Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
It would be best to use the search function. It allows you to find these posts I made about things I do not favor in Cary. I also posted that I am a little concerned about the rising crime rate in Cary. I call them as I see them. I have no agenda, just honesty.
Actually it works specifically for that reason. That is the whole point. People are picking Wake County as a place to live over Durham and in many cases it is because that is where they want to raise their children. More people are purposely picking Wake County over Durham, therefore there are more kids in the Wake than in Durham.
There are about 19 million people living in NYC. Does that mean that is where they want to raise their children?
The only source for really comparing schools is the report card system that evaluates every school in NC. This is mainly based on the end of grade testing and gives you some snapshot of the make up of the school. I am not saying this is a good way of evaluating or comparing schools but it is the only thing out there I have found.
Like PDXmom said there are plenty of people happy with durham public schools and the private schools are not without their fair share of problems. The reputation of durham public schools overall is not so good and the report cards for most of the schools stink.
More people are probably choosing Wake County over Durham County seeing that Wake County is so much bigger. You can't fit Wake County's population into Durham County, especially since Durham County has more people per square mile compared to Wake County, according to the 2000 Census.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tootie the Brave
There are about 19 million people living in NYC. Does that mean that is where they want to raise their children?
If trying to spin things in such a way that hides the reality of the situation makes anyone feel better, then that is up to them. The fact of the matter is that 99.999% of the people know this is the order of schools best to worst:
Chapel Hill
Wake County
Johnston County
Durham
It's just the way it is and people defending the Durham School System always have to make excuses for why grades don't count, graduation rate doesn't matter or any other measuring stick. There is plenty of room to add population in Durham. The fact is that most people that have public education as their first and major concern will typically choose Chapel Hill or Wake County....NOT Durham. Anything else is just smoke & mirrors, trying to make a diamond out of charcoal.
If trying to spin things in such a way that hides the reality of the situation makes anyone feel better, then that is up to them. The fact of the matter is that 99.999% of the people know this is the order of schools best to worst:
Chapel Hill
Wake County
Johnston County
Durham
It's just the way it is and people defending the Durham School System always have to make excuses for why grades don't count, graduation rate doesn't matter or any other measuring stick. There is plenty of room to add population in Durham. The fact is that most people that have public education as their first and major concern will typically choose Chapel Hill or Wake County....NOT Durham. Anything else is just smoke & mirrors, trying to make a diamond out of charcoal.
I am not trying to spin anything. I don't have any children, so I am not attempting to trump up any one county over another.
The other thing is this, Chapel Hill is not a county. There is the Orange County Public School System and then there is the Chapel Hill-Carboro School System. I am quite sure that Wake County has more IB schools any other region you mentioned.
(Once again, it would help me if I could be provided a source for your "99.999%" of what peple feel are the best schools. And I mean an actual scientific survey from a reputable publication. )
I am not dismissing the fact that many parents want their kids to go to the best schools in the area; I have the same mentality. But to knock Durham County's school system is not beneficial to the students there and whose parents don't have the choice or means to pick up their children and move somewhere else.
I have many friends who went through the DPS. What about Riverside High School? Have you seen the accolades for this school?
I will always backup DPS because of the children. If we all say they ALL fail because of the schools in which they are in, then that does no benefit to them. Wake County has the highest number of certified teachers in the state. Maybe we should have them partner with teachers in the DPS to get them certified. Maybe there could be volunteers from other counties to assist the students' learning. Yes, some people may dismiss Durham County schools as poor or not as good as other counties, but that doesn't mean they are any less important.
The point is this: assumptions and people's biases are being displayed in this thread. Saying that "99.999%" of people feel a certain way is unbelievable without a source. Not even Wikipedia or WRAL can make such a claim.
I am not trying to spin anything. I don't have any children, so I am not attempting to trump up any one county over another.
The other thing is this, Chapel Hill is not a county. There is the Orange County Public School System and then there is the Chapel Hill-Carboro School System. I am quite sure that Wake County has more IB schools any other region you mentioned.
(Once again, it would help me if I could be provided a source for your "99.999%" of what peple feel are the best schools. And I mean an actual scientific survey from a reputable publication. )
I am not dismissing the fact that many parents want their kids to go to the best schools in the area; I have the same mentality. But to knock Durham County's school system is not beneficial to the students there and whose parents don't have the choice or means to pick up their children and move somewhere else.
I have many friends who went through the DPS. What about Riverside High School? Have you seen the accolades for this school?
I will always backup DPS because of the children. If we all say they ALL fail because of the schools in which they are in, then that does no benefit to them. Wake County has the highest number of certified teachers in the state. Maybe we should have them partner with teachers in the DPS to get them certified. Maybe there could be volunteers from other counties to assist the students' learning. Yes, some people may dismiss Durham County schools as poor or not as good as other counties, but that doesn't mean they are any less important.
The point is this: assumptions and people's biases are being displayed in this thread. Saying that "99.999%" of people feel a certain way is unbelievable without a source. Not even Wikipedia or WRAL can make such a claim.
