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Yes, I expect those who listen to God through their inner spirit to actually ask the question. If you can't ask that spirit a question and get an answer, what good is it? God never intended it to be a one-way conversation, did He?
And, it's a pretty simple question: Did Jesus Christ come in the flesh? Yes, or no?
He came into MY flesh, that is the truth!
I do believe that He also came as a separate individual 2,000 years ago.
He is mine, and I am His. We must learn to feed on Him.
In spite of the verses above, I can't believe the notion that man cannot know salvation apart from a preacher. I believe salvation is hidden away in the heart of all mankind, the Voice is there "knocking" when it chooses.
In your Romans chapter 10 above, in verse 19 we read this:
"But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world."
And what about here:
"20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: 21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened." Rom. 1
A friend of mine once asked, "do you think that if a person didn't have access to a bible, that God could teach him it?"
I said, yes.
Is God limited by our printing presses??
Why would man need something "man-made" in order to know the salvation of God?
Blessings,
brian
Quote:
Originally Posted by stillkit
Why do you believe that? Based upon what?
Is it not written that Jesus "stands at the door and knocks?"
Believing in God is one thing (that's what those verses are dealing with). Believing in Christ is quite another. Obviously, you cannot believe in Christ without first believing in God, but just a belief that God exists is not sufficient for salvation. If that were so, Lucifer would be saved because he knew God personally and has no doubt about the matter.
But isn't God our Savior? There are many scriptures, both in OT and NT which call God our "Savior." Is there more than one?
So, from where does our knowledge of Christ come? From the prophesies of the Old Testament and the eye witness testimonies of the New. In other words, the Bible.
We are truly blessed to have knowledge of God through the experiences of those who have gone before us. But they are testimonies, and not the experiences of you and I. If you have the Spirit of God, why can't you write a similar testimony?
Why and how?
If man doesn't have a Bible, he still has God with him no matter where he finds himself. He may be a criminal in prison, or a person lost in a forest, or on a ship in the middle of the ocean. It matters not where we are, God's Voice (His Word) is always with us, and can teach us even more than what we find in the Bible--- if we can hear it!
No, of course not.
Because that's the way God set it up. He has always revealed himself to us by Spirit empowered and directed other men. He only spoke directly to Adam, Moses, Abram and the Prophets and they were directed to carry His message to others.
Yes; but now, in the end of times, He speaks to us through His Son, who dwells in us. He has given us His Life, and so we can indeed come to the Father and ask Him directly. No more "lest we die" fear as OT Israelites had, who couldn't hear God's Voice for themselves.
Eating from the Tree of Life (God Himself) is what gives us Life. It's not that God needs us to worship Him; He wants us to have Life by feeding on Him. It's good for us, and He encourages it.
Perhaps things would have been different if Adam had first eaten from the Tree of Life.
One thing we know: since he ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil first, then he was NOT allowed to eat from the Tree of Life. It was "backwards" and not a good situation for man, and God prevented it.
But it would seem that what was important for man was to feed on God, not to have knowledge of good and evil.
Blessings!
brian
I don't think it is fair to say one direction was better than the other for other than when it happened.
If you only feed off of your God and do not know the difference between good and evil then you could be feeding off of evil.
Now the point would be that was that something just to be done for a certain period of time to groom the spirits that inhabit the earth?
I would say the answer is yes because those following the evil did not know any better.
But with that being said,one should not purposely stick their head in the sand and allow the evil to flourish.
And if the hierarchy of churches know the truth and hide it then it is the church that must be changed.
You can try and turn this around if you want.
But my statement holds true.
It is you that seems to be attracted by the selfishness not I.
You asked me to summarize the Bible, and I did it by quoting John 3:16. If you think it'is selfish, then what can I say. It is the core teaching of the NT.
Quote:
I was just making a point that the devil told Eve that if she ate the apple that she would become like God.
And she prensted that to Adam.
And you presented similiar to me.
And the christian church presents that to people on a regular basis.
I think you are talking to too many people at the same time and get confused about who said what. I never discusses Adam and Eve with you.
Hi everyone.
As I have mentioned elsewhere, God's word is not the Bible. God's word is His very Voice speaking to our hearts. People are converted when God speaks to their hearts, not when man talks. Man cannot save another man. Man is saved when God speaks to his heart.
When we hear Him speaking to us (including when reading the scriptures), then we are confident that we are walking with Him as we should. The scripture is only a testimony of what others have experienced of God; but they are not our own experiences, because God is alive, and cannot be known by reading a book. He must be known personally. Paul's writings and experiences are his, not ours. He can only testify of his own experience.
Quoting scripture does not mean that we know Him personally, just as if we quote Einstein's writings on relativity, does it mean that we knew Einstein; and neither does it mean that we understand physics!
The same is true for names.
Do you think that just because someone talks about Jesus, that he is a Christian?? If I quote Marx, does that make me a communist? Does that mean that I know Marx personally?
There are many today who are preaching "the name of Jesus," but inward are ravening wolves, ready for war. Common sense will show us this. This is called "being able to discern spirits," and it is very important that we learn to do so.
In fact, some "unbelievers" are better discerners than many "believers!"
Just because someone says they are a Christian, does NOT mean that they are.
God doesn't look at the names you use and quote, but whether your heart is right with Him or not. Not all Jews are Jews, and not all Christians are Christians.
May we be wise to discern, and to be alert always. Many come in "His name," but do not bring forth the fruits of the Spirit, which are love, peace, patience, kindness, joy, faith, gentleness, etc.
