02-11-2015, 12:42 PM
Location: Chicago
38,707 posts, read
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Reputation: 29983
Maybe it's time for the grown-ups to step back and reflect on the original purpose of Little League? Was it worth putting the kids through this for your own brief moment of vicarious glory?
Jackie Robinson West stripped of Little League title - Chicago Tribune
02-11-2015, 03:24 PM
Location: alt reality
1,085 posts, read
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Reputation: 937
I can't view the video at work but please tell me that the coaches or team managers also made statements and did not allow that child to represent the team by himself at that press conference
02-11-2015, 04:20 PM
Location: Hoosierville
17,428 posts, read
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Reputation: 11632
It's sad for the kids who played - but there were kids from Homewood, Lynwood, Lansing, etc. on that team ... how is that fair? You want to pick and choose who is on your team - that's what travel ball is for - NOT Little League.
Ugh.
I'm even more disgusted by Jesse Jackson & Father Pfleger jumping into the mix with the immediate cry of "it was racism!"
It wasn't. It was rules.
The guy from Evergreen Park who blew this whistle on this is about as far from being a racist as one could get.
02-11-2015, 04:23 PM
Location: 53179
14,416 posts, read
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Reputation: 14479
I was wondering why Jesse Jackson was there. Is the whole team all minorities? What an opportunist he is.
02-11-2015, 04:35 PM
Location: Chicago
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Reputation: 3207
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Chuckity
It's sad for the kids who played - but there were kids from Homewood, Lynwood, Lansing, etc. on that team ... how is that fair? You want to pick and choose who is on your team - that's what travel ball is for - NOT Little League.
Ugh.
I'm even more disgusted by Jesse Jackson & Father Pfleger jumping into the mix with the immediate cry of "it was racism!"
It wasn't. It was rules.
My thoughts exactly.
02-11-2015, 04:36 PM
28,453 posts, read
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Reputation: 18729
The "who broke the rules" part is what makes it kind of awful...
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Chuckity
It's sad for the kids who played - but there were kids from Homewood, Lynwood, Lansing, etc. on that team ... how is that fair? You want to pick and choose who is on your team - that's what travel ball is for - NOT Little League.
Ugh.
I'm even more disgusted by Jesse Jackson & Father Pfleger jumping into the mix with the immediate cry of "it was racism!"
It wasn't. It was rules.
The guy from Evergreen Park who blew this whistle on this is about as far from being a racist as one could get.
For anybody that has had their son or daughter participate in organized sports the fact is there are all kinds of very specific rules for every kind of sport. If you want to be on an "everybody gets equal time on the field" kind of time like AYSO soccer you still have to prove your child is registered for the appropriate size field based on their birth certificate. Ditto for YMCA, Pops Warner, swimming, whatever.
If you decide your kid has the commitment to play on a "travel time" you can sign them up and let the coaches decide the appropriate level up to the point that those rules allow.
If you decide to participate in Little League there are clear boundaries over which kids are to play with their classmates / neighbors. That is kind of the "magic" of these often very little towns in the middle of nowhere winning their state playoffs and then going to the "world series".
Somebody clearly decided to "bend the rules" and in a place like Illinois one need not imagine that take after the bad example of others.
Really feel terrible for the kids and parents that got sucked into what was probably cooked up as just a way to get the best kids playing together, but that is NOT how the Little Rules work and no doubt from now on there will be more scrutiny on this there is in making sure that kids go to the right school district and similar attendance based boundaries...
02-11-2015, 05:00 PM
Location: Chicago - Logan Square
3,396 posts, read
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Reputation: 3731
I think Little League International is completely schizophrenic, which is what caused this entire situation.
On one hand they are responsible for running a high stakes playoff series, where it makes sense to have strict rules to prevent coaches from building a team of ringers. Unfortunately they do absolutely nothing to verify or even facilitate the creating maps of who is eligible to play, and leave that to a patchwork of different local volunteer organizations.
On the other hand they are running an organization to promote baseball among kids, and get as many kids to play as they can. That's why they're very lenient on letting kids who attend a private or charter school outside where they reside to play in a division. It's why kids can choose different parents, guardians, or relatives to list for their residence. It's why kids get grandfathered into divisions even when they move. In short - they make the rules incredibly lenient to allow as many kids as possible to play.
Most of the time this leniency allows kids to keep playing with their friends. To allow them to be part of a team that has the most convenient location for them (anytime you draw borders, someone is inconvenienced by being at the edge of the border). Some teams in areas with low participation wouldn't exist if they weren't lax with the rules. This sort of logic applies to the vast majority of teams out there.
There is however a smaller group of teams that has been using the unclear rules and non-existent enforcement as a way to build powerhouse teams. Pretty much every regional championship team falls into this category. Little League has tolerated this in order to have higher quality games at the national level (thereby getting better TV contracts) and to have the best team possible reach the international level (if they enforce the rules applied to JWR nationally, the US will get slaughtered in international competition every year).
