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There is a difference between friendly flirty and sleazy flirty. Nothing wrong with flirting if its done right, where you make the other person feel good about it. You have to calibrate and pick up if there is good rapport with the other person first, and not not go too far. It would seem he did not do that, but it does not mean he was sleazy or tying to hookup with a co-worker.
It would seem he got fired. It would seem there is something wrong with flirting with people who don't like your or feel uncomfortable around you, the rest of the company isn't uptight and over-controlling, it would seem he wasn't making the other person / people feel good after all. Do whatever you want at the bar or at home or where you are not on the clock to produce for one who is paying you, as they have the last word.
That's terrible. I feel sorry for you to lose your job for something that you did 'supposedly' wrong, but you have no clue what it was, to apologize or to modify your behavior in the future. I hope it does not impact on finding your next job. I guess you will unfortunately have to tone down your flirty nature.
A one sided system as you encountered is very much open to abuse. As someone else mentioned the broadly worded laws encompass, just being made to feel uncomfortable. Maybe you called a girl in the office, love or honey or sweetie, and she took offense and reported it as sexual harassment. You are over 50 and maybe being a bit friendly flirty with some younger women gets you the 'creep' tag.
To me harassment should mean more than one incident. Harass implies 'ongoing' action, and generally after its been made known to the individual that what they are doing/saying is unwelcome. At my jobs a few years ago one of the guys got reported for sexual harassment after he told a slightly crude joke. The thing is he heard the joke on the radio coming into work, so it was a joke that was deemed fine to publicly broadcast, and I know those women have heard much worse from some other men there. The rules can be selectively applied.
That's quite all right; thanks for the supportive words. I never called anyone "love or honey or sweetie." My guess is that the women in this office were in their 40s, so I couldn't have been seen as THAT creepy, LOL. But I could be wrong.
And yes, I do plan to modify my behavior going forward. I had been unemployed for a few months, so I was overjoyed to get the gig. And a staff recruiter (female)s who is also a former friend/colleague from a past firm brought me in while talking up the company, which caused me to lower my guard somewhat. I told my friend what had happened, and now she's keeping her guard up.
for every interaction you had with your female co-workers at this job (regardless of the label), would you do each and every one of them with your wife standing right next to you (or listening on the phone, or reading your emails)?
And some think it's ridiculous that others think they don't have to follow simple rules. That's why there are employee handbooks, and sexual harassment policies, so the coworkers of these people don't have to enforce company code, everyone follows the same set of rules.
Why would one go around asking people to please behave properly? They don't understand how to act appropriately in first place, they're not going to suddenly have a light bulb moment and care if they are offending you when they didn't take that into consideration in the beginning! They're going to tell you to 'mind your own busines' or some other defense that involves 'freedom of speech' and their right to act like an ass. That's what Human Resources Departments are for, so we all don't have to confront the idiot and become a target for retaliation.
Of all the actions that I responded to, the only one that really is wrong was the man who was telling dirty jokes. The rest are just normal behaviors that some people, but not everybody, may not like. How is somebody supposed to know, if they are not told, what behaviors each individual person does not like?
You're making too much sense in this thread. Everything you've said is common sense. I feel the same way. Why report this things on the first occasion instead of letting the person know that you're not open to what they're saying or doing. It's ridiculous to be overly P.C.
Thank you!! At least somebody agrees with me on this topic.
Op in today's world if you offend a female you,are guilty of being male at a minimum which means you are irredeemable. Nof is offended party reasonably offended especially if you are still on or8bation and the other larty is not. Don't be too friendly to work females for sure and a lot of males. Find friendship outside the workplace. I don't agree with the whole guilt of being male thing but too many do.
Flirting by any definition of flirt is high risk, I'm surprised you didn't know the rules at your experience level. Sounds like you are learning somewhat from this.
It would seem he got fired. It would seem there is something wrong with flirting with people who don't like your or feel uncomfortable around you, the rest of the company isn't uptight and over-controlling, it would seem he wasn't making the other person / people feel good after all. Do whatever you want at the bar or at home or where you are not on the clock to produce for one who is paying you, as they have the last word.
Ideally there would be clear guidelines but the laws currently are too broad/open to interpretation by the said victim. Basically the base level for behavior not offending is at the level of the most uptight/prudish person there. There should be warnings from HR or the offended person first, so the offending person knows that low level of offense with that person and modify their behavior.
I get that he is on probation but he really should have been informed of what he did wrong. You wonder how frivolous it is when they dont want to say. Maybe it BS and they he just didn't work out with his role. Who knows for sure. I get why some men here say they keep it strictly formal and discussing nothing personal at work. Its a shame it has to be so rigid like that. I have become more that way in recent years after seeing a few others go down for sexual harassment and reading of situations.
As you can see by the responses here, there are those who are LOOKING for any word or action that can be misinterpreted, deliberately at times, to be offended by. Just look at the response to the word "flirty." Pick the wrong word and the PC crowd is ready to burn you at the stake.
The sad part about all this? I have known and worked with women who were sexually harassed. And they themselves hated all those who created drama out of nothing because it trivialized the real harassment that happened to them.
Exactly!! I said that in an earlier response, in response to a female poster who had to endure sexual harassment decades ago.
I post this as a cautionary tale. I am chatty, bordering on flirty with women who I get to know and think I can read real well. That ends here for me. Watch who you talk to or what you say in an office setting. And by all means, don't look at someone of the opposite sex for more than a split second.
You obviously CANNOT read people real well. I think I know your type. You talk to the ladies thinking you're a big shot and you see them "smiling" and you think you're being funny.
But what you don't see is the fake smile they're giving you and they just can't wait for you to leave them alone. Let me guess, you also voted for Trump?
Look,, just because Trump gets away with being a bigot doesn't mean YOU will.
You're 50+ years old? lol. Stop flirting with your female co-workers and just talk to them like a normal person. How about that?
Is that so hard?
You seem to be out of touch with reality. Like most Trump supporters.
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