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Yes, David Berkowitz was and still is a nut, (IMO) and should never be released into society..His repentance and forgiveness remains between him and God..I know what the bible and many christians say about forgiveness.."If God can do it , you should also"..To me that sounds like we are putting ourselves on the same level as God..That seems prideful to me..No matter how much I would like to say that I forgive the worst of the worse, but I cannot, because of the victims I really think that God forgives the person, but keeps them out of society, and the temptation to do it again..If a person is truly repentant, he should be satisfied with paying his debt to society behind bars for the rest of his life, and allow God to bring him joy, comfort and a clean conscious, not me..
My statement in post 47 stands..Only God knows the heart and soul of a person claiming to be repentant..
Last edited by Alpha8207; 02-08-2008 at 12:02 AM..
Reason: changed post number
Rev 20:13 "The sea gave up the dead who were in it and death and hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged each on according to his works".
If those in Hades are dead, then how can they suffer?
How can something which is not material, physical... a soul, suffer from flames which are material, physical? Also how can there be a physical fire in a spiritual realm?
How can something which is not material, physical... a soul, suffer from flames which are material, physical? Also how can there be a physical fire in a spiritual realm?
JMHO, There are no eternal flames for the soul, spirit, conscious or physical body..
How can something which is not material, physical... a soul, suffer from flames which are material, physical? Also how can there be a physical fire in a spiritual realm?
I believe that the lake of fire, hell is a real literal place and I do believe people will eventually be sent there for eternity because they have rejected Jesus. I believe this what the Bible teaches.
Gods word is final. God said "Thou shalt not..." When we sin we are sinning against God. It does not matter what we do, it is against him. If we kill another person, that person whether a believer in him or not belongs to him because he is creator. He created all things. So our act is against something or someones that belongs to him. So our penalty is to not spend eternity with him. The only other place of final existance where God is not, is in hell. Hell was created for Satan and the Angels that fell with him. Satan hates God and God's image, so Satan will do all he can to distroy God's image. Since man (and woman) were created in the image of God, Satan will spend eternity torturing humans.
It is written: Luke 12:47: And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
48: But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.
So in hell there is some type of level system. It is probably not based on those who did more violent acts, but rather those who knew God in this world more and yet still ended up in hell will be tortured the most. I think that it follows the scripture that we are changed from glory to glory. If we are changed more and more into the image of God's son Jesus Christ, then forsake him, Satan will take advantage of us and torture us all the more.
A person who spends all of his life acting like the devil is the devil's son. Is Satan not the father to all who do not believe in God? So when an evil person goes to hell they will be less tortured because they are Satan's children (they will still be tortured because Satan is vile, and hates and there is no mercy found in him).
A person who spends all of his life acting like the devil is the devil's son. Is Satan not the father to all who do not believe in God? So when an evil person goes to hell they will be less tortured because they are Satan's children (they will still be tortured because Satan is vile, and hates and there is no mercy found in him).
I knew there was a good reason for me to be acting like the devil for so long.
Less torture for me!
well first off sin only come in sizes in this world, because scales help keep us balance since we are prone to being unfair and excessive. measurements and sizes help us keep to a more honest and balance way of life as we deal with one another.
when it comes down to those things concerning God all who do sin always sin against God first and man second. God sees all, and because he is all knowing, he is the first to be offended and sinned against when one does wrong.
from God's perspective and all things spiritual, sin has no size. you can't do something really big good, and you can't commit little sins. Sin is always against God because he is Holy which is the same as sinless. since God is holy sin cannot ever be in his presence.
now when men commit sins and practice sins with nothing given to the thought of it and it's removal from ones life, then when sin is judged by God and condemed to hell, all those who kept it in their lives will go with it to hell.
God doesn't make people go to heaven any more than he makes them go to hell. God allow mans life to tell Him where they want to spend eternity. if you love lies, killing, stealing, and you just love living life without God, or even refuse to claim him as your God, then God loves each person enough to send him or her to an environment they are most familiar with.
it's just that hell is hell, and it's for those who preferred to live without God, and hell is what you get any place God is not. what we encounter on earth is horrible but hell has terrors and dreads that make life on earth still somehow far, far better than hell. hell is a place for people who don't believe in him, those who didn't think eternale life was worth searching out, and those who practiced every evil way they could imagin. hell is what you get when you put all God ignoring, God hating, and God dis-believing people all together, and then toss in all fallen angels called demons who also spent their time winning others to hell with them. they are skilled at turning man away from God and very skilled at conviencing man God is not real, and just as conviencing that the devil himself is not real.
*****for man "choice" is a super power because it can bring life to him or death. it's been this way since the garden and remains the same today.
those who love God and live as to keep him in the center of all that they do, when they pass on God will put them in the environment they most love. heaven is the place where God is and all those who love to keep him in the center of their lives. heaven is what you get when you put all true lovers of God together, and then toss in holy angels who served God by helping men in the earth, and of course God himself is there.
just think about it. why would God want to put people in his heavenly home who don't believe in him? that would be mean of God. and why could God put people among those who worship God when some hate the very mention of his name? God loves us all enough to send us where we choose to be by how we live. God knows we don't always mean what we say, so he watches our lives. if your life has no Lord God, and you don't believe in him, then you have nothing to worry about when you die, because you won't even have to spend eternity in heaven with him or his loving family.
Sins here on Earth have different price tags anywhere from speeding to murder,but on a Heavenly perspective God hates all sin especially when one continually lives in that sin.
A person,who has committed a murder has a chance to attain the kingdom of Heaven if he has true repentance with all of one.s heart and mind where one has no chance if they have turn their backs completely on God.
Can you not see how ridiculous your notion of sin is. An unbeliever murders an unbeliever, let's say the victim cursed the murderer, the murderer reacts, pull his gun or knife and kills the other guy.
The murderer is convicted and sentenced to life or death, while in prison, he is ministered to and repents and finds Jesus.
So the victim, who also sinned, before his life was snuffed out goes to hell and the murderer goes to heaven. Now if that seems logical or fair, then IMO your belief is perverted.
I hate playing the Hitler card, (Goodwin's Law) by your premise, 6M Jews who in all likelihood never accepted Christ in their lifetime, end up in the same place as their persecutor, and you know for sure beyond a shadow of doubt that Hitler did not repent of his deeds before he blew his brains out? If he did truly repent then, he makes it to heaven and the Jews not - get real!
Your POV has God dependant on your pathetic/puny decisions/actions.
small god BIG DEVIL.
You really need to study more and discover the Father of Love, the one you know seems very schizophrenic IMO
Blessings
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I really think that God forgives the person, but keeps them out of society, and the temptation to do it again..If a person is truly repentant, he should be satisfied with paying his debt to society behind bars for the rest of his life, and allow God to bring him joy, comfort and a clean conscious, not me..
