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Campbell I agree with you, the Bible clearly teaches the Trinity and that Jesus has always existed, but I think you should stop arguing with someone who only wants to rile up and is not listening to anything you say.
Last edited by I LOVE NORTH CAROLINA; 07-31-2008 at 01:53 PM..
Reason: changed word
Campbell I agree with you, the Bible clearly teaches the Trinity and that Jesus has always been, but I think you stop arguing with someone who only wants to rile up and is not listening to anything you say.
Are U serious?
I think it is the exact opposite.
Eg.
Campbell:What color is the sky?
Anyone: Blue
Campbell: Yes but what color is the sky?
Anyone: Blue
Campbell: Yes but what color is the sky?
Anyone: Blue
Campbell: Yes but what color is the sky?
Anyone: Are U on drugs? can you not read, etc.
I mean if he were so sure that the triangle myth is true surely there are other scrips - it is called a 2nd or 3rd witness.
But of course we do not know the color of his sunglasses - I guess that is the problem.
Even color coded replies does not help and esp when the verse he wants to to answer on is imbedded in said color code and in said post and he then quotes said answer and asks again. dO YOU FOLK NOT THINK THIS IS WEIRD?
I mean if he was representing my POV - I would shut him up, it is embarrasing.
the proof text is refuted, now move on to the next proof text or do you only have this one????????????????????????????????????
No, I did not Ignore Genesis 1:26, I believe in the trinity, you do not. I'm left with the understanding of how God could be speaking to others in the Godhead. Your left with a countridiction. Because unless the trinity exist, there is no way that Jesus and the God of the Old Testament could have both created all things. The God of the Old Testament tells us He created all things (ALONE and by (HIMSELF). If you believe in the trinity there is no problem with that statement. If you believe that Jesus is a created being, your left with a countridiction. Because only God alone was involved in creation.
The contradiction is yours. 1+1+1 = 1 But like I said, you are free to spin it anyway you so choose.
Wrong again "Mein Camp" . In every single instance where the 30+ times the expression is used, "First-Born" is always used in reference to something or someone being the beginning of whatever GROUP is being spoken of. In this case, and I realize it gives you pissy fits, but Jesus was the first DIRECT Creation over every single thing Spirit & Physical - Living or inanimate that Almighty God of the entire Universe (Yahweh - Jehovah -YHWH ) created period. But you are welcome to spin it anyway you see fit.You mean like the numerous diliberate False Spurious Scriptures put into the "Authorized King James Version" by the Apotate Anglican Clergyman, that Sir Isaac Newton & William Whiston (who the Trinitarian clergy murdered) discovered in their intelligent and conscientious research ??????????
Cheers
And Jesus was the first born from the dead, the Bible does not say Jesus was created by the Father. That is what you say, yet you have not shown us scripture that would suggest otherwise. The Bible clearly states that Jesus Christ is God. You can see this in John 1:1,2,3 In the Beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word (WAS GOD).
The same was in the beginning with God. (ALL THINGS WERE MADE BY HIM and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Now wait one second, I thought YHWH made all things ALONE and by HIMSELF.
Heres where you are left with this great countridiction.
Do you just ignore it? Did YHWH really make everything (ALONE) and by (HIMSELf)? Or was it the (WORD) that made (ALL THINGS)?
And remember, the (WORD) was made flesh, and dwelt among us. And it was the (WORD) that made (ALL THINGS).
The contradiction is yours. 1+1+1 = 1 But like I said, you are free to spin it anyway you so choose.
So then you do not believe YHWH when he tells us He made the World (ALONE) and BY (HIMSELF)? Becaue you really believe that Jesus was helping Him. So YHWH words can't be true.
I'm not spinning anything, I believe YHWH. I believe He was alone. You can't believe that, because you believe that YHWH had his master craftsman helping Him. You believe that YHWH created Jesus who is now a seperate being, and when YHWH said he made the earth alone and by Himself that was a fales statement. Because He was not alone, because you said Jesus was helping Him. Thats what you believe. If that is not true, tell me where I'm wrong.
Campbell I agree with you, the Bible clearly teaches the Trinity and that Jesus has always existed, but I think you should stop arguing with someone who only wants to rile up and is not listening to anything you say.
Well I just can't help myself. Especially when it comes to someone not looking at the details. There are statements in the Bible if taken out of context you can try to make them lean in the slant of your belief. However, there are other statements that you can't get to lean in any direction but the direction that points to the truth. And often those are details some would like to ignore. And sometimes it takes a little extra effort to get someone to consider such details, or even acknowledge they exist. Years ago I use to go over to a friend of mine and tell him about Jesus. His family got so tired of me talking about Him that they kicked me out of their house. Well I still could not stop talking about Jesus, and one night when I was finished taking a shower and as soon as my foot touch the floor when I steped out of the shower, God spoke to me and told me if I wanted to pray in an unknown language I could. Well I went and got my tape recorder and then I began to pray and sing.
