Confederate Flag rally @ Stone Mountain 8/1 (Decatur: associations, racism, rated)

[Iconographer]

Originally Posted by danielj72

I don't believe most people who gravitate to the confederate battle flag are doing it for racist reasons. Several reasons they do IMO. 1. Southern pride 2. a statement of support for states rights and small government or just as a statement of protest against the federal government 3. a historical interest in the civil war 4. simply to be a "rebel" 5. to protest political correctness

These seem to me to be the most common reason you see it, NOT racism. The racists are a small minority of people who display the flag. Of all the people I have ever known who flew it I knew NONE who did it to make a racial statement. The people who are flying it in anger and defiance in recent weeks are not doing it for racial reasons either, but rather to stand up for their rights to do it.

I think your last statement sums it up very well.
I came home this week to find a Confederate flag decal on the rear window of my neighbor's truck. Mind you, this is a NJ native who has lived in Seattle for years...not exactly a stereotype. His explanation pretty much mirrored what you have said here.

[atler8]

It's unfortunate that the symbolic flag thus adopted by such people, as you noted Lovin, also happens to be the same symbol adopted for use by the Klan in the later 1800's as part of their campaign to terrorize & keep down the minority populations for decades after the end of the Civil War.
It's also unfortunate that that same flag symbol was adopted & added by the act of state legislatures for use on various state flags in the 1950's as part of the general southern resistance to the civil rights movement.
Beyond those facts, which are facts that can be verified, other than at a grave site of Confederate war dead, I personally have a hard time being able to put up with looking at or tolerating a flag that symbolizes a movement of rebellion which clamored for armed insurrection against the government of the United States & which fired the first shots that launched this nation into a bloody conflict. There's a word for them in my book: traitors.
As for political correctness, it's ironic to me how popular not being politically correct has become, to the extent that it is now p.c. to not be p.c. in the original traditional sense. Oh, the irony...

[CCATL]

Originally Posted by atler8

It's unfortunate that the symbolic flag thus adopted by such people, as you noted Lovin, also happens to be the same symbol adopted for use by the Klan in the later 1800's as part of their campaign to terrorize & keep down the minority populations for decades after the end of the Civil War.
It's also unfortunate that that same flag symbol was adopted & added by the act of state legislatures for use on various state flags in the 1950's as part of the general southern resistance to the civil rights movement.
Beyond those facts, which are facts that can be verified, other than at a grave site of Confederate war dead, I personally have a hard time being able to put up with looking at or tolerating a flag that symbolizes a movement of rebellion which clamored for armed insurrection against the government of the United States & which fired the first shots that launched this nation into a bloody conflict. There's a word for them in my book: traitors.
As for political correctness, it's ironic to me how popular not being politically correct has become, to the extent that it is now p.c. to not be p.c. in the original traditional sense. Oh, the irony...

Great comments. It wouldn't let me rep you

Why choose to adopt a flag that was used to openly oppress thousands of southerners as the symbol for southern heritage? Basically all this says is southern heritage = racism, which is a part of southern (and northern) history, but not what I would define as its sole heritage. I guess supporters of the flag, like Lovin, don't see this message as a bad thing. Let's keep defending a symbol of hate, so that the rest of the world continues to look at the south as the a** backwards part of the United States!

[Iconographer]

Originally Posted by atler8

It's unfortunate that the symbolic flag thus adopted by such people, as you noted Lovin, also happens to be the same symbol adopted for use by the Klan in the later 1800's as part of their campaign to terrorize & keep down the minority populations for decades after the end of the Civil War.
It's also unfortunate that that same flag symbol was adopted & added by the act of state legislatures for use on various state flags in the 1950's as part of the general southern resistance to the civil rights movement.
Beyond those facts, which are facts that can be verified, other than at a grave site of Confederate war dead, I personally have a hard time being able to put up with looking at or tolerating a flag that symbolizes a movement of rebellion which clamored for armed insurrection against the government of the United States & which fired the first shots that launched this nation into a bloody conflict. There's a word for them in my book: traitors.
As for political correctness, it's ironic to me how popular not being politically correct has become, to the extent that it is now p.c. to not be p.c. in the original traditional sense. Oh, the irony...

