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Noela, I don't have enough energy or time to keep this convesation going, but I will make one final remark. I think a husband or wife who commits adultery should be punished severely. Also, I am not against divorce when this situation occurs. Personally, if a woman was married 10 times and was cheated on their husbands 10 times, even though she was faithful, I would still marry her and her heart is clean in my book.
I do hope some of the better moral teachings of your Catholic upbringing rub off on you, even if you don't believe in a God or even think God exists. I do think marriage is a sacred bond. That is the person you share everything with and that must be special. There is no guarantees that you won't be hit by a bus after your wedding day either. However, we must have faith and do our part to make things work. That's all we can do.
Sex without love IMO is dirtiness. What do you gain by the hour of entertainment? You risk STDs, pregnancy and even risk alienation from the partner. People also get falsely attached to people they have sex with sometimes. Which leads to people getting very hurt and heartbroken when they find out the partner used them just for sex. We are not dogs, sex is not just a breeding tool, we are spiritual/emotionally-complex creatures and sex is for a more important cause, for love and bonding.
I hope you and your SO (I hope to be your husband) will stay together forever in happiness. Trust me, going from one person to the next, usually results in more of: going from one person to the next. People have to learn to sacrifice and grow with each other. In this day and age, most people just jump ship at the slightest problem that occurs in a relationship.
Also, like one other poster said, people just get in relationships because they are horny. They are thinking with their private parts and not with their hearts, which will end up burning them when all the sexual pleasures cease.
I don't think you're a bad person at all. I just think you have some unresolved issues around sex. Lots of people do.
And yes, I remember very person I had sex with...in lots of detail too BTW. Even those who paid me for sex
People who paid you for sex???
And, it is I who has the unresolved issues?
Seriously, I feel sorry for you and don't think anyone could be happy about doing something like prostitution. However, I feel there is redemption and forgiveness for all people from all walks of life. Although I wasn't sexually promiscuous, I did do my share of bad things before I made teshuva and converted to Netzarim Judaism. Anyway, I'm not promoting my religion, but just hope you can find your way in life. I cannot imagine anyone is happy doing such things like you mentioned. I'm hoping what you mention you did in your past, not present.
By what age, may I ask? In certain areas (mostly metropolitan areas) people are waiting a lot longer to get married... If at all. So, that cuts out the possibility of marrying your H.S. sweetheart for 20 years...
I'm not sure the age matters; however, this is mostly hypothetical and it really depends on every person. It depends on the situation and connection, I guess.
But, at any rate, get near 10 and I'd really probably start thinking about it...
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Originally Posted by MeAndMillie2
What concerns me about this mentality, I am not even going to touch that "mystic" guy... let whatever woman wants him have him... But limiting to an appropriate/"normal" number to 5 or 6 as acceptable? Do you live in a smaller city???? I am not a personal advocate for whoring up the town every weekend, but I think placing anything within a "normal" range is... well... puritanical.
I do live in a city; but I'm not sure that matters, though I can see where you're going with it.
I don't think it's puritanical at all. I think it is an important factor in a long list of judgments you make upon a person. You judge his/her looks, ambitions, personality, education, tastes, actions, hobbies, abilities, spiritual/physical chemistry, thoughts, ideas... the whole package. People prioritize different aspects; I happen to prioritize that one.
I don't think it's puritanical at all because I'm not basing a social standard upon my preferences. I think it is healthy for consenting adults to have sex if they want to, rather than harking back to a more puritanical age where people are given scarlet letters for their transgressions.
At the same time, I do think this particular issue is an indictment upon one's character and that is something that I value; other people may see otherwise.
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Originally Posted by MeAndMillie2
For some sex within a relationship is very important. Sexual chemistry and compatibility that is. Sexual chemistry and compatibility adds another level to a relationship. And if it is not there, well, it is very important to many people and can be a deciding factor... and some just never know.
Sure, but how many times do you have to bounce in and out of those situations to really know?
I think that if a person has a lot of serious, long term relationships (serious enough to have sex) that haven't worked out, there are some issues there in one regard or another... wouldn't you?
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Originally Posted by MeAndMillie2
We advocate experience if every part of our lives... But sex and relationships. I honestly have never understood that.
Eh, I think this is an empty generalization. Some experience in some part of our lives are valuable; innocence and naivete can be valuable too. It really just depends.
So too some things are important to experience with select few other people.
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Originally Posted by MeAndMillie2
Someone can have sex with 100 people and be horrible at relationships and life and that is the reason why their numbers are that high. No one wants to stick around.
There is a flip side...
Someone can have sex with 100 people and be downright awesome at relationships and life and there is a reason why. They are wanted.
Same goes from any numerical value of "normal" up and down that scale.
"Normal" is something we should each define for ourselves, rather than society.
I completely realize that 6 people, while for me is normal and getting toward high, is for other people low and maybe too low. Just like how I like taller, slender women and others like women with hips and curves... everyone is different.
