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What the a$$hole said was both disgusting and victim shaming. I have no idea how big your class is, but it stands to reason that there is probably a depressed person who was sitting there and probably someone who had either tried suicide or thought about trying it. I know just reading some of the comments here trigger me. I've tried it and I'm currenty feeling pretty low this morning. So I want to ask these clowns who think they know how I feel and why I am thinking about what I am thinking about how in the hell they think they can judge me?
Hey joe, if you ever want to chat you can message me. Sorry you are going through that.
I am not dumbfounded ONLY because I know how even doctors, lawyers, professors and myself can be ignorant of so many things.
Years ago I may have thought that, too...mainly because I heard it so often and knew nothing about it.
And let's not forget 'selfish'.
(Of course, they're selfish...they are miserably in mental pain and suffering!)
Hmm, wonder if s/he has a personal issue about this!
Somehow, s/he doesn't understand mental anguish or brain chemistry imbalance and the depth of depression people suffer with...which is surprising for a prof of psych....I probably would complain to a superior....
my style is an anonymous note to give a head's up saying I just want him/her to have a discussion on this topic
with colleagues.
Imagine sending people into the world thinking this is true!
Good you had the sense to be dumbfounded. Proud of you.
I believe suicide is murder. I understand that the current mainstream thinking is that suicide is "fine," and no one should be shamed for doing it - it's a very pro-suicide environment.
But the major religions are not "for" it - and even in metaphysical studies, Delores Cannon talks about the ill-effects on the people who do it in the afterlife (it's on YouTube for anyone interested).
It is not a solution, if you understand the long term issues - and it is very passive-aggressive to create a horror movie scene for your "loved ones" (use that term very loosely) to stumble upon.
There will be a lot of responses that the person is "mentally ill" and "can't help it" (suicide apologists).
Suicide has long been viewed by certain people as the "coward's" way out of things.
That is instead of facing the music/taking their lumps for whatever issues are going on in their lives, suicides simply "choose" to end things thus will never have to face consequences and or repercussions.
Of recent memory and famous would be Adolf Hitler, Eva Braun and many high ranking Nazi/German military officials who decided it was better to off themselves (and in a few cases along with their wives and children), than face what was coming to them as WWII drew to nasty close. Indeed a good number of German and Austrian citizens choose to end things rather than deal with the aftermath of WWII, including the Russians.
This being said persons commit suicide for a range of reasons; despondency, guilt, cowardice (as in preferring to die by one's own hands rather than face trial and execution or imprisonment for a crime or crimes). Then you have those who simply aren't in their right minds and want peace from whatever inner demons are tormenting.
Later reason is why nearly universally when there is a suicide either at corner's inquest or criminal investigation inquiries are made as to the mental state of the deceased. The Roman Catholic church makes an exception for the mortal sin of suicide if it is determined the deceased wasn't in their right mind, and thus cannot be fully held accountable for their actions.
That is a Western-centric point of view. In some cultures it is viewed as brave and honorable end to a life in certain circumstances.
I wonder if anyone would call Cpt. Lawrence Oates a coward, when after weeks of starvation, pain and unremitting bone-aching cold he realized there're was not enough remaining rations for his team to survive, and that his illness was jeopardizing everyone's survival, and that by killing himself he'd possibly give others a chance to live.
I wonder if the professor (of course he hasn't) ever lived with interminable intractable psychologically piercing physical pain which the doctors cannot treat and which invades his every waking hour and riddles his sleep and takes over his whole mind, pushing out every other thing. For a year. Go ask him then if it is the act of a coward or an understandable rational action that some might chose.
As for "coward" I bet my socks he'd last barely hours when being tortured for information by the Gestapo as they pull out his finger nails, crush his testi9cles with pliers and approach his face with a drill. He'd jump at the chance of a cyanide pill. Perhaps the simplistic mind can understand physical pain as applied to oneself but not the abstract mental pain of another.
And, finally of course, unless one has actually experienced the horror of deep chronic crushing depression, where words like coward or hero or basically any term has no meaning or consequence or influence on you at all, one is an arrogant idiot for even thinking that they can speak for the mind of the person in that situation. You might as well tell a schizophrenic to stop being so silly.