I completely agree with you that we should not 'ignore' the Durham Schools, but rather work to make them better. That is a completely different subject, though. We are just talking about why some people choose not to live in Durham and the current state of the school system compared to surrounding areas is one big reason.
I completely agree with you that we should not 'ignore' the Durham Schools, but rather work to make them better. That is a completely different subject, though. We are just talking about why some people choose not to live in Durham and the current state of the school system compared to surrounding areas is one big reason.
CD, the reason you exasperate so many people on this forum is that you profess to be the all-knowing source of information for the Triangle.
Your opinion is your opinion, and you are entitled to it. However, you draw conclusions that are not entirely accurate.
Plenty of families are looking for a typical suburban existence and will be disproportionately drawn to Wake Co., Cary, or places like SW Durham. Nothing wrong with that.
For another, there are plenty of families who DO NOT value the same things as you and your family do. Nothing wrong with that, either. These families choose to make Durham their home because they prefer cities, prefer diverse places to live, or prefer living in mixed income communities.
To extrapolate schools as the DOMINANT factor in explaining population is, however, short-sighted.
When you claim that "99.999%" of people know something to be true, you are conflating the preferences and opinions of an admitted majority with some knowable absolute truth.
The schools in Durham are not "better" or "worse" than neighboring counties. Their population mix is different, from an SES perspective, but students do as well (or as badly) in Durham within their SES category as they do in Wake or Johnston Co.
The outcome for *individual students*, in other words, is -- at least as measured on EOY tests -- the same for students in Durham and Wake. The difference between the systems is the relative weight of each SES contributor to the broader population.
The one-to-four ranking you have made of schools does not, to my mind, reflect which school system is "better" or "worse." It reflects which system has more relative economic balance vs. which ones are more economically exclusive.
And further, I would not think one could (say) conflate Clayton's schools with Selma's even within Johnston Co.
....
CD, Durham to my mind is frankly a better place for the fact that many people do not like it.
The presence of conforming, traditionalist, chain-loving areas in Wake Co. offers a relief valve to people moving in from suburban areas. They are at home in Knightdale and Wake Forest and Clayton and Cary. Great!
Durham is (in large but not exclusive part) not like that. And if people from places that disproportionately choose Wake Co. -- places like Long Island, Worcester, Orlando, Houston -- were to come to Durham, they'd change it.
We don't want to look like Wake Co. We don't want to be Wake Co.
I'm proud that people from Manhattan, Brooklyn, Phila., Chicago, Atlanta, and Boston -- the real city, not its pretend fringes -- disproportionately choose Durham over Wake. That's because those are the kind of communities I would want to live in if I weren't here.
All of this shows up in how our communities aggregate up at top-line statistics.
These are the things that make use different. And we can celebrate our differences.
But they do not make us better.
Pointing to a numeric majority as proof of superiority is fascinating. A majority of Americans also prefer TV dinners to gourmet dining, CSI:Miami to Project Runway, and "X-Men" to "Slumdog Millionaire."
The majority isn't right. The majority also isn't wrong. It is, simply, a majority.
Tastes differ. I'm glad you're happy where you are. I'm also really happy you don't live in, and vote in, my community.
CD, the reason you exasperate so many people on this forum is that you profess to be the all-knowing source of information for the Triangle.
Your opinion is your opinion, and you are entitled to it. However, you draw conclusions that are not entirely accurate.
Plenty of families are looking for a typical suburban existence and will be disproportionately drawn to Wake Co., Cary, or places like SW Durham. Nothing wrong with that.
For another, there are plenty of families who DO NOT value the same things as you and your family do. Nothing wrong with that, either. These families choose to make Durham their home because they prefer cities, prefer diverse places to live, or prefer living in mixed income communities.
To extrapolate schools as the DOMINANT factor in explaining population is, however, short-sighted.
When you claim that "99.999%" of people know something to be true, you are conflating the preferences and opinions of an admitted majority with some knowable absolute truth.
The schools in Durham are not "better" or "worse" than neighboring counties. Their population mix is different, from an SES perspective, but students do as well (or as badly) in Durham within their SES category as they do in Wake or Johnston Co.
The outcome for *individual students*, in other words, is -- at least as measured on EOY tests -- the same for students in Durham and Wake. The difference between the systems is the relative weight of each SES contributor to the broader population.
The one-to-four ranking you have made of schools does not, to my mind, reflect which school system is "better" or "worse." It reflects which system has more relative economic balance vs. which ones are more economically exclusive.
And further, I would not think one could (say) conflate Clayton's schools with Selma's even within Johnston Co.
....
CD, Durham to my mind is frankly a better place for the fact that many people do not like it.
The presence of conforming, traditionalist, chain-loving areas in Wake Co. offers a relief valve to people moving in from suburban areas. They are at home in Knightdale and Wake Forest and Clayton and Cary. Great!
