20% tip is too generous for CA's minimum wage waitstaff (how much, college)

[Mister 7]

Originally Posted by DriveNotCommute

There are no servers anywhere in the US that legally make less than minimum wage. In the states where people are nominally paid less than minimum wage [and California is not one of those states] per hour, when their paycheck comes in, if their tips don't bring them to the equivalent of minimum wage or more then the restaurant must make up the difference so that staff will always take home at least the minimum wage on their paycheck.

If I remember correctly, 15% used to be the norm for average service. I have gone up to 20% for okay-ish service because I know that the COL in California is so high. Basically, I am aware that I'm subsidizing the restaurant's wage models.

It's 20%, minimum. AWFUL service, I may understand. I know it's not rocket science but some people actually take pride in serving, and enjoy working with people. I hated it, and will always hate it, but I faked it and was great at my job.

This is what I'm talking about here. It's expensive, completely overpriced, yet the poor working class server suffers because you're (not YOU, just you understood, no disrespect) too cheap to leave them a decent tip.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by DriveNotCommute

There are no servers anywhere in the US that legally make less than minimum wage. In the states where people are nominally paid less than minimum wage [and California is not one of those states] per hour, when their paycheck comes in, if their tips don't bring them to the equivalent of minimum wage or more then the restaurant must make up the difference so that staff will always take home at least the minimum wage on their paycheck.

If I remember correctly, 15% used to be the norm for average service. I have gone up to 20% for okay-ish service because I know that the COL in California is so high. Basically, I am aware that I'm subsidizing the restaurant's wage models.

States are all over the place with rules about sub-minimum wage for tipped employees U.S. Department of Labor - Wage & Hour Divisions (WHD) - Minimum Wages for Tipped Employees Wyoming only reimburses $3.02 tip credit for a total hourly wage of $5.15 which I didn't know was even legal, and Georgia has a flat $4 an hour server rate for businesses that gross less than $110,000 a year.

[DriveNotCommute]

Originally Posted by AJT123

It's 20%, minimum. AWFUL service, I may understand. I know it's not rocket science but some people actually take pride in serving, and enjoy working with people. I hated it, and will always hate it, but I faked it and was great at my job.

This is what I'm talking about here. It's expensive, completely overpriced, yet the poor working class server suffers because you're (not YOU, just you understood, no disrespect) too cheap to leave them a decent tip.

No offense taken. My standards aren't particularly pretentious so beating my basic standards shouldn't be hard.

However my view is that as a business model, restaurant owners should be paying their servers more to begin with and not be leaving the burden on the patrons. Really, if the goal is to guarantee a certain level of income that should definitely be coming from the employer. I'm willing to extend some to help out in the interim as an act of social solidarity/responsibility/cohesion but I don't see why the customer should ever be perceived as being responsible for the living wages that should have been negotiated between employer and employee. Maybe a historian's perspective would be helpful, my view is built primarily from being a citizen of a post-industrialized, information-era society.

Too often, the debate about tipping comes across to me as the servers simply being unwilling to put any blame on their bosses, which is a natural state of mind but one that I think is heavily biased. It's just easier to turn against the patrons of the establishments. If certain patrons are unwelcome, then stop taking their money. Raise wages, raise food prices, and the troublesome types of customers will leave. Unless the idea was always to take their money anyway but then again, who's making that choice, the servers or the owners?

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

States are all over the place with rules about sub-minimum wage for tipped employees U.S. Department of Labor - Wage & Hour Divisions (WHD) - Minimum Wages for Tipped Employees Wyoming only reimburses $3.02 tip credit for a total hourly wage of $5.15 which I didn't know was even legal, and Georgia has a flat $4 an hour server rate for businesses that gross less than $110,000 a year.

That's news to me, I was certain that Federal minimum wage overtakes any state minimum wages. The tipped wage category makes the difference? I can already guess what kind of lobbying is keeping it in place. How do servers from Wyoming and Georgia feel about it?

They should get together then sue and appeal until the case reaches the Supreme Court. All they need is a team of lawyers so if they pooled their money... oh wait. Oh, but there's a restaurant association right? They should be taking care of the interests of everyone in the industry... oh wait. How about unionizing in the places that really need it, it'll probably be as easy as printing out some nifty logos on cardstock... oh wait.

To keep it on topic in California, would California's laws that eliminated the "tipped-employees" category count as being one of the too-strict regulations?

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by oh come on!

the waitstaff makes at least $9/hour doing nothing but sticking to their job description, which is to
1. bring your food and
2. not mix up your order.

You must not have ever waited tables if you think that's your job description.

[PDF]

The tipping culture in the US in general is pretty messed up.

[LoriBee62]

Originally Posted by oh come on!

If you're paying an extra 20% on your food, you're paying too much in CA, considering the waitstaff makes at least $9/hour doing nothing but sticking to their job description, which is to
1. bring your food and
2. not mix up your order.

Satisfying these requirements is not considered "outstanding."

If you think they did an outstanding job, you should compare it to how you are treated in non-tipped countries, and then reevaluate whether you truly got outstanding service.

Even though I see so many bored-annoyed-looking waitstaff, I would not consider a smile on the face to be outstanding service either.

This whole post could have been shortened down to: "I'm too cheap to tip and have found a way to feel justified in screwing someone over."

[LoriBee62]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

You must not have ever waited tables if you think that's your job description.

This. I think the world would be a better place if everyone, as part of the high school graduation process, were forced to do menial labor. When I was young, I spent two summers as a maid. I was poor, barely scraping by, and still remember the delight when someone was kind enough to leave a $2 tip in the room for me. Such small things make such a big difference to another person, but too many people are wrapped up in, "Me me me, it's all about me!".

To this day, whenever we travel, I leave a tip for the maids. Doesn't matter what states, or what the laws are (people seriously look this stuff up to avoid tipping??). Bottom line is, not everyone is smart enough to be a brain surgeon, so why not spread it around a little? Is kindness such a difficult concept?

[bmw335xi]

If they provided great service then I will tip 20%.

If they just did their job 15%.

If they were borderline rude 10%.

If they were downright rude, I've tipped as low as 0.01%, but I've only done that twice in my entire life.

(I used to work as a server awhile ago, the job can actually be quite stressful during peak times, but I never let that get in the way from at least being friendly.)

[capoeira]

Originally Posted by oh come on!

Even though I see so many bored-annoyed-looking waitstaff, I would not consider a smile on the face to be outstanding service either.

The simple solution to this is to cook at home! I despise eating out, once a year is too often for me.

[bmw335xi]

Originally Posted by capoeira

The simple solution to this is to cook at home! I despise eating out, once a year is too often for me.

I eat out 7 times a week lol. I cook one meal at home and eat one meal out, but I live in San Francisco, so there are so many great restaurants. I don't dine for the service, I dine for the food.