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Yeah, it's the masturbatory fantasy of the tinfoil hat brigade and those obsessed with eschatology....especially some loopy survivalists holed up outside of town. So that means that the guy who has been stocking up on beans and AR15s for the past umpteen years, smug in the belief that he'll keep his family safe, will probably be the first one to have his door kicked in by the local SWAT team.
Really? And you base all this upon...what??? (We have enough trolls here already).
I think the entire fallacy about SHTF is the belief that every trace of civil order -- police, fire, emergency, local government, state government, national guard -- goes poof. Yeah, it's the masturbatory fantasy of the tinfoil hat brigade and those obsessed with eschatology, but it's really doubtful that it would go down that way barring all-out nuclear war, a meteor smacking the earth, or the Yellowstone Caldera getting frisky. If one of those three happen, well God help us all. So the odds of your retreating to your cabin in the woods and plinking off interlopers with your rifle more than a couple of weeks is pretty much non-existent.
The more likely scenario is one of balkanization with control shifting from the national level to the regional or state level. After all, a governor can call up the National Guard, declare martial law and co-opt the local police forces, and usually has his own emergency planning staff. And all those local organizations have a stake in following his commands. So really what we're talking about is what parts of the country actually have all the pieces in place to provide some kind of sustainable civil society. If you think about it, most states are larger than many countries. I mean, even Mississippi has a GDP higher than a relatively developed country such as Croatia.
What that means is we'll still have government. In fact, we'll likely have government less inclined to tiptoe around all those tedious civil rights during the emergency, especially some loopy survivalists holed up outside of town. So that means that the guy who has been stocking up on beans and AR15s for the past umpteen years, smug in the belief that he'll keep his family safe, will probably be the first one to have his door kicked in by the local SWAT team. The authorities won't be looking over their shoulders to make sure they're observing the legal niceties laid down by the Justice Department. Meanwhile the bookkeepers back in town might miss a few meals, but will likely continue filling out the forms. Yeah, some grocery stores might be looted. But sooner rather than later, a few looters will get strung up on a gibbet outside the Kroger and everyone else will get the message.
That means that there will continue to be hospitals, although short on medicine and supplies until alternative sources can be developed. That means there will be schools and universities, except likely not a lot of room on the curriculum for feminist studies degree programs. Being a self-organizing species, we will endure the initial shock and start forming committees, trying to figure out who does what. And for those those who don't believe a smaller political unit can survive, remember that some of the most vibrant, innovative cultures in history were the Greek city states before the Macedonian conquests and the Italian city states of the Renaissance.
So where would it work best? What regions are better suited for long-term survival if only using its own resources?
Northeast? No. Too crowded and too dependent on energy and food from outside.
Midatlantic? Most of the same problems, except with more agriculture.
Midwest? Certainly possible. Lots of farmland. Same for Great Plains.
Rocky Mountains? Outside of Denver and SLC, thinly populated. Might be hard to have a self-sufficient economy.
The Southwest? It really depends on maintaining a reliable source of water.
The Northwest? Certainly the brainpower, electrical power, and agriculture.
My bet would be someplace in the South. Long growing seasons. Lots of water and sunlight. Plenty of energy resources in terms of oil, gas, coal, and refining capacity. A strong transportation network, including river systems. A strong manufacturing base. A strong military culture and a cohesive, communitarian society. And, based on the original premise, $450K buys a lot of land out in the exurbs in those parts. The band from Texas across to Georgia and South Carolina would likely be the sweet spot.
beans? I will be eating better than that. plus the fact that the cops in this area think more like I do and probably have better plans in place than I do. Wyoming has plenty of water available for the people that live here. yes the growing season is not as long, but I would not expect a deep south resident to live in snow country for very long, some would but most will not.
it also helps that cops in this area do not mind my ideals or how I live, and some even come to the property to use my range as well. not too many 800+ meter ranges in the area.
I think that if SHTF does ever happen, then I expect some of the cops in the area I am in to be living in the same home as I am living. they are welcome if they want to be, as long as they respect others that live here.
