Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
FSBO - you stick a sign in the yard, you do not have an agent representing you, you can appear on Zillow and many other sites, but not the MLS or Realtor.com. Whether you agree to pay an agent compensation to produce the buyer of your home is immaterial.
MLS Entry Only - you have paid some amount of money to some brokerage to get your home onto the local MLS, and you have signed some type of representation agreement. Most of these agreements will plainly state that the representation is limited to taking the info you provide and putting it on the MLS. Most Sellers realize that by the time they get to this step, they will offer buyer agent members of that MLS some compensation. However, I do not believe that it is required to offer it; that could be MLS-city/market specific
MLS representation by agent - whether you pay the brokerage 1/2% for their services or 50%, there is an agreement in place for you to be represented in some fashion during the sale. The agreement spells out how much $, and what representation/services provided.
and that's all.
I can only speak to NC. In NC, our Buyers Agreement states our compensation, and that the Buyer agrees to pay it. And that we will FIRST seek it from a cooperating broker or the Seller. But that if none is made, the Buyer will then pay.
And most BUYERS do not want to get involved with directly paying the commission. We've been over all of this many times with you.
since we're getting the story secondhand from an anonymous person, there's no telling what the first post is supposed to mean, or which parts of it are accurate.
Surely the offending broker did try to get the sister to sign an agreement for compensation as a Buyer's agent. Whether he demanded that he represent the sister as well is purely speculative and doesn't fit with any of the Realtors' experiences.
Do numerous agents bombard FSBO's trying to get them to list with them? Of course. It's a lead source - you clearly want to sell your house. They want to represent you in the sale and get compensated for it.
Not sure that is true. Came across a listing last winter that offered a 0.0% commission. One of these auction operations. There may have been an alternate way to get paid but the listing was not interesting so we did not find out.
Well, there are REALTOR®-owned MLSs and there are third party MLSs.
NAR requires some cobrokerage compensation from compliant MLSs...
"Multiple listing services shall not publish listings that do not include an offer of compensation
expressed as a percentage of the gross selling price or as a definite dollar amount, nor shall
they include general invitations by listing brokers to other participants to discuss terms and
conditions of possible cooperative relationships. (Amended 11/96) "
FSBO - you stick a sign in the yard, you do not have an agent representing you, you can appear on Zillow and many other sites, but not the MLS or Realtor.com. Whether you agree to pay an agent compensation to produce the buyer of your home is immaterial.
MLS Entry Only - you have paid some amount of money to some brokerage to get your home onto the local MLS, and you have signed some type of representation agreement. Most of these agreements will plainly state that the representation is limited to taking the info you provide and putting it on the MLS. Most Sellers realize that by the time they get to this step, they will offer buyer agent members of that MLS some compensation. However, I do not believe that it is required to offer it; that could be MLS-city/market specific
MLS representation by agent - whether you pay the brokerage 1/2% for their services or 50%, there is an agreement in place for you to be represented in some fashion during the sale. The agreement spells out how much $, and what representation/services provided.
and that's all.
I can only speak to NC. In NC, our Buyers Agreement states our compensation, and that the Buyer agrees to pay it. And that we will FIRST seek it from a cooperating broker or the Seller. But that if none is made, the Buyer will then pay.
And most BUYERS do not want to get involved with directly paying the commission. We've been over all of this many times with you.
That's helpful. My only issue is that whether or not you offer to pay buyer's agent commission is not immaterial to this discussion. If a buyer's agent says (which they have) that they work with FSBOs, it's important to understand if that's all FSBOs or only those offering commissions. If a poster claims 'boycott' by buyer's agents, it's important to know if they offered commission and how that commission compares to other homes.
I have always agreed that most buyers do not want to pay their own commissions. Not an issue.
Question for clarification:
When you say that your buyer's agreement 'states your compensation', what do you mean? Since different properties are listed with different commission splits, your actual compensation is probably often not known at the time the buyer's agreement is signed. When and how does it become clear to your client what your actual compensation (i.e. what the buyer's agent is paying, including any bonuses and what the conditions are for those bonuses, etc) will be for each of the homes that are being proposed to him.
Well, there are REALTOR®-owned MLSs and there are third party MLSs.
NAR requires some cobrokerage compensation from compliant MLSs...
"Multiple listing services shall not publish listings that do not include an offer of compensation
expressed as a percentage of the gross selling price or as a definite dollar amount, nor shall
they include general invitations by listing brokers to other participants to discuss terms and
conditions of possible cooperative relationships. (Amended 11/96) "
GLVAR is a NAR MLS. And they did offer compensation of 0.0%. They may have offered a dollar or something as well. I only remember the listing because I thought it unusual enough that I showed it to my wife. May have as well been some offer in the agent remarks. I just tried to find it again but it has vanished into the great bit caldron. Too bad I did not think of it at the time or I would have flagged it.
