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What i find offensive is scare tactics used on those who don't believe or follow your god.
I find it insulting to all rational thinkers, and intelligent human beings capable of making choices in life without interventions of "higher" being.
I find it offensive to follow demands and commands of an unproven, invisible thing.
I find it offensive to believe that man in the skies gave me brain and mind on my own so later on, that same invisible man can take it away and punish for the very same "free will" he gave you in the first place.
I find it offensive to limit my human abilities to act, think and do what it takes to better myself and world around me, and not by praying and waiting for miracles, but by making decision on your own terms.
I find it offensive to not be able make mistakes and learn from them, because man in the sky wants you to be "perfect" in every way possible.
And most of all, i find it offensive that i have to explain to anyone why i do not believe in the thing you call God.
i thought gay meant happy just not in your case i guess
How do you convince a creationist that a fossil is a transitional fossil? You cannot do it. There is no convincing someone who has his mind made up already. I have no idea why I'm still discussing this with you. I may as well debate with a brick wall.
The problem is, what they call a transitional fossil can only be (assumed) to be a transional. Because it is a species that went extinct in the past, yet shows us no clear transional exchange between species. The Bible has slam dunk prophecies, the Theory of Evolution has nothing like this. Do we put our faith in assumptions, or do we put our faith in a written Word that is proven correct. Evolution is a theory that rest fully on assumptions. A true transional should show us a clear transformation of one species evoloving into another. You should not have to assume anything, because there should be such an abundance of fossils, that assumptions would not be required. Even Darwin stated that. Yet here we are over one hundred years latter, and the best they can do is find a fragment here, and a fragment there, and then claim scientific fact based on assumption. Please. Don't you find it just a bit odd that we have millions of fossils showing us things as they were, yet never a clear fossil showing us an obvious transional. And many of the transional fossils that have been brought forward as evidence, have been exposed to be something other than what was originally stated. So what happens is they start showing you various skulls and passing them off as transionals. Really, considering the abundance of fossils, there should be an abundance of transionals that show obvious change that one could point to. There should be fossils showing us numerous species in that change. You should not have to debate if a fossil is a transional, these fossils should be in your face and and in such (great numbers), that debate would be laughable. Yet all we see today, is fragments that are debated over.
Because THAT'S what makes science and evolution so great. Instead of being held back by a book of myths, we as freethinkers can admit when we're wrong and add more information to our scientific database. You don't think people made MANY mistakes when they started erecting buildings, or creating the automobile? Of course they did! They figured out their mistakes and moved on with a newer, better blueprint. Scientists are constantly trying to prove themselves and others wrong because of the knowledge aspect. We want to know, we want to find out, we want to be proven wrong and start all over again. It's interesting to learn and study and experiment and you just can't do so with the bible hanging over your head telling you what to do and what to believe.
Regarding the prophecies... You see what you want to see. Prophecies are vague at best (look at Nostradamus, MANY of his prophecies have 'come true') and up for interpretations. People have been predicting and seeing the signs of the End Times for centuries... it still hasn't happened. To err is human.
The Bible is not a Book of myths, and I have asked you to reveal to me where the Bible has been proven wrong through historical discovery. This you have not done, and I can only assume you have not done this because you do not know the Bible. So it would be wise not to call the Bible a Book of myths unless you are prepared to point out where historical discovery has proven you to be correct.
And a great number of the prophecies in the Bible are not vague at all, so again I must assume you know little of these prophecies. It appears you have a misguided belief in the Bible, that is fueled by ignorance.
The Bible is not a Book of myths, and I have asked you to reveal to me where the Bible has been proven wrong through historical discovery. This you have not done, and I can only assume you have not done this because you do not know the Bible. So it would be wise not to call the Bible a Book of myths unless you are prepared to point out where historical discovery has proven you to be correct.
And a great number of the prophecies in the Bible are not vague at all, so again I must assume you know little of these prophecies. It appears you have a misguided belief in the Bible, that is fueled by ignorance.
It is up to you to prove the bible, but I don't want to hear your east gate story once again...No proof there.....What other of the multitude of prophesies can you attempt to prove? I have proven evolution to you countless times, but of course you must dismiss all of that proof because it shoots your biblical flood story full of holes big enough to sink a dozen arks.
I have read the bible, but not with your eyes and I do not see the things in it you purport to see, but then I see clearly.
It is up to you to prove the bible, but I don't want to hear your east gate story once again...No proof there.....What other of the multitude of prophesies can you attempt to prove? I have proven evolution to you countless times, but of course you must dismiss all of that proof because it shoots your biblical flood story full of holes big enough to sink a dozen arks.
I have read the bible, but not with your eyes and I do not see the things in it you purport to see, but then I see clearly.
Well the East Gate prophecy has proof from previous generations. It's not that the proof is not there, it is that you deny what I and others from the past have clearly stated. Like the prophecies of the Jews returning to Israel and Jerusalem. There, past generations stated long before the Jews returned, that they would, based on the truth of Gods word. Those people and the Bible both mock your , (no proof there statement).
The things I have seen in the Bible, were seen long before those prophecies were fulfilled. So don't talk about what my eyes have seen, refute the documentation of what others in the past have claimed about those prophecies as well. Just remember, those people statements were made before the prophecies were fulfilled, (and time has revealed that they were correct). So what you have to do, is refute that historical written truth.
And if you believe assumptions about fossils is the same as proof for Evolution, your going to have to do better than that.
I stand behind Sanspeur's and JetJockey's intelligent replies.
I'm sure you do stand behind their intelligent replies, and that is easy to do because there replies do not adress the questions asked.
