Living in San Francisco, pros and cons (crime, buying)

[Calwine]

After these posts I have a good insight of San Francisco.
Thanks to everyone

[04kL4nD]

Originally Posted by JasonF

You do understand that garbage that gets put in bags/cans and picked up is not the issue, yes? You do understand that properly handled waste is not the same as throwing garbage on the sidewalk, right? You do understand that garbage that's going to its proper destination on a truck dedicated to that task is not the same as an overflowing trash can with people's lunch containers piled up around it, slowly getting blown all over the street, right?

The issue is not sheer volume of garbage produced and it never has been. I'm not sure why you're deflecting to something only tangentially related to the actual discussion, other than that you have no defense of the situation in SF so you'd rather just change the subject to something irrelevant.

Yeah I know how garbage collection works. I actually posted links to TWO articles discussing the topic in NYC

Since you keep moving the goal posts, I will repeat myself yet again.

On the whole, SF does NOT have more garbage on the streets than NYC. You both are only talking about Manhattan and ignoring the rest of the buroughs. SF is 47 square miles, NYC is about 300. SF has 800k people, NYC has 8.5M. You must not go off the beaten path very much in NYC, because I have seen sewer rats the size of house cats and alleyways with towering piles of garbage bags that block you from passing through. Summer time in NYC is not a pleasant time to be riding the subway and the stench of urine is just as bad, if not worse, than some of SF's worst BART stations.

I already stated that several SF neighborhoods are indeed very gross and grimy, especially Civic Center (hello Tenderloin), Chinatown, and various places along Mission Street (16th/Mission is terrible). The Castro has gotten pretty bad too lately, along with parts of Polk St, the Haight, SOMA, Nob Hill, and Union Square.

But no, Pac Heights is not covered in garbage, Potrero Hill is not covered in garbage, St Francis Wood is not covered in garbage, the Avenues are not covered in garbage, the Wharf/Pier 39 is not covered in garbage (surprisingly enough, given how touristy it is), Alamo Square is not covered in garbage, Treasure Island is not covered in garbage, SFSU/USCF/USF/CCSF campuses are not covered in garbage, AT&T Park is not covered in garbage, Seacliff is not covered in garbage, GG park is not covered in garbage, the Presidio is not covered in garbage, Ocean Beach is not covered in garbage, the Golden Gate bridge isn't covered in garbage, Cole Valley isn't covered in garbage, Russian Hill isn't covered in garbage, and while I haven't been to the Marina/Cow Hollow in ages, there weren't covered in garbage either, the last time I checked.

If you want to argue that NYC's super touristy spots are much cleaner than most of SF's super touristy spots, I guess that's a fair point, but that's not what I was talking about. People have a tendency to exaggerate and say that ALL of SF is filled with trash and homeless people and it's not even close to the truth.

Some of you should probably get out more, and live a little. Garbage, homeless people, drug addicts, prostitutes, etc are all part of urban life. Some of the greatest cities in the world have areas that will expose you to the aforementioned, but if you're bothered by poverty, garbage, and seediness, you should just stay home or move to Singapore.

[sav858]

I can't believe any one is that delusional to claim NYC is "a lot" cleaner and has less trash than SF lol. They throw bags of trash on the street and have a huge rat problem.

America's Dirtiest Cities | Travel + Leisure

NYC subway cars are relatively clean but the stations are even worse than BART and MUNI, it's like a half inch thick layer of grease, grime, and dust coats everything.

I don't hear about BART and MUNI trains being delayed because trash constantly catching fire on the tracks like in NYC:
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/21/n...rash.html?_r=0

Track fires are an enormous problem in an underground network that transports six million people nearly every day with ever-diminishing efficiency. In 2014, there were 614 fires; last year, that number climbed to 707. In nearly every instance, the cause was clear: an excess of trash strewn onto the tracks.

NYC is so much filthier, get real.

[ttocs99]

Originally Posted by NOLA101

NYC is a TON cleaner than SF. Like huge difference. Manhattan is spotless compared to SF.

