How do you interpret/balance these verses? (mission, judgement, doctrines)
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So you believe God wants us to take the beam out of our own eye, so we can take a speck of dust out of our brothers. Do you not see the absurdity of that ?.
Mat 7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.
I think that verse says it all.
Quote:
If we understood that we had been blinded ourselves too by a beam in our eye(In truth it is God who opens the eyes of those who cannot see),then have it removed only to judge a brother for the speck in his eye, is no different to the wicked servant who was shown great mercy in having his debt wiped away, only for him to find a brother who owed him a few bucks and show him no mercy and have him flung in Jail.
I see no relationship between what Jesus is TELLING us to do in Matthew to the unforgiving servant parable. Jesus is telling us to Judge Righteous Judgement. Anyone that has Christ in their hearts is going to be gaining that ability to judge others rigtheously.
You obviously do not get what i'm saying trettep. What you are taking heed too,is effecting how you judge,you are hearing something in the scripture which is not saying what you think it is, this is no judgement upon you.
I am repeating to you what Jesus said in that passage of scripture you quoted
Consider carefully what you hear," he continued. "With the measure you use, it will be measured to you--and even more.(in the same jail as the wicked servant).
In otherwords if you are listening to your own thoughts, that your brother as this fault that fault and whatever other fault, you are listening to your carnal thoughts, rather than the thoughts of God,and thinking either way pays dividends,with interest.Half our issues in our own individual lives are because we do not take heed to what we are listening to.
No, I clearly hear in those scriptures that we are to Judge others righteously. Surely your not arguing with that.
No, I clearly hear in those scriptures that we are to Judge others righteously. Surely your not arguing with that.
Well which is it judge righteously or distinguish righteously ? . Or are you willing to see to judge righteously or to distinguish righteously we are the recipient of it ?.
Distinguish what ? What you see wrong in your brothers eye ?
I thought the problem was the beam in our own eye . Wouldn't you agree that this is the case ? . And when the beam of distinguishing a speck of dust in our brothers eye, is removed from our eye, we really would no longer be distinguishing (beholding) the speck of dust in our brothers eye.
Yes, the problem is the beam in our own eye but it there is also a problem in our brothers eye.
I don't think you understand the verses pcamps, what does it say to do AFTER you remove the beam from your own eye? Does it not then say to remove the piece of straw from your brothers eye? - of course it does. It doesn't say remove the beam from your own eye and then just go about ignoring the piece of straw in your brother's eye.
Mat 7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.
I think that verse says it all.
I see no relationship between what Jesus is TELLING us to do in Matthew to the unforgiving servant parable. Jesus is telling us to Judge Righteous Judgement. Anyone that has Christ in their hearts is going to be gaining that ability to judge others rigtheously.
I think it says it all too, it's saying you hypocrit don't you know yourself, why are you beholding the speck of dust in your brothers eye. There is something very humbling discovering you have a beam in your own eye.
I will leave this thread with this. I have witnessed first hand the misery caused by those who had neither removed the beam from their own eye, or didn't realize they had a beam in their own eye and thought they were judging righteously.
Well which is it judge righteously or distinguish righteously ? . Or are you willing to see to judge righteously or to distinguish righteously we are the recipient of it ?.
I'm using the word "Judge" just as it is in the scriptures. How were you using the word?
G2919
κρίνω
krinō
kree'-no
Properly to distinguish, that is, decide (mentally or judicially); by implication to try, condemn, punish: - avenge, conclude, condemn, damn, decree, determine, esteem, judge, go to (sue at the) law, ordain, call in question, sentence to, think.
I think it says it all too, it's saying you hypocrit don't you know yourself, why are you beholding the speck of dust in your brothers eye. There is something very humbling discovering you have a beam in your own eye.
I will leave this thread with this. I have witnessed first hand the misery caused by those who had neither removed the beam from their own eye, or didn't realize they had a beam in their own eye and thought they were judging righteously.
But that was not ALL that the verse says pcamps. You can't just accept part of a verse that you want to accept and leave the rest out. It then goes on to say this part (bolded):
Mat 7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.
Clearly the bolded part is telling us to JUDGE our brother. I surely hope my brother Judges me.
Luke 12:57 Yea, and why even of yourselves judge ye not what is right?
Matthew 7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
Well, call me naive, but I kind of think it means we're not supposed to judge each other. We obviously need to use discernment in making choices for our own lives. This involves judging certain doctrines to be true or false, certain behaviors to be right or wrong, etc. As far as judging one another, and particularly condemning one another, I strongly believe that it's in all of our best interests to leave that up to God. I'm pretty sure He is capable of judging all of us without anyone else's help.
Clearly the bolded part is telling us to JUDGE our brother. I surely hope my brother Judges me.
I hope my pastor, or fellow believer would help me get back on the narrow path if/when I fall off. That is one of the benefits of being a part of a church, -to receive help and instruction from your brothers and sisters in Christ.
I hope my pastor, or fellow believer would help me get back on the narrow path if/when I fall off. That is one of the benefits of being a part of a church, -to receive help and instruction from your brothers and sisters in Christ.
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We obviously need to use discernment in making choices for our own lives. This involves judging certain doctrines to be true or false, certain behaviors to be right or wrong, etc. As far as judging one another, and particularly condemning one another, I strongly believe that it's in all of our best interests to leave that up to God. I'm pretty sure He is capable of judging all of us without anyone else's help.
