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I agree, each situation is different. Everyone has a story. From what I understand about your situation your ex changed a lot and even became abusive. Id never advocate staying in an abusive situation. I was abused by a live in boyfriend myself and that was probably the most hellish experience of my life. Thank goodness there were no children involved.
People do change over time and grow apart. Its not black and white either.
I guess Im thinking of people who marry and divorce for selfish reasons based on whats easiest or most convenient for them. Id try to avoid getting involved with any one who shows a pattern of that imo.
Right, well, my relationship with my ex was low-key "this sucks but I can cope" for practically the duration. It was only at the end that it crossed the line into "OK this sucks and someone might die, so I think I need to get out of here."
But you know what, though? I wish I hadn't waited so long. Until things hit rock bottom. And this mentality that marriage is this sacred thing you have to try, and work, and suffer, and cope, and toil away to make it work no matter how unhappy you are...that is a big part of why I stayed so long. Had I left him a couple of years sooner, every member of the family, AND our bank accounts, would have suffered less for it.
But hindsight is 20/20.
Anyhow the main point I guess I was trying to make, was that my commitment to him, such as it was, was tied more to the kids, to "trying to do the right thing" (which means not being selfish ever) and to the idea that I somehow deserved no better than what I had with him. I felt very strongly about elements of duty and obligation that were involved. It was about as not frivolous as you can be.
What is glorious now is that my fiance and I are wonderful companions to one another, we make each other very happy, and we are together not because of NEED or desperation, scrambling to survive or being battle buddies through hardship, no we're two whole people who are together because we WANT to be together. We have a lot of fun together. And you know, in some ways that is far more "frivolous" than my marriage ever was. But it's also a hell of a lot better.
And oddly I think I would rather have a partner who knows when to throw in the towel on an unhappy relationship, than one who stays with me out of obligation, but complains about me behind my back on a forum or to his drinking buddies...and who really doesn't WANT to be there anymore. Perhaps the ability to divorce when divorce is the right call, is something I could value, even if others don't. I think that a long unhappy marriage is far more of a failure, than one that ends instead. Life is way too short to put the institution ahead of the happiness of the people involved.
Right, well, my relationship with my ex was low-key "this sucks but I can cope" for practically the duration. It was only at the end that it crossed the line into "OK this sucks and someone might die, so I think I need to get out of here."
But you know what, though? I wish I hadn't waited so long. Until things hit rock bottom. And this mentality that marriage is this sacred thing you have to try, and work, and suffer, and cope, and toil away to make it work no matter how unhappy you are...that is a big part of why I stayed so long. Had I left him a couple of years sooner, every member of the family, AND our bank accounts, would have suffered less for it.
But hindsight is 20/20.
Anyhow the main point I guess I was trying to make, was that my commitment to him, such as it was, was tied more to the kids, to "trying to do the right thing" (which means not being selfish ever) and to the idea that I somehow deserved no better than what I had with him. I felt very strongly about elements of duty and obligation that were involved. It was about as not frivolous as you can be.
What is glorious now is that my fiance and I are wonderful companions to one another, we make each other very happy, and we are together not because of NEED or desperation, scrambling to survive or being battle buddies through hardship, no we're two whole people who are together because we WANT to be together. We have a lot of fun together. And you know, in some ways that is far more "frivolous" than my marriage ever was. But it's also a hell of a lot better.
And oddly I think I would rather have a partner who knows when to throw in the towel on an unhappy relationship, than one who stays with me out of obligation, but complains about me behind my back on a forum or to his drinking buddies...and who really doesn't WANT to be there anymore. Perhaps the ability to divorce when divorce is the right call, is something I could value, even if others don't. I think that a long unhappy marriage is far more of a failure, than one that ends instead. Life is way too short to put the institution ahead of the happiness of the people involved.
Honestly I agree with all you say. Your situation wasnt the kind I was envisioning in writing my posts.
This topic is probably triggery to me because of my mom so if Im sometimes extreme in my opinions that could be why.
Id not advocate anyone to suffer through a miserable marriage, for any reason. The certificate isnt a sacred holy document. And children probably suffer more from having fighting miserable parents over divorced but happy parents.
Im referring more to personality disordered people who view marriage as a social climbing tool or a way to be able to avoid work or responsibility. They spouse hop endlessly to whomever offers them the easiest life.
Im not talking about honest and genuine people, like you.
Im referring more to personality disordered people who view marriage as a social climbing tool or a way to be able to avoid work or responsibility. They spouse hop endlessly to whomever offers them the easiest life.
There are all kinds of folks with personality disorders out there - divorced or not. The most we can do is have awareness (no matter who we choose to date) - and slowly get to know someone in an honest and intimate way over the course of time.
