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Of course, God can do whatever He wants, and who am I to say?
HOWEVER, since He gave me a brain to think, and to read His Word, which says "God is Love," I have to wonder: are we just really confused about God, or what??!?!?
Basically it doesn't matter whether they heard or not. Without faith in Jesus, they will go to hell. Outside of faith in Jesus, everyone is condemned.
Jn 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
Human logic might argue that God is not fair in condemning those who have never heard. That I understand. However, if that was true, then the logical thing to do for the disciples is to tell no one. That isn't what Jesus commanded and that isn't what the disciples did because the Gospel should be preached to all so that they have the opportunity to believe.
That is the point... God is not responsible for unbelief.
As God revealed:
"For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion."
People don't like it when God plays God... They don't like when God reveals that when people reject him that he gives them over to that and hardens the heart.
At some point it, this is an issue which becomes more than just human logic that opposes God.
Leviticus 5:17 "Now if a person sins and does any of the things which the LORD has commanded not to be done, though he was unaware, still he is guilty and shall bear his punishment."
Luke 12:48 "But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked."
Luke 12 was also the first thing which came to my mind. Everyone is accountable and there are no excuses, but God is a righteous judge. Those who knew and rejected Him anyway are worse off than the ones who didn't know.
Last edited by Finn_Jarber; 12-06-2011 at 10:44 AM..
That is the point... God is not responsible for unbelief.
As God revealed:
"For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion."
People don't like it when God plays God... They don't like when God reveals that when people reject him that he gives them over to that and hardens the heart.
At some point it, this is an issue which becomes more than just human logic that opposes God.
The truth also has a consistant logic to it nevertheless, if true, then all unborn babies that were aborted are in hell and even those that died of a miscarriage or some other problem. Those that were killed because someone abused the pregnant woman.
Moderator cut: delete
Last edited by Miss Blue; 12-06-2011 at 03:20 PM..
Reason: personal and off topic
The Bible tells us that those who do not hear the Gospel will be judged by their own conscience.
Yes, I believe that's correct. They will be judged by their own conscience, and yet somewhere along the line, isn't a belief in Christ still required of everyone in order to be saved? If it isn't, it seems to me that a great many people would be better off never having heard His gospel. We know that Christ commissioned His Apostles to spread His gospel, so it must have been important to Him that they do so. But clearly He knew that there would be people who would die in ignorance. Do you believe that those who died without ever having heard of Jesus Christ will be saved without a belief in Him, even though the Bible appears to say otherwise?
Yes, I believe that's correct. They will be judged by their own conscience, and yet somewhere along the line, isn't a belief in Christ still required of everyone in order to be saved? If it isn't, it seems to me that a great many people would be better off never having heard His gospel. We know that Christ commissioned His Apostles to spread His gospel, so it must have been important to Him that they do so. But clearly He knew that there would be people who would die in ignorance. Do you believe that those who died without ever having heard of Jesus Christ will be saved without a belief in Him, even though the Bible appears to say otherwise?
Yes, even unborn babies wil be judged, however, that judgment will be based upon the life of that baby. I can't imagine the result of that judgment would be something of concern to any of us.
The truth also has a consistant logic to it nevertheless, if true, then all unborn babies that were aborted are in hell and even those that died of a miscarriage or some other problem. Those that were killed because someone abused the pregnant woman.
Moderator cut: delete
There is a difference between logic \ intellegence and letting the Bible speak for itself.
Prefering logic over the Bible and making that the absolute truth is no less idolitry than rubbing a fat bellied statue or denigrating the intellegence of the writers of the Bible.
Last edited by Miss Blue; 12-06-2011 at 03:23 PM..
One point most people don't seem to be picking up on is that God gave us a commandment -- that we are to believe in His Only Begotten Son as our Savior. He further stated that Jesus Christ is the only way by which we can be forgiven of our sins. It is inconceivable to me that God would give His children a commandment and yet not provide a way for them to keep that commandment. That's why I believe He has provided a way for all mankind to hear His Son's gospel. That sounds like such a loving gesture on His part. It makes me wonder why people find the concept so offensive.
There is a difference between logic \ intellegence and letting the Bible speak for itself.
Prefering logic over the Bible and making that the absolute truth is no less idolitry than rubbing a fat bellied statue or denigrating the intellegence of the writers of the Bible.
Well, I am letting the bible speak for itself in the manner you are speaking of, it says to use a sound pattern of words. I am only pointing out that a sound pattern of words based upon what you are saying is likely also concluding that unborn babies that are aborted or miscarried or killed by some other means are also in hell along with all those who have never heard the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Do you believe that those who died without ever having heard of Jesus Christ will be saved without a belief in Him, even though the Bible appears to say otherwise?
The vast weight of scripture attests that Jesus is the only way to salvation. The ambiguous passage about being judged by our consciences stands alone, and I really don't understand what it means. Judgement is certainly not the same as salvation. I only hope it means that those who never had an opportunity to know the Gospel may not be condemned. If anyone here has more light on this I would very much like to hear it.
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