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CrownVic95 - CD won't let me rep you again, but you make so many valid points I felt I have to say something.
I don't know what has happened to this country; when I was growing up there was so much moral indignation and outrage over the erosion of individual rights and freedoms. Now it seems people are so self-absorbed that they don't seem to give a rap about anyone other than themselves, and if someone else's rights are being infringed then so what as along as it doesn't affect them. What they don't understand is that when the rights of society's most vulnerable members are denied, everybody's rights are imperiled. In the long run, it does affect them, but they are too blind to see it.
And those of us who express any disagreement with this type of thinking is branded "Un-American". What is more Un-American than accepting the total annhilation of personal rights and liberties?
Anyway, glad to hear I'm not completely alone in my thinking.
And I am equally glad that you spoke up here. Yes, there are way too few of us and it's often a lonely feeling for mavericks who refuse to be stampeded with the mindless herd.
I will be 60 next month and can't believe I'm in the same country in which I graduated high school in 1967. Like you, I don't know how our collective ability to think and apply common sense vanished in so few short years.
For example, just look at annerk's lastest response. I could have written it for her in advance because she thinks and says what they always think and say. They are honestly convinced that the times we live in today are "different" from any before. That the Constitution was all well and good for "simpler" times, but today's challenges somehow make it a luxury we can no longer afford. How little they understand world history. There have always been plenty of shrill voices convinced that draconian measures were necessary to deal with the challenges of the day. That is the very reason the 4th Amendment was penned all those years ago - to prevent that kind of simple minded thinking from prevailing in society and thus destroying personal dignity and freedom.
No, the only thing different about today is that we, as a society, no longer understand or value what is was that our founders and forefathers fought for or why they they did. It is a national disgrace. And I firmly believe that history will record it as such, using it as the bad example it is for the education of generations to follow.
Drug testing for pot is just a way to keep the poor and minorities away from your company. If performance is not affected, who cares if someone smokes pot or not.
Uh, yeh, I want people using heavy duty equipment or using sharp instruments smoking pot. LOL. Nice way to make sure you can be a vicitm. Good grief. Last time I checked there was no rule that only minorities and the poor could smoke pot. Hey - maybe they're poor becase they make bad choices in life; like spending money they don't have on pot?
Uh, yeh, I want people using heavy duty equipment or using sharp instruments smoking pot. LOL. Nice way to make sure you can be a vicitm. Good grief. Last time I checked there was no rule that only minorities and the poor could smoke pot. Hey - maybe they're poor becase they make bad choices in life; like spending money they don't have on pot?
Spending $10 for "entertainment" every week makes one poor?
I'm in my mid-50's. I have never used drugs a day in my life and never will. (I believe they should be legalized and controlled, but that's another discussion...) I drive a truck and, as a transportation worker, must undergo random drug screens. I also have prostate problems. Several years ago, I couldn't "produce on demand" right before Christmas. Because my company's Medical Review Officer was on vacation, I sat at home on suspension. Cost me almost $2,000 in wages. Fortunately, my company officials believed me and I was reinstated. But now I must maintain a full bladder until I leave work every day, no matter how uncomfortable, because I cannot risk losing my livlihood over something I'm not even guilty of...
Crownvic95 and Janetvj, good on "you's"; I'm sure our forefathers would be disgusted to see how We the People have corrupted their Constituition...
Last edited by Crew Chief; 09-14-2009 at 06:34 AM..
My issue is with the accuracy and reliability of these tests. Too many false positives for them to be reliable. Can an employer be sued if an employee is fired for a false Positive? I would think yes.
Imagine if pot were legalized that instead of wasting money on a failed drug screen, OP, that the candidate offered that he/she was a user before being tested. As it is everyone is hush-hush about whether they use or not and many will risk a failed test just to have a job interview. Just because they use doesn't mean they should be subjected to a life of poverty. I also see the abuse of some other more dangerous drugs going down with the legalization of pot and I'm not suggesting that those drugs be legalized.
I do agree with you however that certain job categories where public safety is an issue should continue to have mandatory testing but to test every person applying for a job is a big waste of money.
I'm in my mid-50's. I have never used drugs a day in my life and never will. (I believe they should be legalized and controlled, but that's another discussion...) I drive a truck and, as a transportation worker, must undergo random drug screens. I also have prostate problems. Several years ago, I couldn't "produce on demand" right before Christmas. Because my company's Medical Review Officer was on vacation, I sat at home on suspension. Cost me almost $2,000 in wages. Fortunately, my company officials believed me and I was reinstated. But now I must maintain a full bladder until I leave work every day, no matter how uncomfortable, because I cannot risk losing my livlihood over something I'm not even guilty of...
Crownvic95 and Janetvj, good on "you's"; I'm sure our forefathers would be disgusted to see how We the People have corrupted their Constituition...
So sorry to hear that story and that you continue to be made to suffer as a result of this police state mentality.
Like you, I have never touched an illegal drug in my life and I have a great deal of pride in my integrity. The most troublesome casualty in this drug testing madness is the concept of trust and the value of a man's word. Drug testing sneers at the idea that a man's word means anything at all and when we lose respect for the value of a man's word in society, we lose a lot.
It has been said that a man must be first trusted in order to become trustworthy. Young people today grew up in a world absent of trust, so it is little wonder that real integrity seems shorter and shorter in supply. Why do the right thing when no one is watching when no one is going to believe you anyway?
When someone fails, or refuses a drug screen, is there any record what-so-ever that another employer would have access to that would divulge this information?
Absolutely not. If they did, they'd be liable for a huge lawsuit.
I remember when my dad was an air traffic controller. We had a neighbor that made this awesome poppy seed bread for the holidays she would give us but my dad could never eat any because of the random drug testing the FAA did. So certainly if poppy seeds could be picked up as something on a drug test, the actual drug made from them would be as well.
(Edited to add: That or he just didn't like her bread and used that as an excuse)
I believe they have adjusted the drug screen to account for poppy seeds. I think you'd have to eat 11(?) poppy seed muffins or bagels in a short amount of time to flunk the test because of it now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by annerk
Actually the test can't be beat. They are more an more sophisticated--if the urine is too dilute (result of drinking too much water), if it's the wrong temperature (wasn't in the body), if it's "stale" (sample was given at an earlier time) then it will be caught. Also the test our place uses checks for all sorts of drugs, not just pot. We have a guy who takes a prescribed stimulant and he had to bring the prescription bottle with him to the testing site so they could exclude that particular type of drug when he tested positive for it.
Well, I heard of one guy who gave it his all in attempting to beat the test. He took the standard urine test and failed. He could repeat the test 3 times and but kept avoiding the testing, delaying, etc. Over several months he got in all the testing, failed them all. Guy insisted the results were wrong, got his union rep involved and it took so long to negotiate that they finally settled on a hair sample test. He showed up to work on Monday morning with his head shaved and everything else completely waxed!! Oh yes, not a hair to be found. From his eyebrows to the hair on his big toe, his nether region was waxed....between the cheeks and all. He still got canned, I guess because he couldn't comply with the drug test. Man, he should have just quit before he spent the weekend getting waxed. OUCH!!!
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He still got canned, I guess because he couldn't comply with the drug test. Man, he should have just quit before he spent the weekend getting waxed. OUCH!!!