Well, there are REALTOR®-owned MLSs and there are third party MLSs.
NAR requires some cobrokerage compensation from compliant MLSs...
"Multiple listing services shall not publish listings that do not include an offer of compensation
expressed as a percentage of the gross selling price or as a definite dollar amount, nor shall
they include general invitations by listing brokers to other participants to discuss terms and
conditions of possible cooperative relationships. (Amended 11/96) "
Sounds like 0% would be allowed then.
It seems to me that the reason for that text is to require listing agents to be clear as to the compensation on offer so that agents can first decide if they wish to work with it and how to prioritize it, etc. I.e. there are no surprises later and so that everyone gets the same terms.
I'm just a layman but it would seem that 0% would not be excluded from NAR MLS by that text.
That's helpful. My only issue is that whether or not you offer to pay buyer's agent commission is not immaterial to this discussion. If a buyer's agent says (which they have) that they work with FSBOs, it's important to understand if that's all FSBOs or only those offering commissions.
They didn't say they only worked with one type over another. And I'll repeat why it's immaterial below.
Quote:
If a poster claims 'boycott' by buyer's agents, it's important to know if they offered commission and how that commission compares to other homes.
There's no US-wide boycott. There's no NC-wide boycott. There's no Triangle NC boycott. And there's no boycott at either firm where I've worked - nor talk of one. There may be individual agents that "won't deal with FSBO's" (regardless of compensation). I can repeat that exactly 2 times have I come across a FSBO Seller that wouldn't pay the compensation at their given purchase price AND it was worth my Buyer still paying Price + Commission.
Quote:
I have always agreed that most buyers do not want to pay their own commissions. Not an issue.
I'm talking about the fact that we have agreements with Buyers, and part of those agreements states they are responsible for our compensation. At least in NC, as I stated.
Quote:
Question for clarification:
When you say that your buyer's agreement 'states your compensation', what do you mean? Since different properties are listed with different commission splits, your actual compensation is probably often not known at the time the buyer's agreement is signed. When and how does it become clear to your client what your actual compensation (i.e. what the buyer's agent is paying, including any bonuses and what the conditions are for those bonuses, etc) will be for each of the homes that are being proposed to him.
In NC, our standard pre-printed agreement has a blank for compensation. We write it in (or type, if you like) and then the Buyer signs it as part of the agreement.
If the compensation differs from that - bonuses, etc as you state - then we are REQUIRED to have the Buyer acknowledge that we're getting a bonus when we write the offer. Not after they go under contract. When they write the offer. And in NC, the agreement form says the Buyer agrees bonuses are OK, and earend by the agency.
And as I repeat, they acknowledge that THEY are responsible for paying us. And should the offered compensation be LESS than what's agreed to, they will make up the difference. That's why it is immaterial whether a FSBO offers compensation or not, or an entry-only does.
GLVAR is a NAR MLS. And they did offer compensation of 0.0%. They may have offered a dollar or something as well. I only remember the listing because I thought it unusual enough that I showed it to my wife. May have as well been some offer in the agent remarks. I just tried to find it again but it has vanished into the great bit caldron. Too bad I did not think of it at the time or I would have flagged it.
That happens all the time in my MLS. Usually, it's the limited service brokerages that do it. Nothing in the MLS software prevents you from entering the listing. However, if the listing is reported for violating the rules (or is discovered as a part of the MLS self-audit process) then the listing gets taken down.
Quote:
Originally Posted by just_because
Sounds like 0% would be allowed then.
It seems to me that the reason for that text is to require listing agents to be clear as to the compensation on offer so that agents can first decide if they wish to work with it and how to prioritize it, etc. I.e. there are no surprises later and so that everyone gets the same terms.
I'm just a layman but it would seem that 0% would not be excluded from NAR MLS by that text.
Just my opinion.
I'm not sure where you're getting that from. All listings in the MLS must offer cooperating compensation to a brokerage that brings a buyer to the transaction. As Mike's quote states, it needs to be expressed in the form of a percentage or a fixed number.
I went back and checked a few hundred. The lowest I could find is 1%. That is reasonable common on auction properties. Non auction appear virtually total 3% or 2.5%. There was one 2% in a 100 or so non auction condominiums.
So I am inclined to believe the one I saw was a fluke.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
