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Great suggestions. In Riverside, just over the SD County Border, I'd take Temecula or Murietta for retirement over Vista any day.
Not to hijack OP's thread, but I'd really love some more from Rosie and Sassberto on this.
Temecula doesn't seem nearly as moderated by ocean proximity as Vista does -- it seems Temecula has significantly more daily temperature swing (cold/colder nights, hot/hotter days) than Vista.
Temecula appears to be at least an hour's drive from the beach with no traffic. Getting to the Carlsbad Village/beach area from Vista takes a pretty reliable 15-18 minutes. That's avoiding peak rush times which a retiree can do.
As far as Vista vs. Carlsbad: what am I missing besides closer to beach? IMO, the edge between Shadowridge and Carlsbad is pretty blurry. In fact, Shadowridge (Vista) seems nicer than the adjoining part of Carlsbad, and nicer than many other Carlsbad areas until you get into the $800-900K+ single family parts of Carlsbad. Schools are better in Carlsbad but obviously that's not a factor for a retiree.
Not to hijack OP's thread, but I'd really love some more from Rosie and Sassberto on this.
Temecula doesn't seem nearly as moderated by ocean proximity as Vista does -- it seems Temecula has significantly more daily temperature swing (cold/colder nights, hot/hotter days) than Vista.
Temecula appears to be at least an hour's drive from the beach with no traffic. Getting to the Carlsbad Village/beach area from Vista takes a pretty reliable 15-18 minutes. That's avoiding peak rush times which a retiree can do.
As far as Vista vs. Carlsbad: what am I missing besides closer to beach? IMO, the edge between Shadowridge and Carlsbad is pretty blurry. In fact, Shadowridge (Vista) seems nicer than the adjoining part of Carlsbad, and nicer than many other Carlsbad areas until you get into the $800-900K+ single family parts of Carlsbad. Schools are better in Carlsbad but obviously that's not a factor for a retiree.
Vista has some really, really ratty sections of run-down homes and unkept properties, grafitti in suburban areas, small single family homes with 12+ people in them, etc. The city has no real police, code enforcement, community services, etc. Shadowridge is sort of a master-planned community island. You pay a premium for the location but everything else is a big step down from Temecula IMO. And I know it's a bit hotter in IE but not nearly as much as people think. And finally - even though terrible schools is not a direct issue for a retiree, what does it tell you about the people who live there and who's going to be living there in the next 10 years? San Marcos would be a big step up but is more of a cookie-cutter suburbia than Vista.
If you are working and earning significant money, CA is probably the worst of the 50 US states. . . .But overall, from a financial standpoint it's better to live in a LCOL during your prime earning years and live in CA during your retirement then vice versa.
Absolutely this. I've said it over and over. From a financial point-of-view, California is one of the worst states in the nation for young adults and young families, due to the outrageous cost-of-living and sky-high taxes, fees, and utilities costs. You're much better off working in a low cost-of-living state with minimal taxes, banking it, and banking that money for the rest of your life. Then in retirement, California becomes easy to afford.
Vista has some really, really ratty sections of run-down homes and unkept properties, grafitti in suburban areas, small single family homes with 12+ people in them, etc. The city has no real police, code enforcement, community services, etc. Shadowridge is sort of a master-planned community island. You pay a premium for the location but everything else is a big step down from Temecula IMO. And I know it's a bit hotter in IE but not nearly as much as people think. And finally - even though terrible schools is not a direct issue for a retiree, what does it tell you about the people who live there and who's going to be living there in the next 10 years? San Marcos would be a big step up but is more of a cookie-cutter suburbia than Vista.
My real experience is with Shadowridge but forays into Vista north of 78 lead me to generally agree with you if all your negatives about Vista are for N of 78 (except the expensive mountainside stuff) and generally exclude Shadowridge. If you were in fact saying you think Shadowridge is a community you pay a big premium for and is a big step down from Temecula, I'm curious. I'm admittedly not very familiar with Temecula, but a quick look suggests that in Shadowridge vs Temecula you are giving up house square footage for being closer to the ocean. Schools in both are good but not very good like Carlsbad, Encinitas, etc.
Not having top schools can be an indicator of an undesirable area/neighborhood, or it can be an indicator of an area that simply has a lot of childfree and/or retired residents.
If you were in fact saying you think Shadowridge is a community you pay a big premium for and is a big step down from Temecula, I'm curious. I'm admittedly not very familiar with Temecula, but a quick look suggests that in Shadowridge vs Temecula you are giving up house square footage for being closer to the ocean. Schools in both are good but not very good like Carlsbad, Encinitas, etc.
Not having top schools can be an indicator of an undesirable area/neighborhood, or it can be an indicator of an area that simply has a lot of childfree and/or retired residents.
I don't think Shadowridge is a step down from Temecula but you are paying a premium to live there for not much more than proximity to the ocean. Vista's school problems are not due to childfree / retirees, it's due to the very low educational attainment of a large portion of the population.
I was/am speaking personally, but here are the reasons why I'd opt for Temecula for retirement over Vista (I'm already retired, by the way):
- Not everyone likes coastal weather. I don't mind a bit of hot weather, and Temecula is hardly Phoenix or even Borrego Springs in terms of heat. I already live inland, and I like that it is pretty much always sunny, clear and dry here, even when the coast is socked in by fog or June gloom or damp weather. I don't melt when the thermometer hits 90 (or even 100). I just jump in the pool or turn on the AC, knowing that once the sun goes down, temps will cool off.
