All new cars UNcomfortable seats, WHY?? (insurance, 2014, sedans, heated seats)

[SFBayBoomer]

Originally Posted by Zen88

For years now it seems that all cars and trucks come with uncomfortable seats made of hard foam, and no springs at all. Even luxury cars. Anyone have any idea why? I remember plush, even pillow-top seats that felt like a couch.

OUCH, a couch? That describes DIS-comfort to me...

[Tiffer E38]

As I mentioned, I hate the old couchlike seats. I just drove my BMW 7 series to St Petersburg, FL and back, putting over 2000 miles on it in a week, and was comfortable in these seats the entire way:





16 hours down and 16 hours back. Lots of support and very adjustable to fit my body perfectly.

[demonofspeed]

this car and most older gm's had nice cushy BUCKET seats

soft pillowy feel, but still REAL bucket seats that hug you well enough in corners.









The front seats in the Grand am, are the same as those in the 1990-1994 Pontiac Sunbird and '86-91 Grand AM,
Also, they could also bolt directly into the 1991-1994 Chevy Cavalier (2nd gen), as well as
the 1995 - 2005 Chevy Cavalier (3rd Gen), with absolutely no modifications at all.

just unscrew the 4 bolts on the floor, get the seat out of the car, and put into the car you are trying to put them into




the 1992-1994 cavaliers did have comfy seats though. yep, just as comfy as they look.








these seats will also fit directly into the 1995-2005 cavaliers. no midifications

(i dont think anyone wants a 1992 cavalier at this point, but this is for those with 1995-2005 cavaliers
which you know the stock seat cushions on the newer models tend to break up, and you can replace it with these ones)



pics from autotrader, they are current pics of vehicles currently for sale.

[TxSage]

Originally Posted by Merc63

I don't DRIVE either of those, or need to have them support me when cornering or in an emergency maneuver. They have a different JOB TO DO than a goddamn CAR. How is this not ****ing obvious to you? is your toaster as soft as your couch? Is your refrigerator as haot as your stove? Is your table as soft as your bed? Differet tools have different requirments. Driving ahs differnt requirements than sleeping or watching TV (or it shoudl if you are doing it right)

And your statement was BS of the stinkiest kind by itself: You do NOT need extra cushions to make modern seats comfortable to drive for more than an hour.

I've done 600 miles at a stretch in these and was quite comfortable:



Same with these:



And I drove from Seattle to Baltimore in this car and was completely comfortable:





So your saying that we "need" to put cushions on these seats to drive more than one hour is FALSE, regardless of your "opinion." But hey, hold tightly to that opinion. Having and holding an opinion is VASTLY more important than actually knowing what youre talking about.

You are rude & stupid as well. Maybe you have enough padding on your rear that you can sit on a rock, I don't know. Those of us who do not, & remember that there used to options, mourn them. These luxurious interiors were not a one off, they were a feature of quite a few models, for Decades. I believe they went out because everyone felt guilty about conspicuous American consumption. We have quite a few vehicles, all "luxury" models such as Mercedes, Porsche, BMW, etc. They are All uncomfortable. I have been car shopping for a comfortable 2017 model & have tested nice cars, including the aforementioned as well as the Bentley & the Rolls. Some of them have Nice, Pretty, interiors but even with an upgrade to say "soft ruffled leather" they Are Not Comfortable. At All. I Hate this hard perforated leather, & even the nicest models with beautiful quilting, like the Bugatti, are not soft & comfortable. I special order my beds in softest foam & my furniture in down, why should I wish to ride around on a wood plank? Even the Maybach Pullman is Not Cushy!! If it were not for horrible after market audio systems I would just get an old pimp mobile, & replace the engine & trans. Probably will anyway just for the fun of it. I care nothing for all these annoying tech gadgets such as bright navigation screens & cars talking to me. I have as many as possible disabled. There is Nothing out there in the last 20 years that compares to the comfort of the privious 40 or 50 years.

[TxSage]

Originally Posted by Brian_M

Ok, so 10 people in the world are immune from being lulled to sleep by a rolling bed. What about the REST of the population?

