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I think you have a few issues confused. This is a dealing of tampering with the property of others, within the property of others.
To tell someone to mind their manners on your own property is not in violation of freedom of speech. If the KKK burned a cross on your lawn, asking them to leave is not a violation of their freedom of speech. Your right to ask them to leave overrides their freedom of speech.
A case where freedom of speech would be violated is if these people were on a public street and forced to leave. Which is what I had said, if they want to push their agenda so bad, get a billboard like everyone that has something to sell.
You are talking apples and oranges. To compare the KKK burning a cross on my lawn violating my civil rights to someone leaving a piece of paper in some pants is silly. But you are right, a business has a perfect right to ask someone to leave their store. (company policy) But that does not make it illegal to pass out tracts. Though it may offend you to have to throw a tract away or put a dollar in the salvation army bucket. You get the picture.
You are talking apples and oranges. To compare the KKK burning a cross on my lawn violating my civil rights to someone leaving a piece of paper in some pants is silly. But you are right, a business has a perfect right to ask someone to leave their store. (company policy) But that does not make it illegal to pass out tracts. Though it may offend you to have to throw a tract away or put a dollar in the salvation army bucket. You get the picture.
Yes, that is closer to what I was trying to say from the get go. The store can ask them to "knock it off" 9even if it isn't illegal) and it isn't in violation of any right or freedom.
To me organized religion isn't much better than the KKK, but I'm sure that we'll have to agree to disagree there.
Yes, that is closer to what I was trying to say from the get go. The store can ask them to "knock it off" 9even if it isn't illegal) and it isn't in violation of any right or freedom.
To me organized religion isn't much better than the KKK, but I'm sure that we'll have to agree to disagree there.
I have to agree with cleatis. I see one radical group responsible for horrible hate crimes and at most a few thousand deaths. I see another group responsible for over 100,000,000 deaths and crimes against humanity spanning 2000 years. Both are bad, but one pales in relationship to the evils of the other. My hope is humanity will see the past and understand no matter how big, powerful, and rich the organization they must be held to the same basic standards as the rest of humanity. We can not let this repeat again in both cases.
Wow. Religious nuts actually put insert religious material into merchandise in the US ? Wow. I am stunned. Are they on some kind of "heavenly commission" with rewards to follow or have they just lost the plot ?
I can't think of a more sure way to turn people away from religion !
The mind boggles quite frankly.
Can you imagine how the Churches would feel if Atheists, Muslims, Hindus, Animists etc... started to flood their post boxes with their own little messages regarding their truth.
I feel we non Christians should now have some literature printed about our beliefs and we could start putting them on church pews and pulpits, and anywhere religious people go. Find religious shops and insert as many pamphlets as possible on as much merchandise as possible.
Time for a campaign of our own. If you can't beat them, join them as they say.
The sheer lunacy of those fundies is really astonishing. And no it isn't something which will scar us , we can indeed discard those ridiculous bits of paper quite quickly.
That is hardly the point though. There is a principle at stake here, one of not being subjected to any form of harassment and like junk mail this is nothing short of harassment . Those fruitcakes need to realise that it is not OK to surreptitiously insert their message wherever they feel like it.
We are adults and should we wish to, are perfectly able and intellectually capable of going to a church for spiritual advice do we ever feel the need to. We are not children to be taken by the hand and shown the "truth". We can make our own minds up,thank you very much.
What a patronising, demeaning way to try and convince people that their "truth" is the right one.
This kind of sneaky preaching is not only really sad it is pathetic and off putting. How desperate must those misguided souls be to believe that such a ridiculous childish way of behaving will lead to conversions.
Once again thank goodness I do not live in the US, I would have problems remaining civil if those fruitcakes started to impinge on my personal space.
I guess we should laugh really, it's astonishing that any human being with even a minimum of intelligence would ever chose such a path. We should pity them. As Jesus is supposed to have said "forgive them for they know not what they do" . And if they do a psychiatrist might be in order. Maybe a straight jacket too.
As a matter of curiosity how did all those nutters come about ? Has there always been this extreme element in US society or is it a fairly recent event ?
I learn things every day on this forum and it ain't pretty...
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I feel we non Christians should now have some literature printed about our beliefs and we could start putting them on church pews and pulpits, and anywhere religious people go. Find religious shops and insert as many pamphlets as possible on as much merchandise as possible.
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Yes, that is closer to what I was trying to say from the get go. The store can ask them to "knock it off" 9even if it isn't illegal) and it isn't in violation of any right or freedom.
To me organized religion isn't much better than the KKK, but I'm sure that we'll have to agree to disagree there.
>>>>>
To me organized religion isn't much better than the KKK, but I'm sure that we'll have to agree to disagree there.
<<<<<
ROTFLOL....Yeh, all those churches with soup kitchens feeding the poor are on par with the KKK!
Really this is sad state of affairs coming from a Cristian as if Atheists all are:
People with no morals
pornographers
pedophiles
sodomites
rapists
wife beaters (or husband)
child molesters
etc.
etc.
