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Hi trettep - that is a different interpretation on the parable of the rich man than the one I've usually read about. Do you have a link/article on it I can read?
I'm not sure of the story you read. I dont' have an article. But the Rich man is given to be in the colors of the high priest. The Lazarus is shown to be a leper which is the same as Simon the Leper aka Lazarus brother of Martha. So anyone that would have heard this at the time would have known this was a direct reference to the High Priest and Lazarus which was a BIG DEAL at the time since Lazarus was raised from the dead.
What is the part that you find that differs from what you learned.
"We simply have matured by the will and purpose of God."
Somehow that is hard to beleive unless you are referring to the God of this world.
But that seems to be the obvious answer.
Cover up!
No I believe the maturity is only by the will and purpose of God. Do we disagree there?
Every knee WILL indeed bow and every tongue shall surely acknowledge that Christ is Lord. Those who do not do so willingly will be compelled to do so as the defeated enemies of Christ before being thrown into the lake of fire forever. 'The restoration of all things' in Acts 3:21 has nothing to do with the false teaching of all men being saved. It has to do with the restoration of the kingdom to Israel at the second advent of Christ at the end of the tribulation.
Every one will Confess that Christ is lord openly and willingly, that is what the word "exomologeō"(confess) means ...
Quote:
exomologeō
Pronunciation
eks-o-mo-lo-ge'-ō (Key)
Part of Speech
verb
Root Word (Etymology)
From ἐκ (G1537) and ὁμολογέω (G3670)
TDNT Reference
5:199,687
Vines
View Entry
Outline of Biblical Usage
1) to confess
2) to profess
a) acknowledge openly and joyfully
b) to one's honour: to celebrate, give praise to
c) to profess that one will do something, to promise, agree, engage
Eight times the word is used in the new testament in reference to open and willing confession of sins and of Christ as lord and Savior(Mat 3:6, Mar 1:5, Act 19:18, Rom 14:11, Rom 15:9, Phl 2:11, Jam 5:16, Rev 3:5), while in two other places it is used to communicate the open and willing giving of thanks to God(Mat 11:25, Luk 10:21), and in one other place it is used to communicate an open and willing promise(Luk 22:6).
In no place in the new testament is the word used to communicate forced admittance or acceptance or confession under threat or duress, and in fact it is impossible for the word to be used in that way as it expressly means the opposite, and this proves the lies you are teaching concerning these things, like many false doctrines that you believe and teach ...
You are simply unable to accept the fact because you have been deceived and ruled by a violent spirit which has hardened your heart and darkened your mind to the love of God for all people and his purpose to save all people.
And the restitution of all things is just what it says, it is the restitution of everything in creation back to God from which it came ... Not just Israel, for Christ is making all things new and all things which were made for him and through him will be made one together in him ... You are teaching lies from the mouth of the enemy ...
Last edited by Ironmaw1776; 03-25-2011 at 11:38 PM..
Every one will Confess that Christ is lord openly and willingly, the is what the word "exomologeō"(confess) means ...
Eight times the word is used in the new testament in reference to open and willing confession of sins and of Christ as lord and Savior(Mat 3:6, Mar 1:5, Act 19:18, Rom 14:11, Rom 15:9, Phl 2:11, Jam 5:16, Rev 3:5), while in two other places it is used to communicate the open and willing giving of thanks to God(Mat 11:25, Luk 10:21), and in one other place it is used to communicate an open and willing promise(Luk 22:6).
In no place in the new testament is the word used to communicate forced admittance or acceptance or confession under threat or duress, and in fact it is impossible for the word to be used in that way as it expressly means the opposite, and this proves the lies you are teaching concerning these things, like many false doctrines that you believe and teach ...
You are simply unable to accept the fact because you have been deceived and ruled by a violent spirit which has hardened your heart and darkened your mind to the love of God for all people and his purpose to save all people.
And the restitution of all things is just what it says, it is the restitution of everything in creation back to God from which it came ... Not just Israel, for Christ is making all things new and all things which were made for him and through him will be made one together in him ... You are teaching lies from the mouth of the enemy ...
Keep proclaiming the good news, brother...
Every knee will bend under the sheer weight of His magnificent love.
peace,
sparrow
Every one will Confess that Christ is lord openly and willingly, that is what the word "exomologeō"(confess) means ...
Eight times the word is used in the new testament in reference to open and willing confession of sins and of Christ as lord and Savior(Mat 3:6, Mar 1:5, Act 19:18, Rom 14:11, Rom 15:9, Phl 2:11, Jam 5:16, Rev 3:5), while in two other places it is used to communicate the open and willing giving of thanks to God(Mat 11:25, Luk 10:21), and in one other place it is used to communicate an open and willing promise(Luk 22:6).
