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For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
And
1John 1:8-9
If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, Jesus is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
So we see this:
Salvation is a gift and it is not based on works, but after we come to Christ there are good works to be done.
Our future sins are forgiven, if we confess our sins day by day. Both specific and in general.
With that said, I am off to town!
Actually, that puts many things in perspective for me, thank you for your input (:
You said that salvation is a gift from God that is not earned. Do you not earn it through performing virtuous actions and staying away from sins? That sounds like the earn system to me. Again, I cant believe that simply believing in Christ as the savior negates all of your future sins.
I have immense issues with this theory, too. I've been criticized for my opinions that good deeds and living as a good human mean nothing in Christianity, yet "they" seem to think that half-heartedly sitting inside of a church and just going through empty motions earns them a higher status in Heaven. No, simply believing doesn't mean squat. Prisons are full of people who "believe" but, as far as I'm concerned, have NOT earned anything until they truly turn their lives around.
I have immense issues with this theory, too. I've been criticized for my opinions that good deeds and living as a good human mean nothing in Christianity, yet "they" seem to think that half-heartedly sitting inside of a church and just going through empty motions earns them a higher status in Heaven. No, simply believing doesn't mean squat. Prisons are full of people who "believe" but, as far as I'm concerned, have NOT earned anything until they truly turn their lives around.
Bertrand Russell discusses the issue you bring up in his book "Why I am Not a Christian." (Russell is a mathematician and philosopher.) He states your case above, then gives two scenarios.
In one, there is a man who adheres to every teaching of his Church, and (assuming this is possible, of course) he never sins at all. But throughout his entire life, he simply wakes up in the morning, goes to work, comes home, eats dinner, goes to bed. He does not contribute positively other than working (which he does deserve credit for, I suppose); he doesn't donate to the poor, or volunteer, or engage in relationships where he offers love to others.
Then, a second man. This one does not follow any religion at all, and does not believe in God. In fact, he sins. He has been unfaithful to his wife, he lies occasionally, and he cheats on his taxes. But he donates generously to charities, volunteers his time at local shelters, is a good friend when one is need; as his wealth accumulates, he directs a large portion of it into opening a hospital in an underprivileged area lacking medical care, etc.
Russell makes the argument that according to the Church, the first man will gain entry into heaven. The second man will not. He questions this.
I apologize in advance for the following sarcasm but...really??
I'd rather put half & half in my cereal everyday instead of 1%. I'd rather pay my taxes with lottery winnings. I'd rather Michael Bay not direct another movie but I have a feeling none of these things are gonna happen.
The only thread of commonality between all major religions (Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism) and even lesser known faiths like Sikhism, Jainism, Shintoism, Taoism, and even my Utah brethren (the Mormons) = the golden rule.
Have a good day. Sorry for being a bit of a pr-ck but I couldn't help it.
Even when we take "religion" or even The Creator out of the equation...no one could argue that "loving your neighbor as yourself" when truly adhered to...would result in a better place for mankind here on earth...the scripture calls it "PARADISE/heaven" and others, Utopia...Nirvana...
Buddism like all religion is the invention of Satan who deceives the world with his lies. There is no eternal salvation apart from faith in Jesus Christ. Buddism is simply one of many ways in which man is led astray by the devil. Unless Budda received Christ as Savior before he died, he is in hades today and will spend eternity in the lake of fire.
VERY ignorant post. Buddha lived LONG BEFORE Christianity existed. So it would have been impossible for him to receive Christ. Also your belief in the need of Jesus is the VERY DEFINITION of religion. Christianity is like a baby spiritually compared to Buddhism.
Buddism like all religion is the invention of Satan who deceives the world with his lies. There is no eternal salvation apart from faith in Jesus Christ. Buddism is simply one of many ways in which man is led astray by the devil. Unless Budda received Christ as Savior before he died, he is in hades today and will spend eternity in the lake of fire.
VERY ignorant post. Buddha lived LONG BEFORE Christianity existed. So it would have been impossible for him to receive Christ. Also your belief in the need of Jesus is the VERY DEFINITION of religion. Christianity is like a baby spiritually compared to Buddhism.
Salvation has always been through faith in the promised Messiah. Immediately after Adam sinned, God gave him the Gospel message. In Genesis 3:15 God told Satan that when the Messiah (Jesus) came in the future (relative to their time) that He would bruise the head of Satan (a reference to Jesus' strategic victory over Satan). All of the animal sacrifices performed before Christ came into the world pointed toward Him.
The word of God declares that salvation is through faith in Christ alone.
Bertrand Russell discusses the issue you bring up in his book "Why I am Not a Christian." (Russell is a mathematician and philosopher.) He states your case above, then gives two scenarios.