Thankfully not all Christians think this way
I for one even as a Christian would be offended by the practice of solicitation of this manner and yes it is no better than prostitution another name for solicitation.
There is instruction not to go from house to house. (I am sure I will be accused of taking this out of context)
They would do better serving at soup kitchens and helping the helpless.
Yeh, so porn is definitely not harmful at all and all those cartoon church people in the tract are just so emotionally/spiritually damaging.......right.
>>>>>
To me organized religion isn't much better than the KKK, but I'm sure that we'll have to agree to disagree there.
<<<<<
ROTFLOL....Yeh, all those churches with soup kitchens feeding the poor are on par with the KKK!
That is hardly the sole legacy of religion. Someone here said it first, that religion (in this case christianity alone) has been responsible for more death, destruction and mayhem than a group of low rent rednecks in bed sheets could dream of.
Yeh, so porn is definitely not harmful at all and all those cartoon church people in the tract are just so emotionally/spiritually damaging.......right.
And the bible is harmless? It has more smut, philandering, pedophilia, murder, rape, pillaging, incest, backstabbing, lies, corruption , prostitution, mass murder, sodomy, abuse and probably even necrophilia than the whole porn industry could muster. It and its ideals have been anything but harmless.
Yeh, so porn is definitely not harmful at all and all those cartoon church people in the tract are just so emotionally/spiritually damaging.......right.
You miss the point I was making in that those atheists offended by this are they assumed to be OK with porn as if all atheists are porn addicts.
It is a fallacy of assumption just as your post is a fallacy of assumption - but I guess it sucks to you a Christian standing up for Atheists doesn't it?
I would side with the Atheists in placing flyer's of the most obscene nature in a Christian book store - but likely they will go through all merchandise and clean up and would likely contact the authorities and claim interference with business or private property yet christian putting flyer in clothing is not considered even a misdemeanor - obviously apparent by the christian rebuttals here. So we are left with double standards as always in the mindset of Christendom.
Based on what most have posted here wrt junk mail and other flyer's, it does seem like a waste of time as this is NOT a good way of merchandising - yes IMO this is merchandising God - want to do that open a store in said district and pay the rent and fees and taxes like all other businesses and compete then for the souls of the damned - better still open up in an area where there are porn pushing stores aka sex stores.
But no that is too dangerous, so rather do it clandestinely. The point is Jesus was NOT clandestine so why should these folk do it?
Like I said I would be offended as are the atheists and I am Christian. Why? Because it makes God look cheap.
Furthermore, I believe most Atheists have not rejected God or Jesus merely the version of Them that the church purports.
You miss the point I was making in that those atheists offended by this are they assumed to be OK with porn as if all atheists are porn addicts.
It is a fallacy of assumption just as your post is a fallacy of assumption - but I guess it sucks to you a Christian standing up for Atheists doesn't it?
I would side with the Atheists in placing flyer's of the most obscene nature in a Christian book store - but likely they will go through all merchandise and clean up and would likely contact the authorities and claim interference with business or private property yet christian putting flyer in clothing is not considered even a misdemeanor - obviously apparent by the christian rebuttals here. So we are left with double standards as always in the mindset of Christendom.
Based on what most have posted here wrt junk mail and other flyer's, it does seem like a waste of time as this is NOT a good way of merchandising - yes IMO this is merchandising God - want to do that open a store in said district and pay the rent and fees and taxes like all other businesses and compete then for the souls of the damned - better still open up in an area where there are porn pushing stores aka sex stores.
But no that is too dangerous, so rather do it clandestinely. The point is Jesus was NOT clandestine so why should these folk do it?
Like I said I would be offended as are the atheists and I am Christian. Why? Because it makes God look cheap.
Furthermore, I believe most Atheists have not rejected God or Jesus merely the version of Them that the church purports.
You make some excellent points here, particularly the part about making God look cheap. While I don't get overly excited, or upset, when I see a tract in a public place, (though I do find them annoying), I do think that if folks want to share about Jesus, surreptitiously leaving tracts lying around surely doesn't seem like a bold proclamation, does it?
Most Christians would be highly incensed if porn, or tracts about other religious/spiritual beliefs were stashed into merchandise in a Christian bookstore, (and they have every right to feel this way), but this does seem to indicate a double standard, if it can't be recognized that for the Christian to distribute tracts in the same manner, in other stores, is also wrong.
As I've said before, I'm sure most of these folks mean well, but they need to rethink this idea that scraps of paper, scattered about the countryside, really accomplishes much. I don't expect people to hide in their churches, and wait for "sinners" to darken their door, but if one wants to share about Jesus, it seems that a personal approach does a better job, (if done in love, and not with self-righteousness). I don't recall Jesus leaving tracts lying at the wells, or tacking them to trees, or walls, or stuffing in with the fish, bread, olives, figs, pomegranates, or other marketplace items.
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