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Our grandparents were very successful at making relationships work for 30,40,50 and even 60 years of marriage.
My grandmother was a nurse and my grandfather was a welder for the Navy ship yard. They had a very good life. Lived very well and saved a lot of money too. Put 5 kids through college and helped each child secure their first home. My grandparents had a great grasp on what life was about. I'm sure your grandparents were similar to mine, in that regard.
My parents have been married for over 40 years. I remember my mom telling me that she and my dad met in college back in the late 60's. She approached him, and, well as they say, the rest is history.
Seems like, even with the top 10 dating websites, Meetups, forums, social media, people are finding it very difficult to connect with each other.
I know many guys that have just about given up on dating or attempting to find a gal to date, let alone get married to.
Some things to consider. Also, post you own views as well--- Have people gone overboard with their expectations and requirements?
Have people priced themselves out of the market?
Did feminism kill relationships?
Is it about competing with each other more so than helping each other?
Let's talk
NOTE:I AM NOT SEEKING ADVICE. I AM POSING A QUESTION FOR DISCUSSION.
I think you posed a good starting point for your questions, but there's already bias presented.
Given the context of our globalized economy, including countries outside of the U.S., countries where feminism is far outweighed by patriarchy and social hierarchy, people still are struggling, marriages don't last, families broken down.
Just so happens that most retired folks beyond the age of baby boomers seem to have a good quality of life, depending on who you ask. Some people from that generation weren't really privileged to divulge in the American Dream.
And, the American Dream likely died out, not because of social equality (that would actually generate more innovation and prosperity), it died out because of greed and a system that disenfranchises people and extorts countries that aren't well off out of their own natural resources, and leaves the vast 99% to live poorer quality of lives.
Quality of life goes down with the widening gap between richest rich and poorest poor. Heck, most adults live at home with their parents these days and can't even find full-time work so they work more than one part time job where they are over-qualified.
I'd consider the above as more legitimate causes for the lack of joy in our lives, rather than an oversimplified argument against equality and freedom.
I think you posed a good starting point for your questions, but there's already bias presented.
Given the context of our globalized economy, including countries outside of the U.S., countries where feminism is far outweighed by patriarchy and social hierarchy, people still are struggling, marriages don't last, families broken down.
Just so happens that most retired folks beyond the age of baby boomers seem to have a good quality of life, depending on who you ask. Some people from that generation weren't really privileged to divulge in the American Dream.
And, the American Dream likely died out, not because of social equality (that would actually generate more innovation and prosperity), it died out because of greed and a system that disenfranchises people and extorts countries that aren't well off out of their own natural resources, and leaves the vast 99% to live poorer quality of lives.
Quality of life goes down with the widening gap between richest rich and poorest poor. Heck, most adults live at home with their parents these days and can't even find full-time work so they work more than one part time job where they are over-qualified.
I'd consider the above as more legitimate causes for the lack of joy in our lives, rather than an oversimplified argument against equality and freedom.
I am trying to work through your sophistic style and understand what you are really saying. It does sound like I am reading excerpts from Works No 17 of Lenin, but I digress.
You wrote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by kat949
Just so happens that most retired folks beyond the age of baby boomers seem to have a good quality of life, depending on who you ask. Some people from that generation weren't really privileged to divulge in the American Dream.
"Just so happens" -- no, it doesn't just so happens. Many folks of the retired "class" worked hard, saved money, did not splurge endlessly, were smart with their investments, understood delayed gratification, didn't screw up that bad in their jobs, so employers kept them employed for a long time, and for many of them, employers contributed pensions. Union or non-union, blue or white collar.
You also wrote "Some people from that generation weren't really privileged to divulge in the American Dream." Privileged? As if people that "divulged in the American Dream," i.e. people who owned their home, owned cars, went out on vacations, paid for their kids education, again, by working hard, and earning a decent living -- as if these people were privileged?
I know that my parents, baby-boomers worked very hard, so later they enjoyed retirements. So did my inlaws, so did my uncles and aunts, and many other family members. No one was a "one-percenter", some were union, some worked for the Govt, most in the private sector.
My dad worked for decades two or three weeks out, in the field, in the barracks. Bad food almost killed his liver. It took him decades to finally go up the ladder, get an office job, and finally come home every night. He would find it very demeaning when you call him "privileged", that he owned his home, and put his kids thru college, through very hard work in his entire career. And finally enjoy retirement the way he wanted, with his wife (my mother), and pass away after almost 50 years married.
They were very decent people, didn't count other people's money, and didn't care if you had more. They minded their own business and helped countless. Their focus instead was work, home, kids, church / synagogue, education, cars, and family parties.
Oh, and my mother worked too. She was a teacher, later a Dept of Ed employee. Worked her entire adult life too. Made her own money. Had her own nest-egg. Had no financial constraint in divorce. They had their issues, their disagreements. They dated only 9 months before marriage. Yet, learned how to spend the next 50 years together. My mother was 21-years old when she married my dad. Those 21-year old girls of that time, surely were a lot more mature than a 31-year old city chick I see these days.
I think you posed a good starting point for your questions, but there's already bias presented.
This is a problem with many of the questions presented for "discussion" here. They're often based on very biased assumptions that are debatable at best and completely false at worst. The real discussion then has to focus on the assumption underlying the question rather than the question itself. This always frustrates the person who asked the question (or secretly delights them if they're trolling), because people won't reinforce their skewed viewpoint.
No feminism to speak of and, more importanly, no porn. (Boys will be boys, ya know)
Porn has been around since cave paintings.
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Our grandparents were very successful at making relationships work for 30,40,50 and even 60 years of marriage.
My grandmother was a nurse and my grandfather was a welder for the Navy ship yard. They had a very good life. Lived very well and saved a lot of money too. Put 5 kids through college and helped each child secure their first home. My grandparents had a great grasp on what life was about. I'm sure your grandparents were similar to mine, in that regard.
My parents have been married for over 40 years. I remember my mom telling me that she and my dad met in college back in the late 60's. She approached him, and, well as they say, the rest is history.
Seems like, even with the top 10 dating websites, Meetups, forums, social media, people are finding it very difficult to connect with each other.
I know many guys that have just about given up on dating or attempting to find a gal to date, let alone get married to.
Some things to consider. Also, post you own views as well--- Have people gone overboard with their expectations and requirements?
Have people priced themselves out of the market?
Did feminism kill relationships?
Is it about competing with each other more so than helping each other?
Let's talk
NOTE:I AM NOT SEEKING ADVICE. I AM POSING A QUESTION FOR DISCUSSION.
People (especially women) had fewer options. Long-held rules of sexual morality were considered much more important than nowadays. Affairs, divorces, separations, out-of-wedlock pregnancies and the like were not nearly as accepted as they are nowadays.
I think back then people just did not divorce the way they do now. Whether it be for strict religious purposes, or the women having no income, I have no idea.
I know my grandfather died when I was about 6 months old, so I never really knew him. I only heard stories. I know that my grandparents never divorced but I bet if they were living in these days they would have.
They had 7 children. They probably would not have were it now. I don't think my grandfathers paycheck ever really made it home.
I loved my parents to pieces but they were certainly living individually. I never thought they loved one another, but they both loved me.
So many things that go on relationships now also went on then. Times have changed.
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