I understand. I supported the removal of the Georgia state flag for the reasons that you state. It's just when we embark on a mission to obliterate history altogether just to make some people feeI better that l become nervous.

[Staysean23]

Put the flag in a museum where it belongs.

[Iconographer]

Originally Posted by CCATL

Great comments. It wouldn't let me rep you

Why choose to adopt a flag that was used to openly oppress thousands of southerners as the symbol for southern heritage? Basically all this says is southern heritage = racism, which is a part of southern (and northern) history, but not what I would define as its sole heritage. I guess supporters of the flag, like Lovin, don't see this message as a bad thing. Let's keep defending a symbol of hate, so that the rest of the world continues to look at the south as the a** backwards part of the United States!

Thank you for that crass and baseless interpretation of my take on the flag. For the record:
I fully supported the removal of the Georgia state flag because l understood the reasons for adopting it in the 50s.
I support the retention of Confederate symbols in Stone Mountain, as long as it remains in the context of historical reference, just as l do with any monument or park that recalls an event that ended in tragic consequences.
I respect my neighbor's right to free expression. He's not keeping me awake at night.
I deplore knee jerk reactions devoid of honest consideration or debate.

[Staysean23]

It needs to go in a history museum its more know for a symbol of hate than anything else. They held the damn event at Stone Mountain which was once owned by the Venable Brothers and was the site of the founding of the second Ku Klux Klan in 1915.

[Tryska]

Originally Posted by Staysean23

It needs to go in a history museum its more know for a symbol of hate than anything else. They held the damn event at Stone Mountain which was once owned by the Venable Brothers and was the site of the founding of the second Ku Klux Klan in 1915.

This. It was a crass event from the get go. Really flying the flag at Stone Mountain is crass, imo.

The only thing historical about flying the Confederate Flag at Stone Mountain, is that historically it has been flown there by Klansmen. So if we want to mark the place where grown white men in sheets danced around a burning cross on the very top of the mountain to scare the bejesus out of the coloreds and maybe threw a couple of them off the top after lynching them for this that or the other offense, then yeah...I guess let's remember that history and call it heritage. And states rights. and whatever else avoids dealing with the truth of it.

[CCATL]

Originally Posted by LovinDecatur

Thank you for that crass and baseless interpretation of my take on the flag. For the record:
I fully supported the removal of the Georgia state flag because l understood the reasons for adopting it in the 50s.
I support the retention of Confederate symbols in Stone Mountain, as long as it remains in the context of historical reference, just as l do with any monument or park that recalls an event that ended in tragic consequences.
I respect my neighbor's right to free expression. He's not keeping me awake at night.
I deplore knee jerk reactions devoid of honest consideration or debate.

In the last thread that was closed, I wrote a long response to something you said with honest questions for you that I hoped would generate discussion and debate, as well as help me to understand an opinion from "the other side". You ignored my questions there, so I thought I rightly assumed you weren't open to discussion, but would just continue to defend the flag. So, my response wasn't in any way a knee jerk reaction, I have been contributing to and following these threads for many days.

Your neighbors right to free expression (by displaying the flag) might not keep YOU personally up at night, but what about the people that it might? Due to the senseless, racist, acts of violence that have been carried out since the Civil Rights movement and through today with the flag as the supporting symbol, there may be people out there who ARE afraid of their neighbors right to wave the Confederate Flag. I'm white and middle class, so I personally wouldn't be afraid either, but that doesn't mean that people who have been historically targeted by other Confederate Flag supporters would feel the same way. That is the problem here - the flag, regardless of if you believe it is heritage or not, has been used as a symbol of hate and often in the wake of violence. You personally don't need to feel anything one way or the other. If it is a symbol that threatens a whole class of Americans, and for good reason, it is a symbol that should be left to history, not ignorantly celebrated.

[Iconographer]

Like I could respond to a closed thread.
Ignorantly celebrated. OK.