If the Bible is a mythical Book, why are the prophecies correct? And if they are not correct, can you give us examples? It's always easy to answer in vague sweeping declarations. Yet the Devil is in the details.
I'm sure you do stand behind their intelligent replies, and that is easy to do because there replies do not adress the questions asked.
If the Bible is a mythical Book, why are the prophecies correct? And if they are not correct, can you give us examples? It's always easy to answer in vague sweeping declarations. Yet the Devil is in the details.
I agree Campbell. Go ahead and first prove that the bible rests on sound science. You haven't yet. Next prove that the characters in the bible were real. You haven't yet.
It's not difficult to write a fictional book with fictional characters and perpetuate a flawed storyline across several books. You need an outside source to verify the entire bible. The bible cannot be evidence for itself.
When you do those things, we can entertain your "challenges." To not have you establish the criteria as laid out above would seemingly give you credit for a position that has none.
The Bible is not a Book of myths, and I have asked you to reveal to me where the Bible has been proven wrong through historical discovery. This you have not done, and I can only assume you have not done this because you do not know the Bible. So it would be wise not to call the Bible a Book of myths unless you are prepared to point out where historical discovery has proven you to be correct.
And a great number of the prophecies in the Bible are not vague at all, so again I must assume you know little of these prophecies. It appears you have a misguided belief in the Bible, that is fueled by ignorance.
Flat earth vs. round earth. Rotating on an axis around the sun vs. the Universe rotating around earth. Daniel 4:10-11. In Daniel, the king “saw a tree of great height at the centre of the earth...reaching with its top to the sky and visible to the earth's farthest bounds." This is not possible in a sphere shaped earth. Prophecies are always just ambiguous enough to allow for interpretation. It's like that when 'psychics' cold read people, everything is vague, but when you get ONE thing right, all of a sudden it's amazing and 'a miracle'. Kind of like the people who are 'predicting' that California will one day have a big earthquake and break away from the US... if that happens it will not be a prophecy, it will be a guess that kinda came true.
I agree Campbell. Go ahead and first prove that the bible rests on sound science. You haven't yet. Next prove that the characters in the bible were real. You haven't yet.
It's not difficult to write a fictional book with fictional characters and perpetuate a flawed storyline across several books. You need an outside source to verify the entire bible. The bible cannot be evidence for itself.
When you do those things, we can entertain your "challenges." To not have you establish the criteria as laid out above would seemingly give you credit for a position that has none.
I have already point out to you where science has been shown in the Scriptures, even giving you links. You have remained strangely silent on that. How many times do I need to repeat myself? And if the Bible is a fictional Book, why are it's prophecies being fulfilled literaly? Hear again you have remaind strangely silent. I am still waiting for you to respond and explain to me how these prophecies could of occured if the Bible has a flawed story line. I have spoken of revealed science, history, and prophecy. Can you respond to anything I have presented here? Or will you just continue to repeat your bland negative statements that lack content?
The paths through the Sea were discovered because of what was revealed first in the Scriptures. The prophecies occuring in Israel today, were first spoken of in the Scriptures. Historical accuracy of the Bible were mocked by non believers like you, yet time has proven such men wrong, and the Bible correct. Now, will you continue in your negative non thinking, or can you refute what I have just presented here? Are those prophecies (RIGHT) or (WRONG)? Is the Bibles history (RIGHT) or (WRONG)? Is the science that I revealed in the Bible such as the paths through the sea, (RIGHT) or (WRONG)?
I have already point out to you where science has been shown in the Scriptures, even giving you links. You have remained strangely silent on that. How many times do I need to repeat myself? And if the Bible is a fictional Book, why are it's prophecies being fulfilled literaly? Hear again you have remaind strangely silent. I am still waiting for you to respond and explain to me how these prophecies could of occured if the Bible has a flawed story line. I have spoken of revealed science, history, and prophecy. Can you respond to anything I have presented here? Or will you just continue to repeat your bland negative statements that lack content?
The paths through the Sea were discovered because of what was revealed first in the Scriptures. The prophecies occuring in Israel today, were first spoken of in the Scriptures. Historical accuracy of the Bible were mocked by non believers like you, yet time has proven such men wrong, and the Bible correct. Now, will you continue in your negative non thinking, or can you refute what I have just presented here? Are those prophecies (RIGHT) or (WRONG)? Is the Bibles history (RIGHT) or (WRONG)? Is the science that I revealed in the Bible such as the paths through the sea, (RIGHT) or (WRONG)?
Oh I'm sorry Campbell, I missed the part where you apparently satisfied the prerequisites for this discussion.
Impossible Challenge #1 "The Bible rests on Sound Science" - Where was your independent study (aside from "it's written in the bible) that talking serpents and talking donkeys are scientifically possible? Did you make that case already? Men created from dust, women from dustman's rib? Burning bushes not consumed that talk? Men swallowed by whale for three days and lives? Animals all over the world getting on a boat in Israel? Men dead for three days who come back to life? (Please don't cite Dawn of The Dead movie please. ) Etc.
In addition, plenty of books can be written that perpetuate a self-contained prophecy myth. Let's see 1) Dune 2) Star Wars 3) Lord Of The Rings...I'm sure there are many more that other people can suggest. The point is, when you continue a storyline across many books with many authors, we call that a book series...see Spider-Man or X-Men comic books as the colored pictures may help you with this.
You haven't made any case to warrant a real challenge. Nostradamus seems to be making more "predictions" that are relevant to current (recent) events than the bible. Why don't you set-up a religion around him?
You probably wow your circle of friends with your bible knowledge, but around here it's more of the same. We're not impressed.
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) Etc.