There are cowards who commit suicide, there are heroes who have done and will do the same, and there are people in between.
And then there are professors who are dingbats for sure.
That is a Western-centric point of view. In some cultures it is viewed as brave and honorable end to a life in certain circumstances.
I wonder if anyone would call Cpt. Lawrence Oates a coward, when after weeks of starvation, pain and unremitting bone-aching cold he realized there're was not enough remaining rations for his team to survive, and that his illness was jeopardizing everyone's survival, and that by killing himself he'd possibly give others a chance to live.
I wonder if the professor (of course he hasn't) ever lived with interminable intractable psychologically piercing physical pain which the doctors cannot treat and which invades his every waking hour and riddles his sleep and takes over his whole mind, pushing out every other thing. For a year. Go ask him then if it is the act of a coward or an understandable rational action that some might chose.
As for "coward" I bet my socks he'd last barely hours when being tortured for information by the Gestapo as they pull out his finger nails, crush his testi9cles with pliers and approach his face with a drill. He'd jump at the chance of a cyanide pill. Perhaps the simplistic mind can understands physical pain as applied to oneself but not the abstract mental pain of another.
And, finally of course, unless one has actually experienced the horror of deep chronic crushing depression, where words like coward or hero or basically any term has no meaning or consequence or influence on you at all, one is an arrogant idiot for even thinking that they can speak for the mind of the person in that situation. You might as well tell a schizophrenic to stop being so silly.
There are cowards who commit suicide, there are heroes who have done and will do the same, and there are people in between.
And then there are professors who are dingbats for sure.
Oh, do I ever agree with your post, but you said it better than I could have...
I don't judge those who commit suicide. I figure most people who commit suicide have reached the point where they are in such psychological pain -- and sometimes physical pain -- that death seems like the right option. They aren't trying to hurt anyone; they are trying to relieve their own pain. And/or they think the rest of the world would be better off if they were dead.
A close family member committed suicide. I know the effects suicide has on a family. But I don't blame him or judge him or think he was a "coward" or any of that. I grieve him and wish he were still alive. That's all.
My son's partner (who is actually studying to be a psychologist) found out last year that her father attempted suicide. She was absolute devastated, and rushed to be by his side as soon as she could - difficult for her, as she's in Canada in the middle of studies, and her family is in Europe. She told me later that when she talked to her dad, he tried to explain to her what was going through his mind when he made the attempt...and he described to her a psychological pain that was so intense, it overrode absolutely everything in his life. He loved his family, but in the depths of his pain he truly believed that if he were gone, they would be better off, and they would be happier. It is what often happens when someone is facing suicidal thoughts. They aren't doing it because they don't care about anyone else; often they are doing it because they DO care, or simply because the pain has become absolutely unbearable, and in their personal torment they believe that their existence is hurting those around them. Unfortunately, many people today still believe that it is nothing but a selfish act, when that is very often the furthest thing from the truth.
My sincerest condolences on your loss...
Last edited by bassetluv; 01-07-2019 at 09:10 AM..
What the a$$hole said was both disgusting and victim shaming. I have no idea how big your class is, but it stands to reason that there is probably a depressed person who was sitting there and probably someone who had either tried suicide or thought about trying it. I know just reading some of the comments here trigger me. I've tried it and I'm currenty feeling pretty low this morning. So I want to ask these clowns who think they know how I feel and why I am thinking about what I am thinking about how in the hell they think they can judge me?
Exactly. I think that many people simply project their own limited feelings onto the matter, whilst knowing absolutely nothing about the pain of another. The whole "well, I've been depressed but I've never been cowardly enough to try to kill myself, this guy is such a coward" attitude (read this one in another forum) is simply the person projecting their own experience. NO ONE can understand or know exactly how pain - physical or psychological - affects someone else; how deep it is, how devastating it is, how debilitating it is. I wish people would stop projecting and expecting everyone else to somehow conform to what they are feeling or experiencing.
I wouldn't wish the pain of a suicidal person upon anyone, but I do wish that people could be more empathetic, rather than sitting back in the easy arms of speculation and judgement, which appears to be 'the new normal' these days.
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Proud of you.