That means that there will continue to be hospitals, although short on medicine and supplies until alternative sources can be developed. That means there will be schools and universities, except likely not a lot of room on the curriculum for feminist studies degree programs. Being a self-organizing species, we will endure the initial shock and start forming committees, trying to figure out who does what. And for those those who don't believe a smaller political unit can survive, remember that some of the most vibrant, innovative cultures in history were the Greek city states before the Macedonian conquests and the Italian city states of the Renaissance.
So where would it work best? What regions are better suited for long-term survival if only using its own resources?
Northeast? No. Too crowded and too dependent on energy and food from outside.
Midatlantic? Most of the same problems, except with more agriculture.
Midwest? Certainly possible. Lots of farmland. Same for Great Plains.
Rocky Mountains? Outside of Denver and SLC, thinly populated. Might be hard to have a self-sufficient economy.
The Southwest? It really depends on maintaining a reliable source of water.
The Northwest? Certainly the brainpower, electrical power, and agriculture.
My bet would be someplace in the South. Long growing seasons. Lots of water and sunlight. Plenty of energy resources in terms of oil, gas, coal, and refining capacity. A strong transportation network, including river systems. A strong manufacturing base. A strong military culture and a cohesive, communitarian society. And, based on the original premise, $450K buys a lot of land out in the exurbs in those parts. The band from Texas across to Georgia and South Carolina would likely be the sweet spot.
While agree largely with this bit please tone down your approach.
The very best aspect of this corner of CD is that there are individuals of HUGELY varying backgrounds of age, profession, experience, belief systems, education and economic levels.
It would be nearly impossible to have access to this broad a cross section of minds without this type of platform so please lets stay civil.
Really? And you base all this upon...what??? (We have enough trolls here already).
I am in a line of work where I get to deal with that community a LOT, thanks. Lots of bible beaters and Rambo wannabes.
If I've heard one guy yap on about how he's going to be able to ride out society's collapse on his fifty acres of timberland in the backwoods, I've heard a million.
I mean, yeah, we'll take their money. But a lot of these guys are borderline loopy. In my conversations with these guys at the shows and get togethers, they are less worried about society's collapse than they are looking forward to it.
While agree largely with this bit please tone down your approach.
The very best aspect of this corner of CD is that there are individuals of HUGELY varying backgrounds of age, profession, experience, belief systems, education and economic levels.
It would be nearly impossible to have access to this broad a cross section of minds without this type of platform so please lets stay civil.
Well, outside of the phrase 'masturbatory fantasy of the tinfoil hat brigade,' please point out what's objectionable in my post. I think the rest of it is quite reasonable.
Well, outside of the phrase 'masturbatory fantasy of the tinfoil hat brigade,' please point out what's objectionable in my post. I think the rest of it is quite reasonable.
Too bad, because the rest is sweet reason. In truth, the 50% who stop reading seem uninterested in the preservation of civil order anyway. Hence the term tinfoil hat brigade.
I don't care what line of business you are in, or who you meet in real life while doing it. That is your business, and should not overflow into the comments here. I don't believe you've ever met any of us here in real life, so how could you possibly know what we're thinking or fantasizing about?
"The trick... is surviving the initial onslaught."
Why? If a bomb is coming down, I'll rush to the scene. I want that thing one mile above the exact top of my head. Nobody but a vomit-lover would want to "survive" a nuclear blast.
...
Northeast? No. Too crowded and too dependent on energy and food from outside.
Midatlantic? Most of the same problems, except with more agriculture.
Midwest? Certainly possible. Lots of farmland. Same for Great Plains.
Rocky Mountains? Outside of Denver and SLC, thinly populated. Might be hard to have a self-sufficient economy.
The Southwest? It really depends on maintaining a reliable source of water.
The Northwest? Certainly the brainpower, electrical power, and agriculture.
As an off-grid organic farmer, who lives in a region with less than 10 people per square-mile, a seriously low COL, I must disagree with your assessment.
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