Yes, I know, you're a Great driver... never caused an accident in your life. Even if you are (and I doubt it, 99% or more of all drivers WAY over-estimate their skill/ability, the rest are world-class racers), you'd be ignorant beyond belief if you think that even most other drivers on the road are anywhere near competent. So, what happens when you're minding your own business, being the Worlds greatest driver, when that average driver crashes into you? Same, exact, end result... a crash, probably injury and possible death.

*shrug* Motorcycle riders deal with this every time they go out for a ride. The saying that goes with the idea (especially when talking about being legally right) is "He was right, dead right". Doesn't matter who's legally in the right, everyone suffers.

Oh good grief! These were around for Years!! For generations!! The accident & fatality rate was no higher & quite probably lower. The size & weight of the steel frame around you alone is a huge safety plus.

[Tiffer E38]

Originally Posted by TxSage

You are rude & stupid as well. Maybe you have enough padding on your rear that you can sit on a rock, I don't know. Those of us who do not, & remember that there used to options, mourn them. These luxurious interiors were not a one off, they were a feature of quite a few models, for Decades. I believe they went out because everyone felt guilty about conspicuous American consumption. We have quite a few vehicles, all "luxury" models such as Mercedes, Porsche, BMW, etc. They are All uncomfortable. I have been car shopping for a comfortable 2017 model & have tested nice cars, including the aforementioned as well as the Bentley & the Rolls. Some of them have Nice, Pretty, interiors but even with an upgrade to say "soft ruffled leather" they Are Not Comfortable. At All. I Hate this hard perforated leather, & even the nicest models with beautiful quilting, like the Bugatti, are not soft & comfortable. I special order my beds in softest foam & my furniture in down, why should I wish to ride around on a wood plank? Even the Maybach Pullman is Not Cushy!! If it were not for horrible after market audio systems I would just get an old pimp mobile, & replace the engine & trans. Probably will anyway just for the fun of it. I care nothing for all these annoying tech gadgets such as bright navigation screens & cars talking to me. I have as many as possible disabled. There is Nothing out there in the last 20 years that compares to the comfort of the privious 40 or 50 years.

A car is supposed to hold you in place while you drive, not feel like your bed and put you to sleep. At least not until it's a self driving car where you don't have to be awake anymore while driving.

And modern cars are so much better a the job of being cars that it's not even funny. They handle, stop and hold the road so much better, get better fuel mileage and make more power, while being cleaner than old cars were. In order to handle and stop and steer and hold the road better, the seats need to hold you in place better. And they need to help keep you awake and alert, even on long drives at night. Soft, pillowtop couches do neither. And, if you think that seats like my car (that I pictured above) are just planks then maybe you feel the pea under ten mattresses, too, don't you?

[Tiffer E38]

Originally Posted by TxSage

Oh good grief! These were around for Years!! For generations!! The accident & fatality rate was no higher & quite probably lower. The size & weight of the steel frame around you alone is a huge safety plus.

Umm, no, the accident and death rate has been dropping for years and that weight of the steel around you was a big safety MINUS, which is why modern cars are vastly safer to be in than old ones. Proven time and again, no matter what your opinion is.

[Coldjensens]

I still find comfortable seats in conversions vans (full sized) and some pick up trucks.

Some cars are surprising. The luxury Cadillac CTS-V has horribly uncomfortable stock seats, but the upgraded Recaro seats are pretty decent and also hold you in place while the stock seats leave you sliding all over the place.

I went on a long trip in a friend's BMW 750i (I think I might have a number or letter wrong, it is the bigger faster, better 700 series). Ouch. It is not for long trips. But it is super fun to drive.

On the other hand I drove across the country with my Daughter in her new Chevy Spark and it was reasonably comfortable, much to my surprise. However I had to have the seat all the way back which, with all her stuff in the car, we had to shift stuff around every time we changed drivers because there was only room for one seat at a time to be back and still have room for her stuff.

