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Just putting it out there for those who are afraid to or don't want to venture into the A&A, but still have questions.
I'll start. I wasn't always an atheist, in fact, I was quite the opposite. Questions and doubts had me searching for answers wherever I could find them. Well, I didn't find answers. There are none. There's no proof to be had from the Christianity side of things. It's all conjecture and wishful thinking. This is just my findings, so don't get offended.
I had entered the A&A forum several times, arguing my points as a Christian. As a doubter, I wanted to really listen to them and hear what they had to say. I had never known an atheist because in my religion they were to be shunned because they were more or less evil and it would create doubts. No, I already had doubts and I wanted to know why someone would choose evil over good.
Its' actually funny to me now how my indoctrination had made me think anyone who didn't believe in god is evil. I listened to atheists, I argued some more and eventually I came to Universalism, briefly. It sounded more plausible but it still didn't make much sense. It was a long process of letting go of preconceived notions and lies. These atheists were cool and super smart, and no agenda!
Now, I am an "agnostic atheist" which means I lean more towards there not being a god. Other agnostics simply admit they don't know, some atheists demand that there isn't a god. We're all different but agree on one thing that does not require "faith", as some people are claiming, it's simply just dis-belief due to lack of evidence.
Please, let's keep it civil and not let it turn into a free-for-all mud-slinging contest.
Afraid ??
I think Atheism is laughable, when an intelligent person looks around and believes that the entire universe and everything in it, came together all by itself. But hey, we are all free to make our choices - so good for whoever believes in Atheism.
You know, it's funny because I can totally relate to this. My faith impacted everything in my life... politics, friends, romantic relationships, and most disconcerting, my perceived self-worth. I genuinely found passion in serving within the church and even went on a short-term mission trip. And I too would read the agnostic/atheist forums here and pity those miserable jerks who hated God.
Through it all, I always found it odd the one prayer that was never answered was the one for stronger faith. The, "just show me what you want and I'll do it" prayer. Not requests for this or that, or for a situation to go a certain way, rather just an earnest sense of peace. That one tripped me up for years because an answer never came. I suppose I was just listening the wrong way (tongue-in-cheek, but yeah, I really did use that excuse on myself too).
This led to a period stretching over a few years where I started to ask hard questions and seek out opinions which, at the time, I didn't agree with. Then I dove deeper in the Bible itself, and the history surrounding it. Then I started working on myself, and began to discover everything I was searching for could only be found within. Also that people are important collectively, and I don't need to be so adamant in defending what's "mine".
I recall years back when the war on Christmas propaganda was in full swing, and I totally bought into it hook line and sinker. There was a billboard sponsored by an atheist organization that was stirring up controversy. It had a picture of Santa and read, “Go ahead and skip church! Just be good for goodness' sake”. Reading about it made me livid. Today... I totally understand.
Sorry, no real question because I understand where you're coming from.
Afraid ??
I think Atheism is laughable, when an intelligent person looks around and believes that the entire universe and everything in it, came together all by itself. But hey, we are all free to make our choices - so good for whoever believes in Atheism.
Oh dear, I'm going to attempt this but it's probably futile. It's not about intelligence, beliefs or the universe, atheists don't claim to have all the answers. But so far there is no empirical or scientific proof that a god or gods exist.
The bolded above is such a flawed statement. These are the things I was talking about dispelling. Atheism is NOT a belief it's a position you take when there is no evidence to believe in something. Also, it's egregious statements like above that make your christianity look like.....well.....unstable and laughable.
Afraid ??
I think Atheism is laughable, when an intelligent person looks around and believes that the entire universe and everything in it, came together all by itself. But hey, we are all free to make our choices - so good for whoever believes in Atheism.
Okay.
And I think christianity is laughable since all of the 'great' bible stories all happened during the period of undocumented history and haven't repeated in the time of modern man when we could study them. Y'all are still listening to goat herders. But go ahead...god turned anyone into a pillar of salt lately?
You know, it's funny because I can totally relate to this. My faith impacted everything in my life... politics, friends, romantic relationships, and most disconcerting, my perceived self-worth. I genuinely found passion in serving within the church and even went on a short-term mission trip. And I too would read the agnostic/atheist forums here and pity those miserable jerks who hated God.
Through it all, I always found it odd the one prayer that was never answered was the one for stronger faith. The, "just show me what you want and I'll do it" prayer. Not requests for this or that, or for a situation to go a certain way, rather just an earnest sense of peace. That one tripped me up for years because an answer never came. I suppose I was just listening the wrong way (tongue-in-cheek, but yeah, I really did use that excuse on myself too).
This led to a period stretching over a few years where I started to ask hard questions and seek out opinions which, at the time, I didn't agree with. Then I dove deeper in the Bible itself, and the history surrounding it. Then I started working on myself, and began to discover everything I was searching for could only be found within. Also that people are important collectively, and I don't need to be so adamant in defending what's "mine".
I recall years back when the war on Christmas propaganda was in full swing, and I totally bought into it hook line and sinker. There was a billboard sponsored by an atheist organization that was stirring up controversy. It had a picture of Santa and read, “Go ahead and skip church! Just be good for goodness' sake”. Reading about it made me livid. Today... I totally understand.
Sorry, no real question because I understand where you're coming from.
Oh dear, I'm going to attempt this but it's probably futile. It's not about intelligence, beliefs or the universe, atheists don't claim to have all the answers. But so far there is no empirical or scientific proof that a god or gods exist.
The bolded above is such a flawed statement. These are the things I was talking about dispelling. Atheism is NOT a belief it's a position you take when there is no evidence to believe in something. Also, it's egregious statements like above that make your christianity look like.....well.....unstable and laughable.
The "flawed statement" is the claim that Atheism is not a belief.
Even that "FAQ" in the A&A subforum states that Atheism is a Belief.
And it is definitively so: https://www.dictionary.com/browse/atheism
Everything and anything that anyone has considered and/or contemplated is a "Belief".
Only if you've never heard of something, or never considered it, could you not have a belief about it.
Atheists believe that there is insufficient evidence to support the existence of a God...even though the vast majority of the people in this world (4+ out of 5) do find there to be sufficient evidence.
It is important to get this straight, so it is possible to have a logical discussion and debate about it.
The "flawed statement" is the claim that Atheism is not a belief.
Even that "FAQ" in the A&A subforum states that Atheism is a Belief.
And it is definitively so: https://www.dictionary.com/browse/atheism
Everything and anything that anyone has considered and/or contemplated is a "Belief".
Only if you've never heard of something, or never considered it, could you not have a belief about it.
Atheists believe that there is insufficient evidence to support the existence of a God...even though the vast majority of the people in this world (4+ out of 5) do find there to be sufficient evidence.
It is important to get this straight, so it is possible to have a logical discussion and debate about it.
Ah Goldie, I can always count on you to chime in. You're here to argue, I'm here to answer questions. Do you have a legitimate question?
Ah Goldie, I can always count on you to chime in. You're here to argue, I'm here to answer questions. Do you have a legitimate question?
That's what is done here...present "arguments" and debate.
I made a legit observation and statement...and presented reasoning and evidence for it.
You do not have to address it...but it is there, and it is legit.
My legitimate question is: How do you account for the information provided by this forum & even provided formally that define Atheism as a Belief, while you claim it isn't?
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