In one, there is a man who adheres to every teaching of his Church, and (assuming this is possible, of course) he never sins at all. But throughout his entire life, he simply wakes up in the morning, goes to work, comes home, eats dinner, goes to bed. He does not contribute positively other than working (which he does deserve credit for, I suppose); he doesn't donate to the poor, or volunteer, or engage in relationships where he offers love to others.
Then, a second man. This one does not follow any religion at all, and does not believe in God. In fact, he sins. He has been unfaithful to his wife, he lies occasionally, and he cheats on his taxes. But he donates generously to charities, volunteers his time at local shelters, is a good friend when one is need; as his wealth accumulates, he directs a large portion of it into opening a hospital in an underprivileged area lacking medical care, etc.
Russell makes the argument that according to the Church, the first man will gain entry into heaven. The second man will not. He questions this.
That is a mighty powerful scenario comparisons ~ WOW! I can imagine their Maker juggling those in his hands with a big frown on His face. And I think He'd be spending quite some time on this one. Hmm!
My guess might be the first one. Because, yes, while the man lacks compassion and charity, he nevertheless does no harm, causes no harm.
Man #2's humanitarian efforts would score huge points with his Maker but but he has caused harm with his loved ones. I think God would put him through the ringer for this one ~ maybe even suggest that he come back again and learn respect for his loved ones and work on his honesty. Personally, I believe that we can return in another life if we want to "right a wrong", and this man would be the perfect candidate for it.
But, then, He could very well suggest to #1 to come back and experience more generosity.
He may just reject the both of them with the suggestion to come back and better ourselves.
And, yes, I'm one of the few Christian who believes in reincarnation (but not the cyclic over 'n' over). I believe that earth is a school that we're here to learn lessons, and that Free Will gives us the opportunity to learn more of them beyond just one lifetime.
Last edited by Bluesmama; 09-27-2010 at 05:29 PM..
alvation has always been through faith in the promised Messiah. Immediately after Adam sinned, God gave him the Gospel message. In Genesis 3:15 God is telling Satan that when the Messiah comes in the future (relative to their time) that the Messiah (Jesus) would bruise the head of Satan (a reference to Jesus' strategic victory over Satan). All of the animal sacrifices performed before Christ came into the world pointed toward Him.
The word of God declares that salvation is through faith in Christ alone.
MODERN interpretation. Again proving the point that modern day Christianity in America is just a regional modern worldview created for political purposes... I thought Christianity wasn't a religion? you've proven it's the most RELIGIOUS of the religions. And Buddha is NOT in Hell because Buddha reached a state of transcendence called NIRVANA. He no longer exists in the material universe. There is no hell or heaven. There are hell like TEMPORARY Realms and Heaven like TEMPORARY realms that people in exist in for various amounts of time between lives.
This thread is dying a rather painful and boring death folks. Let's simply acknowledge that some religions (ie. fundamentalist christianity) don't allow for others to exist accept as anathema while other religions (ie. Hinduism, Buddhism, some sects of Christianity and Judaism) not only allow for diversity, but also encourage it.
alvation has always been through faith in the promised Messiah. Immediately after Adam sinned, God gave him the Gospel message. In Genesis 3:15 God is telling Satan that when the Messiah comes in the future (relative to their time) that the Messiah (Jesus) would bruise the head of Satan (a reference to Jesus' strategic victory over Satan). All of the animal sacrifices performed before Christ came into the world pointed toward Him.
The word of God declares that salvation is through faith in Christ alone.
MODERN interpretation. Again proving the point that modern day Christianity in America is just a regional modern worldview created for political purposes... I thought Christianity wasn't a religion? you've proven it's the most RELIGIOUS of the religions. And Buddha is NOT in Hell because Buddha reached a state of transcendence called NIRVANA. He no longer exists in the material universe. There is no hell or heaven. There are hell like TEMPORARY Realms and Heaven like TEMPORARY realms that people in exist in for various amounts of time between lives.
No, not a modern interpretation. As stated in Gen. 15:6 'Then he (Abraham - Abram at the time) believed in the LORD; and He reckoned it to him as righteousness. This is reiterated in Gal. 3:6.
When Moses lifted up the serpent on a staff in the wilderness (Numbers 21:6-9), it was a picture or type of Jesus on the Cross. John 3:14 ''And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up; 15] that whoever believes may in Him have eternal life.
Because of their disobedience, God had sent serpents to bite the Israelites. God then instructed Moses to fashion a bronze serpent, put it on a staff and raise it up. Anyone who had been bitten and simply looked toward the serpent, was healed and lived. A picture of Christ on the Cross. Jesus was represented by a serpent because this was a picture of Jesus while bearing the sins of the world. Satan had came to Eve as a serpent and deceived her into sinning.
Budda is in Hades unless he believed in Christ before he died. Reject the truth if you will. You will learn the truth after you die. But it will be too late by then as your eternal destiny is set as of the moment you die. All who die without Christ will spend eternity in the lake of fire. That is reality.
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Hi, Bluesmama
