Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
1.) You're free to make any interpretation you wish.
2.) A listing agent and the seller can agree on a different (called a variable) rate in the event that there is a different fee paid the listing agent for acting as dual agent; and a different rate to be paid to the listing agent in the event of an unrepresented buyer. Those are negotiated and added in the "Additional Terms" section, which I explained in my post.
All of the agreement between the listing agent and seller will be confidential. The only thing the listing agent has to disclose to the buyer agent is if there is a "variable" rate, and that is disclosed on the mls sheet in ARMLS.
Once again you are dodging the question. Of course seller and listing agent can specify "additional terms", but for simplicity lets stick with the standard AZ listing agreement.
Where in the AZ contract does it state that a seller pays less to a listing agent if there is no (or less) payment to a buyer broker?
It's pretty simple. In a standard listing agreement, seller agrees to pay listing agent a commission, unless otherwise specified (addendum to contract). This commission is independent of whether there is a payment to the buyers agent/broker. I have to assume that a well seasoned agent (that you claim to be) would know this, but I could be wrong.
Buyers agents pushing buyers to close when they don't want to? Agents who do that look like they are only looking for Pay day.
Mike, I don't understand what your above paragraph means in relation to my prior post, but I still say the new NC contracts have been very detrimental to the overall RE market . One would think with the economy such as it is, that the powers to be would be trying to make it easier on both buyer and seller to bring a house sale to fruition. I can't imagine an "average homeowner" or buyer being able to comprehend these contracts.
BTW, the completed Offer to Purchase that I read recently was 19 pages..
1. Attorney information and instructions 1 page
2. Offer to Purchase 10 pages
3. Residential Property Disclosure 2 pages
4. Lead Based Paint Disclosure 2 pages
5. Homeowner Association Addendum 1 page
6. Additional Provision Addendum 1 page
7. Seller Possession After closing 2 pages.
These pages were full of attorney legalese . I did notice in the above Offer to Purchase that there is a Disclaimer stating the "NCAR and NCBA make no representation as to the legal validity or adequacy of any provision of the form".. HMMMMMMMMM..
I totally agree that Sellers and Buyers alike should be given complete facts about any and every issue pertaining to a home sale, but to deliberately 'muddy' the water makes me think that some group/enitity/ has much more to gain than the Seller or Buyer, if you get my inference.
For the last few years, the buyers have been in the drivers seat. Bidding low, wanting all kinds of things done, backing out on a whim, etc.
Years earlier when it was a sellers market. Sellers asking high prices, getting buyers into bidding wars, refusing to do anything other then take it or leave it, backing out on a whim.
WOW...they sound alike when the market is in their favor.....LOL
Maybe there will now be a leveling/fairness in pricing and practices.
Buyers agents pushing buyers to close when they don't want to? Agents who do that look like they are only looking for Pay day.
Mike, I don't understand what your above paragraph means in relation to my prior post, but I still say the new NC contracts have been very detrimental to the overall RE market . One would think with the economy such as it is, that the powers to be would be trying to make it easier on both buyer and seller to bring a house sale to fruition. I can't imagine an "average homeowner" or buyer being able to comprehend these contracts.
BTW, the completed Offer to Purchase that I read recently was 19 pages..
1. Attorney information and instructions 1 page
2. Offer to Purchase 10 pages
3. Residential Property Disclosure 2 pages
4. Lead Based Paint Disclosure 2 pages
5. Homeowner Association Addendum 1 page
6. Additional Provision Addendum 1 page
7. Seller Possession After closing 2 pages.
These pages were full of attorney legalese . I did notice in the above Offer to Purchase that there is a Disclaimer stating the "NCAR and NCBA make no representation as to the legal validity or adequacy of any provision of the form".. HMMMMMMMMM..
I totally agree that Sellers and Buyers alike should be given complete facts about any and every issue pertaining to a home sale, but to deliberately 'muddy' the water makes me think that some group/enitity/ has much more to gain than the Seller or Buyer, if you get my inference.
Have a great day, Mike and Happy Selling!
My point was in response to your saying brokers should push harder for the parties to close. Brokers represent their parties, and that includes representation when a party decides to not close.
The Contract is the 10 pages.
The NC Residential Property and Owners Association Disclosure is 4 pages since the HOA addendum was incorporated into the disclosure form by the Commission.
Those are the only documents required to complete most transactions.
The other documents are optional, although the LBP disclosure is a federal mandate as much as a local requirement for homes built prior to 1978.
Seller possession after close and Additional Provisions addendum only serve to clarify additional terms brought by one of the parties, but are unused in a great many transactions.
Attorneys can close based on contract, particularly if there is no mortgage balance to be paid off on the house.
The real material change in volume of documents is the expansion of the Offer to Purchase and Contract which was expanded to incorporate instructions to consumers when the terms were simplified to make transactions easier.
