Maryland Residents: What do you think about Voter ID Laws? (credit card, house)

[justtitans]

I have debated this topic with a few people on here and I think the conversation is such that it merits it's own thread. I had a chance to read the Washington Post today and read this article about the 'plight' of a Pennsylvania resident to get ID. Here it goes:

For some Pennsylvanians, voter ID quest is an ordeal - The Washington Post

Some interesting points to note:

Cheryl Ann Moore stepped into the state’s busiest driver’s licensing center, got a ticket with the number C809 on it and a clipboard with a pen attached by rubber band, and began her long wait Thursday to become a properly documented voter.

She owns her home, a small rowhouse in South Philadelphia. She’s held the same job for 24 years, as a custodian at Thomas Jefferson University Hospital, where she works the 4-a.m.-to-noon shift. To get there, she takes the bus in the middle of the night. She doesn’t have a driver’s license, like thousands of working people in a city with one of the lowest rates of car ownership in the country.


She doesn’t have a bank account. “I pay cash or do layaway,” said Moore. “No credit cards; they’re dangerous.”

She stopped at work to pick up the paycheck she gets every two weeks, then went to cash it at the same place she’s been going for years.


“They know me there,” she said, “I don’t need ID for that.”

What would happen if that place no longer existed? How would she cash her checks? Does this seem responsible? What if she gets locked out of her house? How can she prove that it's her home?


The most interesting statement in the article though:

The latest poll, conducted by the Philadelphia Inquirer, indicates that some 65 percent of Pennsylvania voters support the law. The same poll shows Obama leading Romney by 11 points in the state.

Is this really an issue then? If a majority of the people who support this law, would vote for Obama what is the controversy? And do you all ever see this happening in MD?

[HandsUpThumbsDown]

Originally Posted by pgtitans

What would happen if that place no longer existed? How would she cash her checks? Does this seem responsible? What if she gets locked out of her house? How can she prove that it's her home?

These aren't the issues at hand. You're judging the poor.

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by HandsUpThumbsDown

These aren't the issues at hand. You're judging the poor.

Has nothing to do with being poor. There isn't even anything in the article that suggest that she is poor. You are making that assumption based on the little information that we have, but there could be more to it.

Even if she was poor, it's irrelevant, because she has enough money to go buy lunch at Subway and have a 'Louis Vuitton' purse:

With that, after four hours, Cheryl Ann Moore became the proud owner of a laminated Commonwealth of Pennsylvania Department of State for Voting Purposes Only ID card.



“I feel good!” she said. She grinned, kissed the card, put it inside a compartment in her knockoff Louis Vuitton purse and zippered it shut.

But she's poor....... What's the issue with her getting ID? Don't we all go through the same exact process to get legal, state ID?

[HandsUpThumbsDown]

Originally Posted by pgtitans

Has nothing to do with being poor. There isn't even anything in the article that suggest that she is poor. You are making that assumption based on the little information that we have, but there could be more to it.

Even if she was poor, it's irrelevant, because she has enough money to go buy lunch at Subway and have a 'Louis Vuitton' purse:

But she's poor....... What's the issue with her getting ID? Don't we all go through the same exact process to get legal, state ID?

She has no bank account. She has a knockoff purse. She is a custodian. She eats at subway.

She's poor.

The issue with getting ID is that it should be easier to vote than to open a bank account or sign up for facebook. It should be the easiest thing that to do for everyone in the country. This is a representative democracy, and that means even those who do not participate in the the other common elements of society (driving, banking, saving money) should be able to easily vote.

If you want to cast aspersions that she should have an ID, fine. Ultimately you're making it harder for her and anyone like her to vote, which is really the purpose of these laws ( and not to address the 10 cases of voter fraud that have been prosecuted nationally in the last dozen or so years).

And to think it's the conservatives that are the ones always crying about the end of freedom.

[HandsUpThumbsDown]

IDs cost money. Just one little extra expense and step to get into the polling booth. Poor or not, many might not deem it worth the expense or time (which is what the GOP is counting on with this nonsense).

