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Ah, the old, "I'm better and smarter then you because I have a degree" crap.
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Or it's counterpart "I'm better and smarter than you because I don't have a degree." Somehow these turn into degree bashing threads, when it's the individual and the job that matters. My dad didn't graduate high school, but was very good at what he did. I couldn't do his job. By the same token, he couldn't do mine. Different things so there's no comparison to be made.
For the OP, since college, some 35 years ago, I haven't worked for someone without a degree of some kind. However I have worked for those for whom a degree was a waste of time. Not because the degree didn't matter, but because a degree couldn't help them. Some of these folks were very threatened by educated employees, because they were bluffing their own knowledge.
As in many professions 90% of people in those professions have a degree of one sort or another. As a person with at least a bachelors degree in something, How has it been working for someone without one? What was your experience? Did they act as professionals?
You mean like when I worked for Bill Gates & Steve Jobs? My experience was that in many areas they were far smarter than me and any sort of degree was meaningless/
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shoshanarose
I never worked for someone without a degree. But I have two Master's degrees and for a period of time was (temporarily) supervised by someone who had a Bachelor's degree (if that. She may have just had an Associate's degree, not sure.) It was...awkward. First of all, she was EXTREMELY threatened by me, because it was clear I was more knowledgeable and certainly more educated than she was. So...she took it upon herself to harass me, review all my charts (needlessly), and try to get me fired. (Also, truth be told, she wasn't terribly professional, couldn't speak or write a grammatical sentence, and had poor boundaries with clients.)
What was the job? The industry? I am often suspicious of over educated people, especially when the degrees aren't needed to do the job and aren't related to the job.
If it was clear to others that you were more knowledgeable than your boss, surely you have by now surpassed her and she works for you?
Quote:
Originally Posted by s1alker
The college degree shows that you are somewhat intelligent and motivated.
As I said above I am often suspicious of over educated people. Knowing the number of complete morons I do with advanced degrees, I am not sure on the "somewhat intelligent" part since so many of them simply are not very bright.
As to motivation, when I meet someone with two masters, a PHD and now they want to go to law school, the only motivation I see is avoiding real life for the comfy confines of a university.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DorianRo
.. And for those saying they have "no issues with it". You SHOULD have issues with it.. You make an effort to obtain far more formal education getting THOUSANDS Of dollars in debt only to work for high school graduates who have no debt with no formal secular higher education. You're making probably 30-50 thousand dollars LESS than those above you with only a high school education. Something is WRONG with that picture.. Sorry but thats the bottom line
I am sorry... what is the picture here?
I don't recall anyone discussing the quality of the degree. What good is a masters in Feminist Studies when your job is an analyst at an investment company? How does a masters degree in French Literature help you in working for a development company?
People are paid more or less by a company by their worth to the company. If a person with a high school education only is making $50k a year more than you and you have been at the company for any length of time it tells you how the company values your contribution.
Why do you seem to think spending more time in academia entitles you to more money in the private sector vs performance and accomplishments?
You mean like when I worked for Bill Gates & Steve Jobs? My experience was that in many areas they were far smarter than me and any sort of degree was meaningless/
What was the job? The industry? I am often suspicious of over educated people, especially when the degrees aren't needed to do the job and aren't related to the job.
If it was clear to others that you were more knowledgeable than your boss, surely you have by now surpassed her and she works for you?
The jobsite was a social service therapeutic day treatment program for people with disabilities.
She was a nurse, and I am a social worker.
However, in the U.S., social workers often are required to have a Master's degree just to get a social work job (I have an additional Master's degree in another field, before I switched careers - I am not "over-educated").
Nurses are not required to have Master's degrees to practice. Many registered nurses (RN's) have a Bachelor's degree, some have Associate's degrees and can still be an RN. I'm not sure if she had a B.A. or an Associate's degree.
She was temporarily my supervisor because the Executive Director was suddenly fired (unclear why, very unstable agency), and there was no Medical Director (the next in line in seniority) at the time.
As the nurse of the site, this woman was officially the "Associate Medical Director", so she took temporary authority over all the staff, while the higher-ups worked to hire a new Medical Director and Executive Director.
I have not "surpassed" this woman and she surely does not work for me. (I would never hired someone like her - as I said she was highly unprofessional with clients.)
I left the job as soon as she started harassing me, and promptly got a better job where I stayed several years at another agency.
As I could have predicted, this woman soon after got fired (due to the aforementioned unethical/boundary-crossing unprofessional behavior).
