closed for some Jewish ones, very odd.
Nope I live in Edison, NJ one of the most predominate towns for Indians and the schools are NOT closed but they are closed for some Jewish ones, very odd.
Agreed but now you have to convince WilliamSmyth who would believe otherwise
Do those school districts that serve predominantly Jewish students also get the Christmas holiday off as well? Do those schools not cater to the minority of students that are Christian in that particular school (you claimed Christian students were a minority in the school(s) you referenced) So if that school can cater to a minority of students who are Christian then why can't other schools cater to a minority of students who Jewish, Hindu, Muslim, Buddhist and close their school for holidays as well? You are essentially arguing it's okay to allow schools to close for Jewish, Hindu and other religious holidays only if their students make up a sizable portion but schools should always be closed for Christmas regardless if their Christian student population makes up a minority. Do you feel that is fair?
The point I'm making is that schools don't close for Christmas out of accomodation as you are arguing. If that was the reason then they would stay open in districts in which schools had a minority of Christians. Christmas is a nationally recognized holiday and will be embraced by all schools regardless if its student body consists of a minority of Christian students. That is evidence that our culture embraces and imposes Christianity on a large scale. That's why I find this post to be silly and irrelevant. If anyone can claim there is a war against their faith, it's non-Christians including aetheists and agnostics. I think our country is becoming more educated, gaining more exposure to religious minorities and are increasing tolerance for these other faiths by trying to eliminate religious symbols from schools and other govt sponsored activities. I don't see it as a war on Christmas but rather an embracing of the American ideal namely the separation of church and state and respect for those who may not be of Christian faith.
And we've only addressed schools. What about the post office? It's a government entity. Does it close for Yom Kippur, Ramadan and Diwali? They certainly close on Christmas and Easter. Do they close in sizable Jewish communities to accomodate their community?
I think you are entirely misreading my posts.
First off, in White Plains when I was there, the Jewish population in the public schools was not the majority. They were a large minority (30%-40%). Christians were in the majority. Yes, White Plains also had a Winter/Christmas break.
I don't think White Plains is "catering" to a religious minority when they close for Jewish Holidays. I think they are being practical, because a large segment, not the majority, of students would not be in attendance.
I think each district needs to decide for themselves when it just doesn't make sense to open the school on a particular day. I think in the vast majority of school districts there will continue to be a winter break centered around Christmas time because if the schools were open there would be low attendance.
I have no problems with schools making accommodations for small religious population groups. If a school had 1,000 Christians and a single Jewish person then perhaps it doesn't make sense to close the school for Jewish Holidays. If a school had 1,000 Hindu students and a single Christian student then perhaps it wouldn't make sense to close around Christmas. In both cases, I would argue that the school district should make accommodations (excused absence, no critical testing, etc) for that single student.
Originally Posted by obo Who cares what the other religions think. Christmas has been a part of this country and our history since the beginning. It's just tough if the other religions don't like it.
We need to stop all of this "let's be fair to the other religions" crap when it comes to something that has been part of the American culture since the beginning."""""
I answer that it hasn't been around since the beginning.
Quote:
Originally Posted by roysoldboy
I think that an explanation of the B. part of your post may be necessary since you seemed rather adamant. Could you please explain what you meant?
"""""The pilgrims, English separatists that came to America in 1620, were even more orthodox in their Puritan beliefs than Cromwell. As a result, Christmas was not a holiday in early America. From 1659 to 1681, the celebration of Christmas was actually outlawed in Boston. Anyone exhibiting the Christmas spirit was fined five shillings. By contrast, in the Jamestown settlement, Captain John Smith reported that Christmas was enjoyed by all and passed without incident.
After the American Revolution, English customs fell out of favor, including Christmas. In fact, Congress was in session on December 25, 1789, the first Christmas under America’s new constitution. Christmas wasn’t declared a federal holiday until June 26, 1870. """
Now, I don't have a link but I don't think the Native Americans had Christmas in any form.
Next:[quote=roysoldboy;11102481]Which colony was established first, Jamestown or Plymouth Rock?
I hardly think that the people of that day had a lot of time to celebrate since it was very hard to survive, however I don't think that the Indians had a whole lot to do with that Congressional declaration either.[/quote
What was wrong with Christmas Break like it was for the whole 20 years I went to school and the 28 that I taught? The PC cadre got hold of it and they just had to see that kind of thing as nasty because it might hurt the feelings of Muslims, Jews, or atheists. All those years it worked and then PC got here.
So, as a christian, you don't believe in being considerate of anyone who isn't you.....did Jesus feel that way????
In New York City, after much intense lobbying by Muslim groups, the City Council passed a resolution that would allow schools in the largest school system in the country to close on two Muslim holy days. This resolution required the approval of Mayor Michael Bloomberg and the mayor has refused to give that approval.
His argument is that the schools cannot close for the religious holidays of everyone, that the addition of the Muslim observances would be the start of a "slippery slope". However the New York schools already close, and thereby recognize, Christmas and, through the scheduling of "spring breaks", Good Friday and Easter, as well as the Jewish celebrations of Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur. Mayor Bloomberg's statement has a large measure of logic:
"One of the problems you have with a diverse city is that if you close the schools for every single holiday there won't be any school. Educating our kids requires time in the classroom and that's the most important thing to us."
Many of the determinations by school districts are based on the practical. Years ago we lived in Rockland County, New York, in the Village of Spring Valley. There was a substantial Jewish population in the area and, indeed that number has increased over the years. The result was that schools had substantial absences by both teachers and students. The number was so substantial that the school district simply closed the schools on the Jewish High Holy Days. It was considered to be a practical solution and not truly based on theology. In New York City, the number of Muslim students has been estimated at 12% and growing. For the most part, Christian and Jewish leaders and spokespersons have been supportive of the addition of Muslim holy days to the school closings.
Other states have found a workable approach. Dearborn, Mich., where nearly half of the 18,000 students are Muslim, is believed to be the first city to close school on Muslim holy days, a spokesman said. Several cities in New Jersey now close school on the holy days.
...
Not every Muslim believes that creating official school holidays would serve Muslims well. "The second the schools get into the business of officially recognizing holidays, it gets into establishing religion," a potential constitutional problem, said Hussein Rashid, an Islamic scholar at Hofstra University. How would the city establish criteria for granting Muslims days off, but not Hindus or other groups, he asked.
outlaw christmas to include that entire week..... seperation of church and state
outlaw halloween....again has religous connections
outlaw thanksgiving...again has religous connections
outlaw rosha shana, yom kipor, hannaka and passover..........again has religous connections.
outlaw vanentines day......again has religous connections.
outlaw columbus day.....who needs it
outlaw easter.....again has religous connections
outlaw all spring and winter recesses.....why should anyone be given off from work
outlaw may day (may 1st)
out law may 5th
outlaw martin luther king day..........he was a REVEREND....again has religous connections
and while we are at it outlaw saturday and sunday being weekends.....again has religous connections...the 2 sabbith days (one hebrew the other gentile)
and while we are at it outlaw any religous school....
and please outlaw TAXDAY, too
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