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I understand this to be completely symbolic, yet time and again I run into Christians who believe this is going to be some sort of end-times credit card, bar code tattoo, national ID card, etc.
Here is the passage from the Revelation of St. John, Chapter 13, verses 11, 16-18:
Quote:
11 Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb and he spoke as a dragon.
16 And he causes all, the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free men and the slaves, to be given a (AV)mark on their right hand or on their forehead,
17 and he provides that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name.
18 Here is wisdom Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for the number is that of a man; and his number is six hundred and sixty-six.
If that is literal, if people in the end times are going to receive actual marks on their hands and heads in order to buy and sell, then explain this:
Quote:
1 Then I looked, and behold, the Lamb was standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His name and the name of His Father written on their foreheads. -- Revelation 14:1
Keep in mind that the Revelation of St. John was not written with chapters and verses. (Later translators added those.) John did not see his vision in verses. It was all connected.
So, if the logic goes that in the end times, folks will have to have the mark of the beast in order to go shopping, then logically shouldn't those who deny the beast and remain faithful to Christ have to have a tattoo on their foreheads? If the Mark of the Beast is supposed to be a literal mark, then why not the Mark of the Lamb?
Actually, my understanding is that the mark of the beast will come after the Rapture. It's a matter of interpretation on when events will unfold...what is to happen before the Rapture and after.
Personally, I believe the mark will most likely come after the Rapture when the anti-christ reigns and promises a false peace...it is during these times of tribulation that many will be deceived and fooled into taking the mark. This is why the discrepancy between the scriptures in which you are referring to.
However, I am not a Bible scholar...this is my understanding from my own reading as well as what I have been taught in my own church
Actually, my understanding is that the mark of the beast will come after the Rapture. It's a matter of interpretation on when events will unfold...what is to happen before the Rapture and after.
Personally, I believe the mark will most likely come after the Rapture when the anti-christ reigns and promises a false peace...it is during these times of tribulation that many will be deceived and fooled into taking the mark. This is why the discrepancy between the scriptures in which you are referring to.
I don't see a discrepancy. My point is that BOTH are symbolic. I just don't understand how some folks can take a few verses, insist on their literalness, then take the very next verse, which uses some of the same language, and say it is symbolic.
I say they're both symbolic, that all this fretting over a literal, physical mark of the beast is missing the point.
I don't see a discrepancy. My point is that BOTH are symbolic. I just don't understand how some folks can take a few verses, insist on their literalness, then take the very next verse, which uses some of the same language, and say it is symbolic.
I say they're both symbolic, that all this fretting over a literal, physical mark of the beast is missing the point.
But hey, I'm certainly no Bible scholar either.
Actually, both verses (but especially the one in Revelation regarding the mark of the beast) are pretty explicit. I really do not think that either one are symbolic, but especially not the mark of the beast. I believe the mark of the beast is going to be as real as it gets.
Yes, there are some parts of the Bible that we have to take as literal, some parts are obviously symbolic...however, there are some things that we just have to read between the lines about.
There may be better websites but here is one link you can go to in order to get more info on it The Mark of the Beast
Some people believe that the mark of the beast is literally going to be 666 printed right on the hand or forehead. Some people believe that the number 666 will be implemented somewhere within a larger number (such as a barcode). From some research I did several years ago, (and this is something that I read, can't remember where nor it's validity) supposedly, there is a computer (I think in France?) that is supposed to hold the number of every person in the world. Again, SUPPOSEDLY, this computer is so massive (not sure in size or magnitude/capability) that it is called "The Beast". Again, I do not know how credible that information is...but just some intresting info I thought you might be intrested in. I will try to find more info on it and get back to you if you want
I'm not to up and up on Revelations so please bear with me. Wouldn't everyone on earth after the Rapture wear the mark of the beast? The way I understood the Rapture was people just disappeared into heaven because they were saved. Those left on earth were the ones who never accepted Jesus into their hearts, correct? So, if that is the case than why the need for the mark of the beast? Wouldn't everyone at that point left on earth be one of satan's minions? Or is there still chance for those who aren't saved? If that is the case than I think I'll just wait and watch the fireworks!
Well, suppose that I am Christian and my younger son is but my husband and his cousin are not. I have tried to get them to go with me to Church and to accept Jesus as Savior. They keep refusing.
SUddenly people are missing, thousands of people. Vanished into thin air.
Now, people like my husband and his cousin have heard of Christ and there is a chance that they will realize their mistake and accept Him after the Rapture.
There could be many like them, who were either fence straddlers or just stubborn or who might have thought they were saved and then found out they were not. I have the opinion that they will have a chance to be saved, don't know that for fact, but it is my hope. These would have to decide to refuse the mark of the beast. Who is to say that if they become saved they won't automatically have the name of God on their forheads?
Revelation, being written in apocolyptic scripture is simply a very hard read to begin with.
I believe the mark of the beast is a real prediction of events to come. Those who accept the mark of the beast on their hand or forehead will not enter heaven, but suffer eternally. I also believe the mark will arrive after the rapture of the church. This is not to say that there's no hope for those not taken in the rapture. I believe after the rapture, there will still be time for those who choose to be saved. The 144,000 will be anointed by God to proclaim the gospel to the lost during these times. The way you'll know they are who they claim to be is because they will have God's mark on their foreheads. It will be a literal mark, just like the mark of the beast. This is my belief anyway.
Actually, my understanding is that the mark of the beast will come after the Rapture. It's a matter of interpretation on when events will unfold...what is to happen before the Rapture and after.
Personally, I believe the mark will most likely come after the Rapture when the anti-christ reigns and promises a false peace...it is during these times of tribulation that many will be deceived and fooled into taking the mark. This is why the discrepancy between the scriptures in which you are referring to.
However, I am not a Bible scholar...this is my understanding from my own reading as well as what I have been taught in my own church
Actually, both verses (but especially the one in Revelation regarding the mark of the beast) are pretty explicit. I really do not think that either one are symbolic, but especially not the mark of the beast. I believe the mark of the beast is going to be as real as it gets.
I don't understand how one comes to that conclusion. You've got a dragon with goat horns. Obviously symoblic, right? Or do dispensationalists really believe that there will be a goat-horned dragon ruling the world? The Mark of the Beast is taken literally, but in the very next verse, you've got only (and that too is pretty explicit) 144,000 on the side of the Lamb, and they too have a Mark. How can you take one verse out of a whole bunch of verses, insist on its literalness, then write off the rest as symbolic?
I don't really get why anyone needs a mark at all. Obviously God knows the ones he wants from the ones he doesn't want, mark or no mark. People speak of others going to heaven or hell right now--before this "rapture"--and those people didn't have to be marked so that God and the Devil could tell whose they were.
As for the second-chance idea, am I getting this part right? -- The rapture has happened and all these people have disappeared and now people on earth are under Satan and suffering. Who WOULDN'T say, "Okay, yeah, I've changed my mind"? So *everyone* would ask for a second chance, except for a few crazies. Right? But I might not be interpreting that the right way.
(Also...psssssssst...I hope none of you-all saying you believe in a second chance are among the people who chided the reincarnationists here a couple weeks ago for "just wanting a second chance". )
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