And the BART and MUNI are much smellier and bum-infested than the MTA.

Holy moly, I don't know if you've ever been to NYC. This is such nonsense, it's almost not worth a reply (almost).


I LIVE in NY currently, I travel EVERY single day from where I live on Long Island, through Manhattan, and to NJ where I work. I also just came back from SF after a week's vacation (Including several BART and Muni Rides), and go there every 2 years on vacation. I also lived in the Bay Area from 1999-2006. So I think I'm a pretty good judge.


What you are saying in your 1st paragraph is a joke and Trump level false. It's silly to even say what you're saying. I'm sorry, but I'm going to respectfully disagree with you 100%. Neither city is a "TON cleaner", but NY certainly isn't "a TON cleaner" than SF. Those are the words of a SF hater, or just someone who is misinformed.

[bmw335xi]

I visit San Francisco quite frequently since I moved because my GF's family is there. I also visit NYC quite frequently because it's only a cheap and short 2.5 hour flight from my new home. There is no comparison between NYC (Manhattan) and San Francisco (Proper). It is so much cleaner, less homeless ridden and just so much more world class. San Francisco is honestly might be the dirtiest, most homeless ridden city in modern society and it's population isn't even that big, which is the crazy part. Now I will say that the surrounding areas of San Francisco are cleaner and nicer than Manhattan, when I think of Marin and the Peninsula. However, I will admit that NYC isn't as clean as when Bloomberg was in charge. Blasio is a disgrace to NYC., even with that being said, NYC doesn't even come close to the level of filthiest and amount of homeless.

[sav858]

Please find me one list or ranking showing SF dirtier/having more litter than NYC ...

[bmw335xi]

Originally Posted by sav858

Please find me one list or ranking showing SF dirtier/having more litter than NYC ...

I wish people would stop taking rankings so seriously, most rankings are done by people who never step foot in either city.

All you need to do is travel... as someone who has lived in SF and now frequently visits both cities, I can say without a doubt, NYC is so much cleaner... visit for yourself if you don't believe me. And the crazy thing is NYC is so much bigger.

[sav858]

Originally Posted by bmw335xi

I wish people would stop taking rankings so seriously, most rankings are done by people who never step foot in either city.

All you need to do is travel... as someone who has lived in SF and now frequently visits both cities, I can say without a doubt, NYC is so much cleaner... visit for yourself if you don't believe me. And the crazy thing is NYC is so much bigger.

No they are not, not sure where you get that from. Just sounds like an excuse to me because you know you won't find one. I've visited NYC multiple times, so much better than SF but also a lot dirtier. There is a reason there are regular trash fires along it's subway system....

[bmw335xi]

Where did you go? I lived in SF up until 2016 and have gone back three times since, I've been going to NYC every year for the past 3, last being this year. Never once did I find it even close to SF's level of trash. Every time I go, I think wow this is a world class city. In SF, it's this place has potential if they just cleaned it up and stopped letting homeless people camp, litter and shoot up everywhere.

[Scorpion3510]

I can't speak to NYC as I've only travelled there annually, but I will say this. I've lived in New Orleans (shortly after Katrina), Baltimore, DC in the 90's, and Cleveland. SF by far is the dirtiest out of all of them. I work near the Civic Center BART and it's terrible. I've never seen so many people blatantly shooting up everywhere, insane behavior, trash, human waste, and open air drug deals than here. I've seen people spitting on other people, guys slapping women across their faces, yelling, fighting (with bladed weapons although no firearms), and a roving gangs of thugs attacking a homeless person.


The city need to use a 2 prong methods of both helping this population (which their budget indicates they do) and enforcement. The police should offer the homeless/street population social services. If they refuse, arrest them. It's like the city has essentially ceded the area around the Civic Center to the criminal and insane. I always feel bad for the tourists I see that have wandered down here expecting to see the great American city of SF only to deal with the chaos.