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I know you are late to the game and the training wheels are still on, but as I said before, waaaaay too much Mr. Nice Guy.
Women are bored with nice guys, they want masculine. Not a knuckles-to-the-ground brute, just something of a challenge.
You need to watch about 10 Bogart movies. How long would he have sat with your date?
I’m in the process of reading it. The descriptions and patterns of behavior fit me to a T so far.
People keep telling me to watch movies of naturally charming, charismatic guys and to “be more like them.” I get that these are examples, but that’s not my personality. I’ve got a personality mode in which I feel more charming and confident but it’s never worked for me in terms of being attractive.
I don’t feel like I can change my personality from the outside. Change needs to come fro m the inside, or I’m just putting on airs.
Met a woman briefly in a professional setting about six weeks ago, just long enough to introduce ourselves. I didn't think I'd see her again any time soon (different city), so I didn't take it any further than that. Ran into her again recently at another event. We apparently share some mutual friends, who she was with. I reintroduced myself to her and chatted a bit. I think she's very attractive and she wasn't wearing a ring. She was friendly but didn't seem to give me any signs of interest (not that I've had a lot of success reading THOSE correctly).
But, pretty late last night she friended me on Facebook. I know, doesn't necessarily mean much. But she lives relatively close, works in the same general field, is very attractive, and seems like we share some commonality judging by her Facebook page. She's single. I'd like to get to know her better. I don't get opportunities like this very often, and I'd like to ask her out. But, it's unlikely I'm going to run into her again in person for a long while (next year), so it'll have to be done over Facebook.
So, how do I best go about asking her out? Be direct? Try to start a casual conversation with her first (I know she'd probably see through that)? Go for a friends type deal and see if I can get to know her better that way? Try to feel her out through our mutual friends?
Looking for any recommendations, I have not had success at this in the past.
This isn't hard.
Same old method with a modern variant: Reach out to her on Facebook. Have a conversation about something innocuous. Say that you enjoyed meeting her (The truth, please) and then ask about her professional life. If she gives you short and non-committal replies, then there's nothing there. If, however, she prolongs the conversation and asks questions about you, then see how it goes. Suggest coffee.
I was advised by one of our mutual friends to try to get to know her better first. He said that she gets asked on dates all the time, sometimes it makes her uncomfortable.
Since you have mutual friends why don't you try to set up something with that group socially. You can get to know her better, she may be more at ease with a group, and it's not a "date". You can feel her out more to see if she is just networking for business, or interested in more since you will be in a social setting instead of a business setting.
Yeah, coffee date woman. I don't think he was, that's why he mentioned coffee specifically.
The only reason I brought her into this thread is...I've tried the slow way, but it didn't work. But I've also tried the direct way, earlier this year with another woman (edit: actually two other women), and it didn't work either.
That's because there is no one way that will work with all women. Women are individuals, what one likes one doesn't. What one sees as a red flag, one may like.
Same old method with a modern variant: Reach out to her on Facebook. Have a conversation about something innocuous. Say that you enjoyed meeting her (The truth, please) and then ask about her professional life. If she gives you short and non-committal replies, then there's nothing there. If, however, she prolongs the conversation and asks questions about you, then see how it goes. Suggest coffee.
He did exactly that. That's how this started. But when they got into an actual date, she went cold.
I think she was ok being friendly with the OP, but didn't necessarily want to be dating.
OP, I think part of the problem is that, because you so rarely have an opportunity to engage conversationally with women, and interact with them, the rare occasions when you have a chance to ask someone out loom large in your mind. So you take every incident to heart, you take it all much too seriously. So where some guys might be socializing and meeting women or a fairly regular basis, it takes you a couple of years to get the point of asking 3 or 4 women out, total. So you dwell on each instance too much, instead of shrugging, and chalking it up to "not a good match", "didn't click", and the like.
See what I mean? I've heard stories guys tell about this or that classmate in college, who always had a pretty date for campus events. And his buddies would ask him how he does it; how does he get these dates? And the answer was always, "I ask a lot of women out, all the time. I get turned down most of the time, too. But eventually, someone says "yes". " Guys like that let the multitude of rejections roll off their back. They keep it all in perspective. But you feel wounded after every single "no, thank you", because it's so rare that you get the opportunity at all.