Those who bring forth such good fruits are "Christians," no matter what "names" they use or quote.
Blessings to all,
brian
I read somewhere someone's story about a lady in which her supervisor could quote scripture better than she could, and her supervisor wasn't even a purported Christian. She made the employee feel not qualified for her position. She then stated Jesus told her
"It's not where you are in scripture. It's where the scripture is in you."
Now this was by prayer to God. I believe it. It's so important that we try to walk as God told us to. I know I have a lot of work to do.
I don't think it is fair to say one direction was better than the other for other than when it happened.
If you only feed off of your God and do not know the difference between good and evil then you could be feeding off of evil.
Now the point would be that was that something just to be done for a certain period of time to groom the spirits that inhabit the earth?
I would say the answer is yes because those following the evil did not know any better.
But with that being said,one should not purposely stick their head in the sand and allow the evil to flourish.
And if the hierarchy of churches know the truth and hide it then it is the church that must be changed.
Well, God told Adam to eat all things except the tree of knowledge of good and evil. (I think He knew that Adam would do it anyway, but that is beside the point here..)
So Adam ate of it. And God protected the Tree of Life, which before was available to Adam. But now it was not permitted. (Until Christ came, 2000 years ago.)
It seems here that God desired for Adam to simply trust in God, not understand good and evil, but just live in the Life of God, and be content.
Yet there was something in Adam that drew him to the tree. Something in Adam "lusted" for power, for freedom, for independence, for knowledge.
And God arranged it thus, that Adam would indeed return to the Garden, but only through trials and suffering and death.
Jesus is now the Tree of Life for our healing and nourishment. He is our Word.
But whether or not God desires for us to keep the knowledge of good and evil, I do not know.
But I suppose that the first Tree for us ought to be the Tree of Life, God Himself.
Then if He permits us to know more, so be it.
Adam had things backwards, wanting to do things his own way..
When those words were spoken there was no bible around. So the teachers that spoke those words were not talking about the printed words in some book.
Think about that.
This is actually a catch 22, first off we do not know that the words were not written but can assume either way while we do know that often times scribes were writting everything down and we also know that at the time of Christ they had the OT written in scrolls and that there were plenty of historians around as well.
Now as for the NT, we do not know for sure that the words were not written as Jesus spoke or as the apostle spoke or wrote themselves. For all we know they were writing everything down, copying and spreading the writings to all corners of the world and that the NT could have been complete at the death of the last apostle, John and the only real conflict over what was true and what was false were the nay sayers of the time trying to impose their views instead of Gods views and were rejected by the Holy Spirit repeatedly until Nicea canonized the true works.
Think about it from Gods perspective according the whole Bible.
I read somewhere someone's story about a lady in which her supervisor could quote scripture better than she could, and her supervisor wasn't even a purported Christian. She made the employee feel not qualified for her position. She then stated Jesus told her
"It's not where you are in scripture. It's where the scripture is in you."
Now this was by prayer to God. I believe it. It's so important that we try to walk as God told us to. I know I have a lot of work to do.
Thanks for posting Brian.
Thanks for your post, Lee! What the supervisor said is just my point. (I'll be reflecting on her quote for a while, me thinks!)
I too, have much to learn. And all you guys here are all a blessing to me (ET, UR, it matters not).
My hope is to be able to bless all of you as well, in His Spirit.
Well, God told Adam to eat all things except the tree of knowledge of good and evil. (I think He knew that Adam would do it anyway, but that is beside the point here..)
So Adam ate of it. And God protected the Tree of Life, which before was available to Adam. But now it was not permitted. (Until Christ came, 2000 years ago.)
It seems here that God desired for Adam to simply trust in God, not understand good and evil, but just live in the Life of God, and be content.
Yet there was something in Adam that drew him to the tree. Something in Adam "lusted" for power, for freedom, for independence, for knowledge.
And God arranged it thus, that Adam would indeed return to the Garden, but only through trials and suffering and death.
Jesus is now the Tree of Life for our healing and nourishment. He is our Word.
But whether or not God desires for us to keep the knowledge of good and evil, I do not know.
But I suppose that the first Tree for us ought to be the Tree of Life, God Himself.
Then if He permits us to know more, so be it.
Adam had things backwards, wanting to do things his own way..
Blessings,
brian
Nice post!
But I still would disagree that Adam was driven by lust to want knowledge.
I would say that by gaining knowledge he would find out if he was right or wrong in his descision.
I would think that Adam or Eve would not look upon God as people do now.
Simply because they were prisoners of him in the garden of eden.
I have the same feelings that if I do what I beleive to be following my God that it does not matter if I am wrong.
Because I do fully beleive that my God is just and if I do something that I deserve to go to hell for,then I deserve it and so be it.
But I do not think for one minute that I would even try to lie to my God at the time of judgement.
Where others appear to be practicing to do so,and even trained by others to do so.
Sounds like you are grounded in selfishness.
You know Lucifer promised eternal life also?
Lucifer's fate is sealed. He is the son of perdition, and the Father of Lies. He wants to drag all of man down with him. Lucifer answers to Christ. He has no power given to him that's not given from above. Christ uses Satan to test us. The ultimate test is coming again. It is the final test. The very same trick again. Knowledge/Science attempting to trump God. Man can be like g-ds. It's the very first lie, and it will be the last.
Allegiance to Jesus gives you the gift of life. Allegiance to Satan has he gets sucked down to the abyss is a dangerous proposition. Jesus came here for mankind so we could evade this fate. All we have to do is accept him as God and mankind's savior from death.
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