I have driven across the country in:
Full sized conversion van (several times Different years) - Extremely comfy.
Rented Chrysler Minivan - unpleasant
Spark - see above. Not bad.
Newish (maybe 2013) Buick Sedan smaller than a LeSabre I think I forget what is it called. Not great but not too bad, but the back seat was awful. The same for a 2016 Buick Encore or Enclave the smaller CUV.
2009 Dodge Ram Laramie - this was fine. Almost as nice as the conversion van.
1995 Camaro Z28 - not pleasant. But not as bad as some others.
Mazda RX7 - Awful.
1981 Pontiac Sunbird - terrible. It also caught on fire.
late 1990s Tbird - bad but not as bad as some. Better than the Camaro.

Not cross country, but longish trips in:
1960s Bentley. Not bad, but not as comfortable as you would expect.
2014 and 2013 CTS - V. See above. Recaro seats were not bad, stock seats were terrible.
2015 ATS - more comfortable than the CTS, but a little hard/cramped.
Forget the year Forerunner. Surprisingly decent. A bit hard but not painful.
1998 Ford Contour SVT. Surprisingly Comfortable. These seats fit me very nicely. But only a 3 hour trip.
2006 (I think) Ranger - Awful.
2015 Prius - Painful.
201(4-6 - forget which) Toyota Carolla - Awful.
3 series and 7 series BMW - both unpleasant (this was a surprise, I expected them to be comfortable). Not horrid, but I would not want to drive accross the country in one.
1973 Jensen Healey - took me ten minutes before I could stand and walk after I got out. Horrible
201? Yukon Denali (Suburban) (converted) - Very nice but not as nice as the vans, about equal to the truck. This would be fine accross the country.
2010 (I think) Escalade - pretty nice, but not as nice as the Yukon.

[unit731]

Originally Posted by Tiffer E38

And modern cars are so much better a the job of being cars that it's not even funny. They handle, stop and hold the road so much better, get better fuel mileage and make more power, while being cleaner than old cars were. In order to handle and stop and steer and hold the road better, the seats need to hold you in place better. And they need to help keep you awake and alert, even on long drives at night. Soft, pillowtop couches do neither. And, if you think that seats like my car (that I pictured above) are just planks then maybe you feel the pea under ten mattresses, too, don't you?

Gotta love the young people here who have hard tight asses !

[Coldjensens]

I hope nobody is counting on seats to keep you awake. No. They are not designed for that purpose, not at all. You are supposed to keep yourself awake, not your seat. If you need to stay awake, drink a 5 hour energy, don't put a 2x4 on your seat to make you more uncomfortable. Actually the distress of being uncomfortable and in pain can make you more tired more distracted and less alert.

Per discussion with GM designer friends:

They do not make the seats intentionally uncomfortable in order to make you more alert. The design has changed to reduce weight in order to meet mileage requirements (necessary to offset added weight for motors, heaters, and the like), to meet government safety requirements, to reduce costs so cars do not cast more than houses (well they cost more than some houses, but not more than average for most areas). Many seats now have almost no metal in them. Performance seats are designed to hold you in place, other seats are not, they are designed to meet standards at the lowest possible price. Some mild "performance seats are made to look like performance seats, but they really do very little to hold you in place. Seats have gotten smaller as cars get smaller and seats have to compete for space with more and more safety features and technology features etc. The materials for seats have improved substantially allowing lighter, stronger safer designs. Safety and weight are the prime objectives. Comfort is subjective, and when people buy cars, they usually spend less then two minutes sitting in the seats. So while they are shooting for not awful comfort is not much of a priority in most cars. Appearance is quite important as well. (My paraphrase of a 20 minute conversation, not a quote)

This part is from another person whom I am less certain of so I may be a bit skeptical:

New cars send them feedback about how you drive, so if you have a Chevy Impala, they know how often you take corners are 40 mph, the assimilation of this data allows them to determine whether they need seats to hold you in place on 40 mph turns in a Chevy Impala (if two people do it, then no, if 20,000 do then probably).

I did not know they already have the technology to report back this detailed information. She said they do, but I do not know her that well and she may be FOS.