Here's the father of the voter ID laws: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_tax_(United_States)

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by HandsUpThumbsDown

She has no bank account. She has a knockoff purse. She is a custodian. She eats at subway.

She's poor.

She also owns her own property and can afford to eat out. Poor is relative. There are people who don't even have a place to stay or even food to eat. It's impossible to know exactly 'how' poor she really is, that's all I'm saying

Originally Posted by HandsUpThumbsDown

The issue with getting ID is that it should be easier to vote than to open a bank account or sign up for facebook. It should be the easiest thing that to do for everyone in the country. This is a representative democracy, and that means even those who do not participate in the the other common elements of society (driving, banking, saving money) should be able to easily vote.

That's all your opinion and means absolutely nothing in the context of how laws should be handled. It should be easy, but we also shouldn't have people who make fake IDs, but it happens. These are the facts of life. Life is not easy. There is a reason why getting ID is challenging, for anyone.

Originally Posted by HandsUpThumbsDown

If you want to cast aspersions that she should have an ID, fine. Ultimately you're making it harder for her and anyone like her to vote, which is really the purpose of these laws ( and not to address the 10 cases of voter fraud that have been prosecuted nationally in the last dozen or so years).

And to think it's the conservatives that are the ones always crying about the end of freedom.

It wouldn't be any harder for her than it is for me. Again, what would you say to her if the place that she cash her checks shuts down? How would you suggest she cash her checks at that point with no ID? What if she has to move and can't get to that place anymore?

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by HandsUpThumbsDown

IDs cost money. Just one little extra expense and step to get into the polling booth. Poor or not, many might not deem it worth the expense or time (which is what the GOP is counting on with this nonsense).

Here's the father of the voter ID laws: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_tax_(United_States)

Getting subway cost money too and getting a fake Louis Vuitton purse equally cost money. It's all about priorities. I'm a believer that people will do what they ultimately value the most. If she is really that strap for cash, brown bag it and keep a small wallet on her instead of a purse. It's the excuses that I do not understand. I do not believe it's easy for everyone but people like her clearly has a means to get ID, so what's the problem. Even the wealthy have to wait the same amount of time in the DMV.

[UrbanScholar]

The laws aren't perfect but they are better than the previous ones that excluded groups from voting. My aunt has a similar profile to the woman discussed in the article but she has been voting since the 1965 with a state id (not a driver's license). She has always said that if it is important to you then you will make it happen. The truth is that only a small fraction of any population eligible to vote actually does and most of them will only do so in the presidential election. Could there be a better law? Yes but would that motivate more people to actually vote? Probably not.

[bande1102]

I don't buy the story. How did she buy a house without any identification or bank account? Pay cash? Get a job, particularly due to the I9 regs?

Also, you don't have to get a driver's license to have identification. You can also get an age of majority card (at least in MD) that only costs $15 and is good for five years. 65 and older and it's free. I guess my question is why wouldn't you want some form of identification? I think there's something else going on with people who are fighting the voter id laws.

[lasershen111]

Originally Posted by UrbanScholar

The laws aren't perfect but they are better than the previous ones that excluded groups from voting. My aunt has a similar profile to the woman discussed in the article but she has been voting since the 1965 with a state id (not a driver's license). She has always said that if it is important to you then you will make it happen. The truth is that only a small fraction of any population eligible to vote actually does and most of them will only do so in the presidential election. Could there be a better law? Yes but would that motivate more people to actually vote? Probably not.

Yeah I mean... I don't think voter ID (or not) really has much at all to do with motivating people to vote. As you said... If people are passionate enough or feel strongly enough to vote... They will find a way to do it...prioritize. Not checking people's ID's in my opinion... Isn't going to make someone who doesn't care about voting...all of a sudden say...ah...what the heck...I'm going to wait in line for who know how long to cast a vote....even though I don't really care.... Just because I don't have to show ID.

But not having voter ID really opens the doors to fraud, and cheating, on any side. I've always been tempted to do a test with some family members.... To see if we can go say we are the other person or something... To see how easy it is to vote for someone else....... But I'm sure that's illegal and wouldn't want to get in trouble. I'd still be curious to see results though....