Honestly, I don't know what I said or sang but I believe it came from the Lord. The next night I told that friend of mine that I had spoke in this other language because God told me I could. He said he wished he could of heard that. I told him I had recorded the whole thing. He could not believe it. When I played it for him, he turned to me an said. "Tom, now I know everything you have told me about Jesus is true. Shortly after that he became a Christian, and then his brother became a christian, and then his sister became a Christian. That was over 30 years ago, and they are all still christian to this day. You just never know what God is going to do.
Oh yeah, after they became Christians the parents said it was ok for me to come back over to their house again. That was two years later.
Well I just can't help myself. Especially when it comes to someone not looking at the details. There are statements in the Bible if taken out of context you can try to make them lean in the slant of your belief. However, there are other statements that you can't get to lean in any direction but the direction that points to the truth. And often those are details some would like to ignore. And sometimes it takes a little extra effort to get someone to consider such details, or even acknowledge they exist. Years ago I use to go over to a friend of mine and tell him about Jesus. His family got so tired of me talking about Him that they kicked me out of their house. Well I still could not stop talking about Jesus, and one night when I was finished taking a shower and as soon as my foot touch the floor when I steped out of the shower, God spoke to me and told me if I wanted to pray in an unknown language I could. Well I went and got my tape recorder and then I began to pray and sing.
Honestly, I don't know what I said or sang but I believe it came from the Lord. The next night I told that friend of mine that I had spoke in this other language because God told me I could. He said he wished he could of heard that. I told him I had recorded the whole thing. He could not believe it. When I played it for him, he turned to me an said. "Tom, now I know everything you have told me about Jesus is true. Shortly after that he became a Christian, and then his brother became a christian, and then his sister became a Christian. That was over 30 years ago, and they are all still christian to this day. You just never know what God is going to do.
Oh yeah, after they became Christians the parents said it was ok for me to come back over to their house again. That was two years later.
Oh I totally understand, and maybe someone is reading your posts that will really listen what you are saying, I hope so. God bless you for what you do!!!
And Jesus was the first born from the dead, the Bible does not say Jesus was created by the Father.
Wasn't Lazarus supposedly raised from the dead by Jesus himself? That's what it says in the Bible anyway. Just wondering. I hope you're having a good day and that there's not too many people picking on you in the City Data Forum.
Revelation 3:14 asserts that Christ is the “beginning of the creation of God” and Col 1:15 states that Christ is “the firstborn over all creation”. These verses in no sense indicate that Christ was a created being. The Greek word “arche” can be correctly rendered “origin”. Revelation 3:14 then declares that Christ is the faithful and true witness, the “origin” or “source” of the creation of God. This corroborates Col 1:16 which states, “For by Him (Jesus) All things were created; things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities…”
My claims always seem outrageous to people who aren't really interested in the way I think.
Heh-heh. Well, for purposes of discussion, the way you think isn't relevent. It's what you type and where you arrive at your opinions that I'm interested in.
If you want a good understanding of history, you're going to have to do some reading beyond wikipedia and a Google search. Wikipedia has entries on Sasquatch, you know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D
2+2=4.
That's a very narrow-minded assertion.
Seriously though, that proves my point. Yes, I am "secure in my convictions" when I think I'm right. 2+2 really is 4. Ice is cold (at least relative to a human's body temperature). Water is wet. Salsa is yummy. Stout is yummier. Stout with chips and salsa ... ooo, bliss. If any of my convictions are wrong, I'm ready, willing, and eager to hear (or read) an argument to the contrary, but I'm going to need a lot more convincing than "because I said so" and links to wikipedia.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D
Besidez Constantine was the one who made Christianity the greatest religion in the Roman Empire and thus Europe.
Early Christianity (before it was the Roman Empire's state religion) doesn't resemble Constantine's Christianity at all.
Constantine didn't make Christianity the "state religion." He simply made it Christianity no longer illegal.
Theology and philosophy is constantly changing and growing. That shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone. But you're giving Constantine way more credit than he deserves.
There are very good reasons the doctrine of the Trinity came about, and it had little to nothing to do with Constantine. His great contribution was seeing to it that people were no longer used as torches in his gardens or fed to lions.
Last edited by Mark S.; 07-31-2008 at 09:12 PM..
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You mean like the numerous diliberate False Spurious Scriptures put into the "Authorized King James Version" by the Apotate Anglican Clergyman, that Sir Isaac Newton & William Whiston (who the Trinitarian clergy murdered) discovered in their intelligent and conscientious research ??????????