In no place in the new testament is the word used to communicate forced admittance or acceptance or confession under threat or duress, and in fact it is impossible for the word to be used in that way as it expressly means the opposite, and this proves the lies you are teaching concerning these things, like many false doctrines that you believe and teach ...
You are simply unable to accept the fact because you have been deceived and ruled by a violent spirit which has hardened your heart and darkened your mind to the love of God for all people and his purpose to save all people.
And the restitution of all things is just what it says, it is the restitution of everything in creation back to God from which it came ... Not just Israel, for Christ is making all things new and all things which were made for him and through him will be made one together in him ... You are teaching lies from the mouth of the enemy ...
Exomologeo means simply to confess, to acknowledge. Using the definitions that you posted, it is seen that 'to acknowledge openly and 'JOYFULLY' is but one of the definitions. At its most basic, the word simply means to confess. And every tongue will confess. Not every tongue will do so willingly. Those who are under the earth refer to those who are unsaved and who will be eternally separated from God.
1) to confess
2) to profess
a) acknowledge openly and joyfully
b) to one's honour: to celebrate, give praise to
c) to profess that one will do something, to promise, agree, engage
Now here's a usage of the word 'exomologeó' in Luke 22:6 refering to Judas Iscatiot's betrayal of Jesus. So he consented (exōmologēsen), and began seeking a good opportunity to betray Him to them apart from the crowd.
So as you can plainly see, the word 'exomologeo' hardly confines itself to joyful expression.
Phil 2:10 'so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, Again, those who are under the earth refers to those who died without salvation and are eternally lost.
Exomologeo means simply to confess, to acknowledge. Using the definitions that you posted, it is seen that 'to acknowledge openly and 'JOYFULLY' is but one of the definitions. At its most basic, the word simply means to confess. And every tongue will confess. Not every tongue will do so willingly. Those who are under the earth refer to those who are unsaved and who will be eternally separated from God.
1) to confess
2) to profess
a) acknowledge openly and joyfully
b) to one's honour: to celebrate, give praise to
c) to profess that one will do something, to promise, agree, engage
Now here's a usage of the word 'exomologeó' in Luke 22:6 refering to Judas Iscatiot's betrayal of Jesus. So he consented (exōmologēsen), and began seeking a good opportunity to betray Him to them apart from the crowd.
So as you can plainly see, the word 'exomologeo' hardly confines itself to joyful expression.
Phil 2:10 'so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, Again, those who are under the earth refers to those who died without salvation and are eternally lost.
You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, and it shows ...
Judas Iscariot willingly promised to betray Christ, he was not forced ... You have no case for what you are trying to spin.
The fact that Philipians 2:10 is referring to the joyous and willing confession that Christ is lord is supported by many other verses, such as the one in revelations which i already quoted which says ...
Revelation 5:13
and every creature that is in the heaven, and in the earth, and under the earth, and the things that are upon the sea, and the all things in them, heard I saying, 'To Him who is sitting upon the throne, and to the Lamb, is the blessing, and the honour, and the glory, and the might -- to the ages of the ages!'
All things in Gods creation will one day finally worship and praise him and glorify his name willingly and joyously.
Psa 22:27
All the ends of the earth shall remember and turn to the LORD, and all the families of the nations shall worship before you.
Psa 66:4
"All the earth will worship You, And will sing praises to You; They will sing praises to Your name." Selah.
It will happen, of ye of little faith ... God will accomplish everything that he desires, and nothing you believe or teach can stop it from happening!
No I believe the maturity is only by the will and purpose of God. Do we disagree there?
I beleive that people attempt to inflict others with their own Will and purpose and God has nothing to do with it.
And what they are calling maturity is not maturity at all but their experience in their practices.
I see alot of witchcraft from those that would claim witchcraft is wrong.
The problem is that some people receive position and power by confusing the meek.And that is for sure wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by .sparrow.
Keep proclaiming the good news, brother...
Every knee will bend under the sheer weight of His magnificent love.
peace,
sparrow
Do you mean like a camel going thru the eye of a needle?
Eye of a Needle
The link is fun to read but leans towrd more contradiction.
They connect the word camel with the word rope but still say it is possible for a rich man to enter heaven.I suppose that they have to tell rich people that because if it was impossible then how could the church unload the riches of the man.
The man would just turn away.
In Isreal the eye of a needle is a door between the living quarters of the people and the camels.It is small so it is difficult for the camels to get in with the people.But they can if they bend their knees enough.