Sales are up in the Triangle, and the simplification of the standard forms has not hampered that.
If you want to know what is in the AZ listing agreement download it from AAR.
I’ve seen the AZ listing agreement and your posts are very deceptive. Disappointing to see another CD agent who refuses to answer a simple question, particularly when they state they are on this forum to educate the public.
Lets summarize:
1) I stated that boilerplate listing agreements (including AZ) specify the commission that is due to listing agents. If the seller has a change of heart after a buyer has been delivered, the seller still owes the FULL commission (even if the sale does not occur)
2) You disagreed:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bill
The standard AZ listing contract specifies how much commission is being paid to the listing agent, and how much commission is being paid to the buyers agent.
In the AZ contract, if there is no sale (close of escrow) the buyers agent does not get paid. Since there is a specified amount in the listing agreement for the buyer, the listing agent would not get that portion.
You never mentioned anything about a additional addendum to release the seller from their obligation
3) I highlighted the fact that the seller owes the listing agent the FULL commission regardless of whether there is a buyers agent or not.
4) You then spin the topic off to additional addendums apparently unable to defend your initial statement.
So back to the original point...according to the standard AZ contract, seller defaults on a ready willing and able buyer, they owe their listing agent the FULL commission.
Do you still stand by your statement?
“Since there is a specified amount in the listing agreement for the buyer, the listing agent would not get that portion.â€
(I am thinking that Captain Bill and RE Skeptic might want to start a different thread? Then more RE people might find it and chime in.)
As the OP, I would just want to state the opinion that any contract that allows either side to back out with little to no oversight or penalty is just asking to be abused.
(I am thinking that Captain Bill and RE Skeptic might want to start a different thread? Then more RE people might find it and chime in.)
As the OP, I would just want to state the opinion that any contract that allows either side to back out with little to no oversight or penalty is just asking to be abused.
Contracts are only as good as the people who make them, and the attorneys they hire to litigate when they feel abused.
In any field.
As the OP, I would just want to state the opinion that any contract that allows either side to back out
with little to no oversight or penalty is just asking to be abused.
Of course; and I'll bet that question was settled by the 5th comment post in the thread.
I'll also bet that any warning for the buyer to have the advice of their own legal council
BEFORE signing any RE contracts was glossed over.
louise50, I wholeheartedly agree with you even though I have not personally read the documentation.
A seller does have the most to lose unless a contract is terminated very early on in a due diligence period. I can see having a one week period for no-reason-given withdrawal by the buyer, while the seller meanwhile can solicit additional offers and maybe even cancel the first contract himself if he gets a 'better' offer during the same time period. But after that? Only contingencies should pertain, and those would need to be satisified or withdrawn within a certain number of days before closing. Even if it were a sellers' market both parties would be better protected.
Horses, apologize for taking this thread on a detour. Regarding the NC contract...
I have been on both sides of the new DD contract in NC and I struggle to decide which side it favors. I do think it is an improvement from the last contract.
Each side has info that the other needs to investigate. The seller knows the home better than the buyer and it is only fair to give the buyer some time to inspect. The NC contract provides this in the DD period. However, the buyer knows their finances better that the seller and I don't think the DD should be lengthened to accommodate financing issues.
The DD phase of the contract clearly favors the buyer. It gives them an easy out (minus the DD monies they lose). Thus, the seller needs to negotiate a relatively short DD period (less than 3 weeks) with as high of a DD deposit as possible.This is probably where an experienced agent who truly understands the new NC contract can be of some value. That being said, I have worked with some very experienced agents who still dont fully understand the nuances of the contract. The seller should also hold strong on the DD deadline. I think there is a tendency to allow extensions to the DD when buyers dont complete their DD. This gives the buyer more time and works against the seller. If a buyer really wants a home, they will get things done during the initial, agreed upon DD.
However, once the DD period passes, all contingencies are removed in the contract moves into the EM phase. At this point the additional EM (above and beyond the DD money) is locked in and virtually impossible for the buyer to recover, short of the seller breaching contract. At this point, the contract swings in strong favor of the seller assuming they have negotiated a solid EM amount. Many other state contracts allow the buyer to walk at the last minute due to a financing contingency, the NC contract does not offer the buyer this easy out (there is no financing contingency). In this regard, I think the NC contract is better at protecting the seller in the later phases of the deal. In the end if a buyer is willing to lose lose their EM, there is not much a seller can do. That is why negotiating a high EM in NC is critical to the seller.
As a seller it is sometimes easier to get a higher EM if you break into additional phases. The buyer may be hesitant to fork out a high EM until the house is appraised, which can longer than inspections. In this case, negotiate a solid DD, followed by an additional EM that covers the extra week to get appraised. Once the appraisal is complete an additional EM should be delivered as the buyer should know whether they are ready to close the deal.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