I also suspected - as did others - that she may have had a substance abuse problem, as she appeared high or intoxicated often (but I can't prove that).
A college degree essentially says I have just enough willpower to do a bunch of useless work so you can count on me to have enough willpower to be a total drone for your company and do a bunch of crap i cant stand. History's greatest and most successful people got to where they were despite their college degree, not because of.
Having a degree is correlated to professionalism?
Was that taught in college?
I worked in a company that produced and marketed software. My direct supervisor did not have a degree and she was hostile starting with the job interview. I was interviewed that day by three people so the decision wasn't hers alone. The CIO of this small company also without a degree was a hostile man who didn't establish any code of conduct for his supervisors. I personally witnessed his provocative behavior toward a subordinate who gave proper notice of resignation. This CIO attempted to provoke the subordinate so that he could tell him to leave right then. The atmosphere was such that one of the female supervisors didn't hesitate to tell a team member of another group to shut his manjina. Where I work now the supervisor would have gotten written up for sure.
A recent hire where I work now told me that the CIO mentioned above swore at him on a regular basis in more recent years.
I see the point of others who have worked for people with a gift who don't need a degree to excel at what they do. I've noted the points of others who have produced anxiety in supervisors that don't have degrees.
As in many professions 90% of people in those professions have a degree of one sort or another.
As a person with at least a bachelors degree in something, How has it been working for someone without one?
What was your experience?
Did they act as professionals?
Is this a serious question? As someone with 30 years in white collar Corporate America, I can attest that some of the most unintelligent and unprofessional coworkers I've ever been subjected to had a college degree.
Shall I tell you about the college educated business analyst who was running a phone porn operation from her desk at work? How about the college grad who came to work with a black eye because she got in a fist fight at a bar the night before? Or how about the wizard with the Masters Degree who was married yet hit on me on a daily basis? If you've got the time, I've got those and plenty more examples I could throw at you without even going all the way back to the 80's when everyone was doing rails in the bathroom.
The insinuation that a college education somehow equates to profesionalism is laughable. I can only presume you haven't entered the job market yet and are just young and ignorant. For that, I'll give you a break for asking the question.
I've found people with degrees usually take the fact that they have a job for granted, or as if it was owed to them. Especially the new "rash" of graduates have been lazier, they act like they know it all, and they make a hell of a lot of unfounded assumptions.
Those without, I've seen, are harder workers, they do not take things for granted, they had to work from the bottom up, and they are more than willing to listen to the wisdom of others. They have to rely more on raw talent than cushy degrees. They have more to prove. I have no problem working for someone without a degree - it doesn't mean they're less professional, have less intelligence, or are any lesser than someone WITH a degree.
I've never worked under someone without a degree, but I've worked with enough pompous, ignorant, dumb j*ck*sses with a degree to know it really means nothing.
Just my experience.
This is a pretty good post.
I'm in a creative field where degrees are nice, but do not guarantee "talent" or ability. Some people are self-taught but good at what they do. Other people have degrees but don't nurture their skills. So, I don't see much of a connection between excellence in work, and college education. Either you're good, or you're not. A lot of times a college education helps you get better at what you do, but it's by no means a guarantee.
Most of the time, everyone gets along and does their work without anyone playing some "I'm better than you" game due to their degree. Once in a while it does happen, and it's laughable when it does. Why should anyone take a person seriously when they have lousy talents and skills, but try to throw their degree around as if it makes up for their shortcomings?
I view the excessive pride over having a degree (to the extent that one overlooks someone's actual ability and skill) as a form of classism. They assume they are in a high social class than those without the degree, and by darn they're going to make sure that everyone is reminded of that constantly. That's also laughable and pathetic.
On the other hand, there are those who have a chip on their shoulder because they don't have a degree. Maybe they got that way due to some elitism or classism, but whatever the reason, they need to get over it. Many people won't care or make an issue of a lack of degree if it's not brought up constantly.
Sometimes, employers will hire someone with a degree over someone without a degree, not because they know that person can "do the job" better.
Someone with a degree "looks good" to potential clients, to licensing agents, etc. (if applicable). The degree and the person holding it adds value and clout to the company.
Also, in some industries, they are required to hire people with a particular degree and license.
You're grasping at straws here. The company that values appearance over results won't be around long enough to worry about going through too many hiring cycles.
Obviously if a professional license is required and a degree is essential to getting that license, the non-degreed individual cannot "do the job" at all which has nothing to do with the OP's complaint.
Does your check bounce? If not, such concerns about who is or is not degreed are irrelevant.
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