If the rules were clear, and had been enforced in the past, I would have no problem with them taking back the title. I'd also have no problem if they declared that they're cracking down next year, and telling every team to get it together. I would even be fine if they had checked the eligibility of every teams' players before beginning the national championship. I think it is a total load of crap to run the league as they always have, and then change their minds after the season is long over.
02-11-2015, 05:12 PM
Location: 53179
14,416 posts, read
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Reputation: 14479
I think they knew exactly what they were doing and they got caught.
02-11-2015, 05:12 PM
Location: Chicago
38,707 posts, read
103,201,963 times
Reputation: 29983
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Chuckity
I'm even more disgusted by Jesse Jackson & Father Pfleger jumping into the mix with the immediate cry of "it was racism!"
Yeah, what a marvelous example they're setting for these kids. It wasn't bad enough that their coaches set a crappy example by stacking the deck; now you have other adults telling the kids it was OK for the coaches to cheat because, I dunno, black people should be given a pass when they break the rules as restitution for their history of oppression or something? I can't even imagine the moral imbecility it takes to stand in front of a television camera and excuse what these tools did because of their race.
02-11-2015, 05:19 PM
8,276 posts, read
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Reputation: 10080
It's the same kind of mentality that middle-aged guys have for their alma mater's football/basketball/etc team. Why would a 55 yo guy get all animated/upset about the fortunes of a collegiate football team? Doesn't he have more important things to be worried about? Let the current players/students/coaches worry about it, not some long-since graduated guy trying to relive the old days. I'll never understand these crazy alumni...
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Housing units in structures - 1, detached (%)
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Working at home (%)
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People in Group quarters - Other nonhousehold living situations (%)
People in Group quarters - Other noninstitutional group quarters (%)
Residents speaking English at home (%)
Residents speaking English at home - Born in the United States (%)
Residents speaking English at home - Native, born elsewhere (%)
Residents speaking English at home - Foreign born (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home - Born in the United States (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home - Native, born elsewhere (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home - Foreign born (%)
Residents speaking other language at home (%)
Residents speaking other language at home - Born in the United States (%)
Residents speaking other language at home - Native, born elsewhere (%)
Residents speaking other language at home - Foreign born (%)
Class of Workers - Employee of private company (%)
Class of Workers - Self-employed in own incorporated business (%)
Class of Workers - Private not-for-profit wage and salary workers (%)
Class of Workers - Local government workers (%)
Class of Workers - State government workers (%)
Class of Workers - Federal government workers (%)
Class of Workers - Self-employed workers in own not incorporated business and Unpaid family workers (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Utility gas (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Bottled, tank, or LP gas (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Electricity (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Fuel oil, kerosene, etc. (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Coal or coke (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Wood (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Solar energy (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Other fuel (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - No fuel used (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Utility gas (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Bottled, tank, or LP gas (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Electricity (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Fuel oil, kerosene, etc. (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Coal or coke (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Wood (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Solar energy (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Other fuel (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - No fuel used (%)
Armed forces status - In Armed Forces (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian - Veteran (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian - Nonveteran (%)
Fatal accidents locations in years 2005-2021
Fatal accidents locations in 2005
Fatal accidents locations in 2006
Fatal accidents locations in 2007
Fatal accidents locations in 2008
Fatal accidents locations in 2009
Fatal accidents locations in 2010
Fatal accidents locations in 2011
Fatal accidents locations in 2012
Fatal accidents locations in 2013
Fatal accidents locations in 2014
Fatal accidents locations in 2015
Fatal accidents locations in 2016
Fatal accidents locations in 2017
Fatal accidents locations in 2018
Fatal accidents locations in 2019
Fatal accidents locations in 2020
Fatal accidents locations in 2021
Alcohol use - People drinking some alcohol every month (%)
Alcohol use - People not drinking at all (%)
Alcohol use - Average days/month drinking alcohol
Alcohol use - Average drinks/week
Alcohol use - Average days/year people drink much
Audiometry - Average condition of hearing (%)
Audiometry - People that can hear a whisper from across a quiet room (%)
Audiometry - People that can hear normal voice from across a quiet room (%)
Audiometry - Ears ringing, roaring, buzzing (%)
Audiometry - Had a job exposure to loud noise (%)
Audiometry - Had off-work exposure to loud noise (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Has high blood pressure (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Checking blood pressure at home (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Frequently checking blood cholesterol (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Has high cholesterol level (%)
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on food at supermarket/grocery store
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on food at other stores
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on eating out
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on carryout/delivered foods
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on food at supermarket/grocery store (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on food at other stores (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on eating out (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on carryout/delivered foods (%)
Current Health Status - General health condition (%)
Current Health Status - Blood donors (%)
Current Health Status - Has blood ever tested for HIV virus (%)
Current Health Status - Left-handed people (%)
Dermatology - People using sunscreen (%)
Diabetes - Diabetics (%)
Diabetes - Had a blood test for high blood sugar (%)