Durham is (in large but not exclusive part) not like that. And if people from places that disproportionately choose Wake Co. -- places like Long Island, Worcester, Orlando, Houston -- were to come to Durham, they'd change it.
We don't want to look like Wake Co. We don't want to be Wake Co.
I'm proud that people from Manhattan, Brooklyn, Phila., Chicago, Atlanta, and Boston -- the real city, not its pretend fringes -- disproportionately choose Durham over Wake. That's because those are the kind of communities I would want to live in if I weren't here.
All of this shows up in how our communities aggregate up at top-line statistics.
These are the things that make use different. And we can celebrate our differences.
But they do not make us better.
Pointing to a numeric majority as proof of superiority is fascinating. A majority of Americans also prefer TV dinners to gourmet dining, CSI:Miami to Project Runway, and "X-Men" to "Slumdog Millionaire."
The majority isn't right. The majority also isn't wrong. It is, simply, a majority.
Tastes differ. I'm glad you're happy where you are. I'm also really happy you don't live in, and vote in, my community.
CD, the reason you exasperate so many people on this forum is that you profess to be the all-knowing source of information for the Triangle.
Your opinion is your opinion, and you are entitled to it. However, you draw conclusions that are not entirely accurate.
Plenty of families are looking for a typical suburban existence and will be disproportionately drawn to Wake Co., Cary, or places like SW Durham. Nothing wrong with that.
For another, there are plenty of families who DO NOT value the same things as you and your family do. Nothing wrong with that, either. These families choose to make Durham their home because they prefer cities, prefer diverse places to live, or prefer living in mixed income communities.
To extrapolate schools as the DOMINANT factor in explaining population is, however, short-sighted.
When you claim that "99.999%" of people know something to be true, you are conflating the preferences and opinions of an admitted majority with some knowable absolute truth.
The schools in Durham are not "better" or "worse" than neighboring counties. Their population mix is different, from an SES perspective, but students do as well (or as badly) in Durham within their SES category as they do in Wake or Johnston Co.
The outcome for *individual students*, in other words, is -- at least as measured on EOY tests -- the same for students in Durham and Wake. The difference between the systems is the relative weight of each SES contributor to the broader population.
The one-to-four ranking you have made of schools does not, to my mind, reflect which school system is "better" or "worse." It reflects which system has more relative economic balance vs. which ones are more economically exclusive.
And further, I would not think one could (say) conflate Clayton's schools with Selma's even within Johnston Co.
....
CD, Durham to my mind is frankly a better place for the fact that many people do not like it.
The presence of conforming, traditionalist, chain-loving areas in Wake Co. offers a relief valve to people moving in from suburban areas. They are at home in Knightdale and Wake Forest and Clayton and Cary. Great!
Durham is (in large but not exclusive part) not like that. And if people from places that disproportionately choose Wake Co. -- places like Long Island, Worcester, Orlando, Houston -- were to come to Durham, they'd change it.
We don't want to look like Wake Co. We don't want to be Wake Co.
I'm proud that people from Manhattan, Brooklyn, Phila., Chicago, Atlanta, and Boston -- the real city, not its pretend fringes -- disproportionately choose Durham over Wake. That's because those are the kind of communities I would want to live in if I weren't here.
All of this shows up in how our communities aggregate up at top-line statistics.
These are the things that make use different. And we can celebrate our differences.
But they do not make us better.
Pointing to a numeric majority as proof of superiority is fascinating. A majority of Americans also prefer TV dinners to gourmet dining, CSI:Miami to Project Runway, and "X-Men" to "Slumdog Millionaire."
The majority isn't right. The majority also isn't wrong. It is, simply, a majority.
Tastes differ. I'm glad you're happy where you are. I'm also really happy you don't live in, and vote in, my community.
Here we go again, putting words in my mouth.
I never said it was the DOMINANT reason why anyone would choose not to live in Durham. I said for people who's number one concern is education, it is a big issue.
Please see how I said SOME people and ONE big reason, not EVERYONE and the DOMINANT reason.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlton Dude
We are just talking about why some people choose not to live in Durham and the current state of the school system compared to surrounding areas is one big reason.
The rest of the post is the typical spin that people need to put out there to explain away the failing grade given the Durham Public School System.
I never said it was the DOMINANT reason why anyone would choose not to live in Durham. I said for people who's number one concern is education, it is a big issue.
Please see how I said SOME people and ONE big reason, not EVERYONE and the DOMINANT reason.
The rest of the post is the typical spin that people need to put out there to explain away the failing grade given the Durham Public School System.
Spin? That is your rebuttal? And who is giving DPS this failing grade? Once again, a SOURCE would be beneficial. I like facts, not opinions and hyperbole. It is quite ironic that in this heated discussion concerning education, you cannot offer one concrete fact that substantiates your claim. And don't use Wikipedia since you failed to discuss the success of Riverside High School and Wikipedia does not have any pages concerning DPS's junior high and elementary schools.
I'm sure this will be considered "spin", but I'd like to point out that many people think education is something that can't be measured in EOGs, but instead in life experiences and richness.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