- I don't have a huge need to spend my retirement sitting on the beach every day (does anyone here really?) so being 45 minutes to an hour from the ocean is fine for me.
- As a retiree, I think I'd enjoy the easy access to wineries and events at the casino in Temecula. All the shopping I'd need is close by in Temecula. Temecula also has a lot of city festivals and events to keep things interesting and it has a great program of classes for seniors. It's no longer the "middle of nowhere" place it was 30 years ago; it's a growing city of over 110,000 people.
- As a retiree, I'd like to get the most for my housing dollars. In Temecula, $400,000 - $450,000 buys me a newer single family home in a nice, upscale neighborhood. It probably won't get me into Shadowridge unless it's a serious fixer or a foreclosure that I'm lucky enough to somehow snag.
- I'm a young retiree, so there's a good chance that at some point I'd need to move/sell again, so resale potential and potential for home appreciation are still important to me. A growing city with excellent schools like Temecula will probably be a better option in this regard then Vista.
- The regular violent crime stories from Vista give me pause especially in North Vista (but there have been incidents in South Vista too). Sure, you can say that you aren't going to be affected by gangs or drugs, but as the murder last week of the woman in Escondido who got caught up in a gang gunfight while driving home from church shows, gang stuff doesn't always stay in certain areas.
Shadowridge and other upscale parts of Vista are nice enough and comparable to Temecula (although the orginal poster didn't say he was retiring in Shadowridge, just "Vista), and I suppose you could do all of your shopping in Carlsbad from there, but as a retiree, I'd rather live in a city where everywhere is pretty upscale and safe, especially as I grow older.
No offense intended to anyone who lives in Vista! And, certainly no place is 100% safe or perfect. I'm sure Temecula has its issues too.
However, those are my personal reasons for why I'd lean towards Temecula over Vista for retirement if I had to pick between them.
But, this is all moot, since the original poster has already determined that Vista is his choice for retirement. And, that's the nice thing about California: there's something for everyone here as long as your pocketbook can afford it
Thanks Suburb Guy but I'm not afraid of Mexicans and don't plan on dealing drugs or guns so I'm not likely to run into these guys. Law enforcement will take care of them. I actually like Latinos.
See below
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassberto
Vista has some really, really ratty sections of run-down homes and unkept properties, grafitti in suburban areas, small single family homes with 12+ people in them, etc. The city has no real police, code enforcement, community services, etc. Shadowridge is sort of a master-planned community island. You pay a premium for the location but everything else is a big step down from Temecula IMO. And I know it's a bit hotter in IE but not nearly as much as people think. And finally - even though terrible schools is not a direct issue for a retiree, what does it tell you about the people who live there and who's going to be living there in the next 10 years? San Marcos would be a big step up but is more of a cookie-cutter suburbia than Vista.
I don't think Shadowridge is a step down from Temecula but you are paying a premium to live there for not much more than proximity to the ocean. Vista's school problems are not due to childfree / retirees, it's due to the very low educational attainment of a large portion of the population.
Thanks for all your feedback!
Some interesting data:
Vista Shadowridge area (199.04 and 199.05)
HS or higher: 93%
Bachelor's or higher: 37%
Masters+: 10%
HHI: $59K (average of the two medians)
Rolando area (29.02 and 29.03)
HS or higher: 83%
Bachelor's or higher: 26%
Masters+: 9%
HHI: $52K (average of two medians)
Temecula is hard to concisely define and contains a higher number of smaller (by population) tracts, but the highest tract has a bachelor's rate of 38% a number in the low to mid 30's, a number in the 20's and one is below 20%. Rough guesstimate would be 34% average. Masters rough average 11 or 12%. Median HHI does appear to be quite a bit higher overall -- roughly double Shadowridge or Rolando.
Now most parts of places like Carlsbad and Encinitas have bachelor's rates all over 45% and plenty in the 60's or higher.
I'm probably gonna get shouted down, but I think SoCal is actually easier to handle in retirement than earlier in life. If you are working and earning significant money, CA is probably the worst of the 50 US states. State income tax is steeply progressive and goes up to 13%, I believe the highest of any state. If you are deemed a CA resident, ALL income earned--even in other states or countries--is deemed taxable under the high CA rate. Assuming you save a decent % of your income, you will need less income once retired since you've switched from needing expenses+savings to just expenses. Also, your expenses themselves should be lower in retirement. If you have kid(s), they will presumably be out of the house by then. The biggest expense for most -- a mortgage -- is probably paid off by the time you retire and prop 13 keeps real estate taxes low even when property appreciates wildly. Depending on your savings situation, some of the money for expenses in retirement may be coming from post-tax sources.
That said, are there "cheaper" states in which to retire? Absolutely. For example, If I remember right, CA treats cap gains as ordinary income no matter what. But overall, from a financial standpoint it's better to live in a LCOL during your prime earning years and live in CA during your retirement then vice versa. Personally, I wouldn't want to spend all those years when I'm working hard and (maybe) raising kids to be in CA and then have to "slum" it in an area with crappier outdoor options when I'm retired and with all the time in the world.
SoCal may be easier to *stay* during retirement than earlier in life. But for someone who is retired to move here and try to find reasonably priced housing (either renting or buying) there's not much that's affordable. And anyone moving in to SoCal hasn't yet benefited from Prop 13. Retired peoples expenses don't necessarily lessen - often they just shift, say from paying for kids to paying for health care.
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