Diabetes - People taking insulin (%)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Diet health (%)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Milk product consumption (# of products/month)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Meals not home prepared (#/week)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Meals from fast food or pizza place (#/week)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Ready-to-eat foods (#/month)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Frozen meals/pizza (#/month)
Drug Use - People that ever used marijuana or hashish (%)
Drug Use - Ever used hard drugs (%)
Drug Use - Ever used any form of cocaine (%)
Drug Use - Ever used heroin (%)
Drug Use - Ever used methamphetamine (%)
Health Insurance - People covered by health insurance (%)
Kidney Conditions-Urology - Avg. # of times urinating at night
Medical Conditions - People with asthma (%)
Medical Conditions - People with anemia (%)
Medical Conditions - People with psoriasis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with overweight (%)
Medical Conditions - Elderly people having difficulties in thinking or remembering (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever received blood transfusion (%)
Medical Conditions - People having trouble seeing even with glass/contacts (%)
Medical Conditions - People with arthritis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with gout (%)
Medical Conditions - People with congestive heart failure (%)
Medical Conditions - People with coronary heart disease (%)
Medical Conditions - People with angina pectoris (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had heart attack (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had stroke (%)
Medical Conditions - People with emphysema (%)
Medical Conditions - People with thyroid problem (%)
Medical Conditions - People with chronic bronchitis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with any liver condition (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had cancer or malignancy (%)
Mental Health - People who have little interest in doing things (%)
Mental Health - People feeling down, depressed, or hopeless (%)
Mental Health - People who have trouble sleeping or sleeping too much (%)
Mental Health - People feeling tired or having little energy (%)
Mental Health - People with poor appetite or overeating (%)
Mental Health - People feeling bad about themself (%)
Mental Health - People who have trouble concentrating on things (%)
Mental Health - People moving or speaking slowly or too fast (%)
Mental Health - People having thoughts they would be better off dead (%)
Oral Health - Average years since last visit a dentist
Oral Health - People embarrassed because of mouth (%)
Oral Health - People with gum disease (%)
Oral Health - General health of teeth and gums (%)
Oral Health - Average days a week using dental floss/device
Oral Health - Average days a week using mouthwash for dental problem
Oral Health - Average number of teeth
Pesticide Use - Households using pesticides to control insects (%)
Pesticide Use - Households using pesticides to kill weeds (%)
Physical Activity - People doing vigorous-intensity work activities (%)
Physical Activity - People doing moderate-intensity work activities (%)
Physical Activity - People walking or bicycling (%)
Physical Activity - People doing vigorous-intensity recreational activities (%)
Physical Activity - People doing moderate-intensity recreational activities (%)
Physical Activity - Average hours a day doing sedentary activities
Physical Activity - Average hours a day watching TV or videos
Physical Activity - Average hours a day using computer
Physical Functioning - People having limitations keeping them from working (%)
Physical Functioning - People limited in amount of work they can do (%)
Physical Functioning - People that need special equipment to walk (%)
Physical Functioning - People experiencing confusion/memory problems (%)
Physical Functioning - People requiring special healthcare equipment (%)
Prescription Medications - Average number of prescription medicines taking
Preventive Aspirin Use - Adults 40+ taking low-dose aspirin (%)
Reproductive Health - Vaginal deliveries (%)
Reproductive Health - Cesarean deliveries (%)
Reproductive Health - Deliveries resulted in a live birth (%)
Reproductive Health - Pregnancies resulted in a delivery (%)
Reproductive Health - Women breastfeeding newborns (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that had a hysterectomy (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that had both ovaries removed (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever taken birth control pills (%)
Reproductive Health - Women taking birth control pills (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever used Depo-Provera or injectables (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever used female hormones (%)
Sexual Behavior - People 18+ that ever had sex (vaginal, anal, or oral) (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had vaginal sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever performed oral sex on a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had anal sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had any sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had vaginal sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever performed oral sex on a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had anal sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had any kind of sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first had sex
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female vaginal sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first performed oral sex on a woman (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of woman performed oral sex on in lifetime (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male anal sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first performed oral sex on a man (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male oral sex partners in lifetime (18+)
Sexual Behavior - People using protection when performing oral sex (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of times people have vaginal or anal sex a year
Sexual Behavior - People having sex without condom (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male vaginal sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Circumcised males 18+ (%)
Sleep Disorders - Average hours sleeping at night
Sleep Disorders - People that has trouble sleeping (%)
Smoking-Cigarette Use - People smoking cigarettes (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ having problems with smell (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ having problems with taste (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had wisdom teeth removed (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had tonsils teeth removed (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had a loss of consciousness because of a head injury (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had a broken nose or other serious injury to face or skull (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had two or more sinus infections (%)
Weight - Average height (inches)
Weight - Average weight (pounds)
Weight - Average BMI
Weight - People that are obese (%)
Weight - People that ever were obese (%)
Weight - People trying to lose weight (%)