There are all kinds of folks with personality disorders out there - divorced or not. The most we can do is have awareness (no matter who we choose to date) - and slowly get to know someone in an honest and intimate way over the course of time.
Personality disordered people are also extremely charming and persuasive. Very adept at getting what they want.
Even the smartest and most worldly people can be blindsided. These people have been honing their skills since they came out. Their techniques are unimaginable to...mortals. And no matter how wide open your eyes are, the person you think you are seeing can still be a mirage.
Personality disordered people are also extremely charming and persuasive. Very adept at getting what they want.
Even the smartest and most worldly people can be blindsided. These people have been honing their skills since they came out. Their techniques are unimaginable to...mortals. And no matter how wide open your eyes are, the person you think you are seeing can still be a mirage.
Are we discussing people with personality disorders i.e. mental disorders - or persons going through a recent divorce (per the thread)? In regard to the latter (and the former, actually), my point is time. Rushing into marriage is never a good idea - whether the person has been previously married or not.
Generally speaking, I tend to agree most people going through a divorce are not emotionally available to date.
Are we discussing people with personality disorders i.e. mental disorders - or persons going through a recent divorce (per the thread)? In regard to the latter (and the former, actually), my point is time. Rushing into marriage is never a good idea - whether the person has been previously married or not.
Generally speaking, I tend to agree most people going through a divorce are not emotionally available to date.
Personality disorder =/= mental disorder. Esp. when referring to Cluster B. These people can be high functioning, high status, even reaching the highest echelons of society.
The mentally ill are usually the opposite, the lowest ranking members of society because they are disabled. Their ability to function is impaired.
To answer your question, I was referring to people with personality disorders, especially Cluster B, and its relevant to the thread because those are the ones that tend to abuse the institution of marriage, resulting in the most divorces.
Not every divorcee fits into this category, but divorcees are more likely to.
Personality disorder =/= mental disorder. Esp. when referring to Cluster B. These people can be high functioning, high status, even reaching the highest echelons of society.
The mentally ill are usually the opposite, the lowest ranking members of society because they are disabled. Their ability to function is impaired.
To answer your question, I was referring to people with personality disorders, especially Cluster B, and its relevant to the thread because those are the ones that tend to abuse the institution of marriage, resulting in the most divorces.
Not every divorcee fits into this category, but divorcees are more likely to.
I don’t know that much about personality disorders; that said, I do know about dating (I’ve been doing it long enough - lol). I trust my own ability to gauge that which might be off or misleading, whether the woman I date has been married previously or not.
I agree with you (or others in this thread), actually, in re: the heightened potential of unresolved emotional baggage in a woman who has been recently divorced. I’m simply noting the fact not all women (or circumstances) are the same.
I don’t know that much about personality disorders; that said, I do know about dating (I’ve been doing it long enough - lol). I trust my own ability to gauge that which might be off or misleading, whether the woman I date has been married previously or not.
I agree with you (or others in this thread), actually, in re: the heightened potential of unresolved emotional baggage in a woman who has been recently divorced. I’m simply noting the fact not all women (or circumstances) are the same.
Thanks for noting. Im pretty much thinking out loud. We've all had lots of varied experiences. Its good to talk about them I think. Especially here on a relationships forum, its pretty much the point of the forum.
Location: As of 2022….back to SoCal. OC this time!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moongirl00
Personality disorder =/= mental disorder. Esp. when referring to Cluster B. These people can be high functioning, high status, even reaching the highest echelons of society.
The mentally ill are usually the opposite, the lowest ranking members of society because they are disabled. Their ability to function is impaired.
To answer your question, I was referring to people with personality disorders, especially Cluster B, and its relevant to the thread because those are the ones that tend to abuse the institution of marriage, resulting in the most divorces.
Not every divorcee fits into this category, but divorcees are more likely to.
This is good to bring up. People with Cluster B personality disorders are impaired by emotional and erratic behavior.......which leads to significant impairment in all personal relationships. The mental disorders are listed in the DSM-5 like histrionic, narcissistic, borderline, antisocial PD..(so they *are* mental health disorders) ...ITA they may abuse marriage because their relationships will be impaired..........& they will have few long term friendships or relationships of any kind.....
It would be a challenge to date...or marry....someone with a cluster b personality disorder....after a divorce or any time!! If someone suffers from one of these disorders, there is high probability that the disorder has a lot to do with the divorce........but it doesn’t take long to see the signs.....in their personal relationships or on the job...if you know what you’re looking for....
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People with Cluster B personality disorders are impaired by emotional and erratic behavior.......which leads to significant impairment in all personal relationships. The mental disorders are listed in the DSM-5 like histrionic, narcissistic, borderline, antisocial PD..(so they *are* mental health disorders) ...ITA they may abuse marriage because their relationships will be impaired..........& they will have few long term friendships or relationships of any kind.....