Patience. Keep up the self improvement. Keep putting one foot in front of the other. Be outgoing and engaging, when you get the chance, i.e. when you're out and about, and there are women around. Don't expect miracles, just have friendliness be your general mode. And realize, that even if a woman does respond positively to a chat in the store, or something, it doesn't mean necessarily that she'd like to date you. It means she may just be enjoying a friendly, neighborly moment.
Yeah, coffee date woman. I don't think he was, that's why he mentioned coffee specifically.
The only reason I brought her into this thread is...I've tried the slow way, but it didn't work. But I've also tried the direct way, earlier this year with another woman (edit: actually two other women), and it didn't work either.
We told you earlier in the thread, that there is no magic formula. There's no one-size-fits-all m.o. If you have trouble with spontaneity, that may be your issue. But the other thing is, that just because people have turned you down, doesn't mean that whatever m.o. you used "doesn't work". There's no m.o. in the world that would persuade women who aren't interested in you to be interested. Whether you build slowly or are direct from the get-go, if you're not her type, nothing will change that. It doesn't mean the m.o. was flawed.
You just move on. Are you participating in groups of various sorts, that are attended by women? You need to widen your circle of potential female acquaintances.
I’m in the process of reading it. The descriptions and patterns of behavior fit me to a T so far.
People keep telling me to watch movies of naturally charming, charismatic guys and to “be more like them.” I get that these are examples, but that’s not my personality. I’ve got a personality mode in which I feel more charming and confident but it’s never worked for me in terms of being attractive.
I don’t feel like I can change my personality from the outside. Change needs to come fro m the inside, or I’m just putting on airs.
I know I’m harping on it but it’s about looks first to get your foot in the door for the first date..If she’s physically attracted to you then as long as you don’t f it up and are somewhat engaging she’ll give you enough signals to let you ask her out on a date.
As Ruth said if your not her physical type it doesn’t matter what you do you she’s not gonna be interested.
I know I’m harping on it but it’s about looks first to get your foot in the door for the first date..If she’s physically attracted to you then as long as you don’t f it up and are somewhat engaging she’ll give you enough signals to let you ask her out on a date.
As Ruth said if your not her physical type it doesn’t matter what you do you she’s not gonna be interested.
Ruth didn't say anything about physical type being an issue. Ruth believes this is a complex matter; for some people, it's all about physical appearance from the start. For other people, charm, wit, intelligence, or whatever. gets things going. For still others, physical appearance is a factor, but an unimpressive appearance is frequently overcome by good conversation and an upbeat vibe.
You're not going to get away with putting words in Ruth's mouth, JBT.
OP, I think you did the right things perfectly. Unfortunately, going on a date is not a guarantee of a romantic future together. It's to see IF the two of you have interest together.
I believe, she was giving you that chance. She wanted to see if you were dating material. You were not for her but I don't think it's because of anything you did wrong. I think she saw the spark was not there once she met you.
Next time you see a girl you really like, do the same. Ask her out on a serious date. No coffee. You ask for coffee someone you are lukewarm about, not one you are serious about.
I am sorry this happened to you. You do sound like someone who would make someone very happy one day. Keep looking, keep doing what you are doing. It will happen.
OP, I think part of the problem is that, because you so rarely have an opportunity to engage conversationally with women, and interact with them, the rare occasions when you have a chance to ask someone out loom large in your mind. So you take every incident to heart, you take it all much too seriously. So where some guys might be socializing and meeting women or a fairly regular basis, it takes you a couple of years to get the point of asking 3 or 4 women out, total.
...
And realize, that even if a woman does respond positively to a chat in the store, or something, it doesn't mean necessarily that she'd like to date you. It means she may just be enjoying a friendly, neighborly momen.
That’s exactly it. I’m old to be trying to figure all of this out, my circumstances make the dating market difficult for me, I feel like time is growing short to get what I’d like to have out of a serious relationship...a few years of fun, traveling, adventure, spontaneity with a partner, and then starting a family. My opportunities are few and far in between, so I feel like every shot counts both as a chance at success and as a learning experience. I know realistically that this is a hard game that is rarely rewarding even under the best circumstances.
...
Yes, I know. My whole lifetime of interactions with women has been what you describe...friendly but no further. This year I’ve tried to focus more on how I feel...if I’m attracted to someone available, I’ve taken my shot as long as she has seemed at least friendly. The flip side of that...I just haven’t been what they’re looking for. That’s why I’m here.
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