I got that info from a person that lived in a Kibbutz.
I'm not sure of the story you read. I dont' have an article. But the Rich man is given to be in the colors of the high priest. The Lazarus is shown to be a leper which is the same as Simon the Leper aka Lazarus brother of Martha. So anyone that would have heard this at the time would have known this was a direct reference to the High Priest and Lazarus which was a BIG DEAL at the time since Lazarus was raised from the dead.
What is the part that you find that differs from what you learned.
The interpretations I've seen are off of tentmaker and bible-truths and are highly symbolic:
lazarus = eliezer - Abraham's faithful gentile servant - represents gentiles
rich man = judah - representing Israel
Abraham's bosom = representing closeness with Abraham (which is what eliezer was)
5 brothers = Judah's 5 brothers
etc.
chasm = separation that Israel went through because of their disobedience
etc
IMHO it lines up, but it is possible it is multi-layered.
Some people need real help, sometimes this may simply be a shoulder to cry on, someone to get some wise advice from etc. This need not be wrapped up in blankets of delusion to be effective. Sadly, most cases I have seen, the church really does not get to the real need, platitudes are offered and that is supposed to suffice, have faith, god will provide, etc.
From a personal standpoint, I have been at the point of requiring a simple attaboy and that came from no one in the church, my atheist neighbor was the one there for me. The only help I can offer is that you are pretty much on your own. Friends help and it depends if you are married, have kids, where your priorities may lie. My life is less complicated now as I am not trying to figure out what did I do wrong this time. It rains on the just and unjust and that you can take to the bank. To say my life is satisfactory would be a lie, there is much I aspire to do and want but funds are lacking to make that a reality. We somehow manage and are fortunate not to be indebted to anyone, that makes the struggle a little more tolerable.
Friendships help when you're in need but the folk you thought were your friends often let you down, I have no high expectation of anyone except my wife, and my two children.
Hope I answered your questions.
Sorry, I didn't see your post until now.
I do agree that the Christian community fails miserably all too often at offering real help and salvation to people. Quite often, they're too busy trying to get people to believe as they do, or feeling persecuted because people don't, to be part of any solutions to people's real-life issues.
I also agree that it's not realistic to have expectations of help from others BUT, I don't think that is optimal, nor that it has to be that way. I think when people learn to overcome their own dysfunctions they often have a genuine desire to help other people (family, friends, others in their community) do the same, in big or small ways. When a person's faith provides the kind of healing that promotes a desire to actively seek the good of others, then that is what I believe is true salvation.
The faith I believe people need is in their own value in this world, simply by virtue of their being in it. Because the majority of people are convinced that there is a God that is judging them and have been taught that that God finds them lacking, being assured that their God loves and values them can provide the faith and healing they need.
You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, and it shows ...
Judas Iscariot willingly promised to betray Christ, he was not forced ... You have no case for what you are trying to spin.
That statement has nothing to do with the acknowledgement to be made by those who are going to spend eternity in the lake of fire, that Jesus is Lord.
As will be true for all who have rejected Christ as Savior, before Judas Iscariot is cast into the lake of fire he will go to his knees acknowledging that Jesus is Lord.
Quote:
The fact that Philipians 2:10 is referring to the joyous and willing confession that Christ is lord is supported by many other verses, such as the one in revelations which i already quoted which says ...
Revelation 5:13
and every creature that is in the heaven, and in the earth, and under the earth, and the things that are upon the sea, and the all things in them, heard I saying, 'To Him who is sitting upon the throne, and to the Lamb, is the blessing, and the honour, and the glory, and the might -- to the ages of the ages!'
All things in Gods creation will one day finally worship and praise him and glorify his name willingly and joyously.
Psa 22:27
All the ends of the earth shall remember and turn to the LORD, and all the families of the nations shall worship before you.
Psa 66:4
"All the earth will worship You, And will sing praises to You; They will sing praises to Your name." Selah.
It will happen, of ye of little faith ... God will accomplish everything that he desires, and nothing you believe or teach can stop it from happening!
Only those who have received Christ as Savior will joyfully acknowledge that Jesus is Lord. The unbeliever and the fallen angels will be compelled to make that acknowledgement and they will not be joyful about it.
In the two passages from the Psalms you posted, the psalmist is calling on all people to praise the Lord.
Jesus Christ IS Lord of all. There will come a time when those who have rejected Him as Savior will be compelled to recognize His Lordship. But that acknowledgement is made as an enemy of Christ. There will be no salvation for them.
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