If someone's past history doesn't matter insofar as numbers, does who s/he slept with matter?
I mean... would it make a difference to you if it were your best friend? A sibling? What about your mother/father? A coworker? Someone who is known to really get around and who is perverse? Wilt Chamberlain? What if s/he were in porn in their younger days?
Personally, if a woman was married 10 times and was cheated on their husbands 10 times, even though she was faithful, I would still marry her and her heart is clean in my book.
So, if a woman sleeps with 10 men that she's not married to, that's bad, but if she sleeps with 10 men who she is married to, that's okay? Ten guys is ten guys.
If someone's past history doesn't matter insofar as numbers, does who s/he slept with matter?
I mean... would it make a difference to you if it were your best friend? A sibling? What about your mother/father? A coworker? Someone who is known to really get around and who is perverse? Wilt Chamberlain? What if s/he were in porn in their younger days?
In reality... I think it does matter to us all.
I'll do you one better, how about if the person you're with has slept with a person of a different race. I've read on some message boards were white guys say they would have a big problem if the women they were with had slept with a black man.
I think it matters for most men and matters for me as well. There is a average number, but when that number gets high, I start to wonder to many things. Of course we live in the real world so there are STDs. Every girl i know that has a high number is, well a *****. They are also liars and cheaters. There isn't any way around it. Most girls with high numbers that I know have self esteem issues somewhere along the lines, and I wouldn't want to be with someone that gets lifted up by sleeping around, it screams trouble down the road.
I knew a girl that I really liked for a while, found out she was a virgin until 20 or so, and within 6 months slept with 6 different guys or so, even though her total was 7 or 8 all together. I was a bit disappointed I'll admit, but in the end it didn't stop me from dating her. (BTW her reasoning came down to not giving a **** and being hurt by the first guy who lied to her, so it was about some underlying issues and not just to bang just for the fun).
Again, may I ask and I am seeking clarification here on how someone can come to this reasoning...
So, it is ok for a YOUNG woman to have 6 different men in a 6 month time frame because she had some mental instability, self esteem issues, other relationship trauma or whatever feeds into dysfunction? Justifiable.
It is NOT ok for a mature woman of healthy mind, body, financial situation and whatever else to have 6 different men in a 6 month period just due to having a healthy sexual appetite and flat out enjoys the sensations? Unjustifiable.
Ok, I think I got it, since it seems to be a trend with some of the men on this thread post that the reason "why" is important... And it seems to run along the same train of thought.
I also notice a trend when men refer to ladies as "girls" vs "women"....
I am thinking we should all be forced to reveal our age here... haha. Anyone over the age of... say... 25 still referring to the ladies as "girls"... Well, that says quite a bit, too.
As far as the fact you slept with 9 guys.. Well, I think it is somewhat gross, but that doesn't mean other men will think that. What you may find is that any decent gentleman, may keep his mouth shut and not tell you what he thinks, but somewhere inside he will feel a bit grossed out too that he is sharing the same womb with 9 other guys. It is a strange thing, perhaps goes back to culture or the fact that women are receivers rather than givers. I, myself couldn't marry or sleep with a woman who slept with 9 guys. Unlike, other men though I could share my views liberally and openly. Most men will share this view, but will keep it to themselves or make jokes behind your back.
I tried to resist, but I can't.
I think it's A-OK that you're waiting for marriage, even if it means waiting forever. I don't think it's a wise decision for most people (it behooves many people to test drive before buying), but people who closely tie together religion and sex seem to do just fine with waiting.
But what's not okay is the demeaning tone of your reply. You suggest that the OP is secretly ashamed of her sexual history and that all men will be disgusted by her, whether they admit it or not, and that she is deserving of ridicule and is not capable of valuing her partner on a deeper "soul"-connecting level. You are rude, judgemental, and a bit hateful, something that I'm guessing you aim to avoid as a religious man. There is a way to present a dissenting view without being so offensive.
So, if a woman sleeps with 10 men that she's not married to, that's bad, but if she sleeps with 10 men who she is married to, that's okay? Ten guys is ten guys.
That's what I got out of it as well... I could just go to Vegas, and get married and annulled to my hearts content! Apparently, the difference between morality and immorality is a little slip of paper issued by the government.
Seriously, I feel sorry for you and don't think anyone could be happy about doing something like prostitution. However, I feel there is redemption and forgiveness for all people from all walks of life. Although I wasn't sexually promiscuous, I did do my share of bad things before I made teshuva and converted to Netzarim Judaism. Anyway, I'm not promoting my religion, but just hope you can find your way in life. I cannot imagine anyone is happy doing such things like you mentioned. I'm hoping what you mention you did in your past, not present.
I had to get some laughs in. Your seriousness is exhausting.
I'm an atheist, I reject all religions as delusional. So thanks but no thanks. I have my path and I'm quite happy on it. Plus I get to sleep with my husband every night
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