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The OP most obviously does not have any grasp of the depths of his sin.
That by itself should get me off the hook. A merciful God NEVER sent an ignorant slob to burn in hell because he or she did not comprehend the depths of the their problems. Such a God is a vindictive monster who deserves not the least bit of worship.
So here's the bottom line issue on all these posts I've made about Paul. I implicitly reject his gospel "by grace are ye saved through faith alone; not of works".
I embrace Jesus' gospel "Whosoever believes on the Son shall not perish" + "What must I do to inherit eternal life? Do not steal; do not bear false witness; Love God and do good to your fellow man."
So am I going to eternal damnation because I reject salvation by faith alone, or am I going to heaven because I believe salvation involves believing in Jesus plus doing good works for my fellow man?
Jesus did not teach that works have anything to do with salvation. He taught the opposite. When He spoke of working for the food which endures to eternal life, He was asked by the crowd what the works of God were that they might do them. They thought that were works that by doing them could earn them eternal life. Jesus corrected them by saying that the work of God was to believe on Him.
John 6:27 "Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you, for on Him the Father, God, has set His seal." 28] Therefore they said to Him, "What shall we do, so that we may work the works (Erga-Plural) of God?" 29] Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work (Ergon-Singular) of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."
Regarding John 6:28-29, the Bible Knowledge Commentary has the following;
6:28. The people recognized that Jesus was saying God had a requirement for them. They would do God's requirement if He would inform them what it was. They believed that they could please God and thus obtain eternal life by doing good works (cf. Rom. 10:2-4). 6:29. Jesus' response to their question was a flat contradiction of their thinking. They could not please God by doing good works. There is only one work of God, that is, one thing which God requires. They need to put their trust in the One the Father has sent. Because of their sin people cannot please God by doing good works for salvation (Eph. 2:8-9; Titus 3:5). God demands that people recognize their inability to save themselves and receive His gift (Rom. 6:23). [The Bible Knowledge Commentary, New Testament, An Exposition of the Scriptures by Dallas Seminary Faculty, p. 295]
Romans 10:2-4 which was mentioned in the commentary above states,
Romans 10:2 For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge. 3] For not knowing about God's righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4] For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.
Ephesians 2:8-9 and Titus 3:5 were also referenced in the above commentary.
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9]not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Titus 3:5He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
And so, when Paul said;
Ephesians 2:10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
he recognized that while the believer should produce good works, they are not a requirement to receive the free gift of eternal life, just as Jesus said in John 6:28-29.
When Jesus was asked by the man what must be done to inherit eternal life, he was asking based on the Law, and Jesus answered him on that basis.
Luke 18:18 A ruler questioned Him, saying, "Good Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?" 19] And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone. 20] You know the commandments, 'DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, DO NOT MURDER, DO NOT STEAL, DO NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER.'" 21] And he said, "All these things I have kept from my youth." 22] When Jesus heard this, He said to him, "One thing you still lack; sell all that you possess and distribute it to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me." 23] But when he had heard these things, he became very sad, for he was extremely rich.
Jesus' point was that no one can be saved by trying to keep the Law. As James said,
James 2:10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all.
No one can perfectly keep the law. And because of sin we cannot earn or deserve eternal life by our own righteousness or by the deeds which are produced from our righteousness.
Eternal life is offered and can be received only as a free gift through faith in Christ Jesus. If a person has never at any point simply recognized his total inability to do anything to earn eternal life and therefore has never trusted in Christ alone for his eternal salvation, but has always attempted to earn eternal life by working for it, then he has not been saved. He has not placed his faith in Christ as his Savior, but has added his own efforts to faith alone. He has stuck his oar in the water and is trying to row his way to salvation. He remains under condemnation and his works will be brought up at the great white throne as per Revelation 20:11-15 and he will be shown that his works could not save him. He will then be sent into the lake of fire.
However, I do not think that you and certain others will listen to or accept what I have just said, just as you do not accept what the apostle Paul said, and will most likely disregard what Jesus said as recorded in John 6:27-29. And many of you, even if you bother to actually read the above carefully, will not accept that while works belong to the believer's spiritual life, the believer has been eternally saved simply by placing his faith alone in Christ alone. And so, if you choose not to listen, so be it.
Last edited by Michael Way; 02-12-2014 at 02:22 PM..
Faith and works... just like breathing. Inhale, exhale. One gets it going but both necessary for life. It's already complex, don't make it complicated.
Faith and works... just like breathing. Inhale, exhale. One gets it going but both necessary for life. It's already complex, don't make it complicated.
There is nothing complicated about it at all. Works are stated in the Bible not to be a requirement for eternal life. The believer who is growing spiritually will be more and more productive. But whether he grows up spiritually or not, he already has eternal life by virtue of having simply trusted in Christ alone. And having eternal life, he cannot lose it.
Last edited by Michael Way; 02-12-2014 at 02:53 PM..
So here's the bottom line issue on all these posts I've made about Paul. I implicitly reject his gospel "by grace are ye saved through faith alone; not of works".
I embrace Jesus' gospel "Whosoever believes on the Son shall not perish" + "What must I do to inherit eternal life? Do not steal; do not bear false witness; Love God and do good to your fellow man."
Those are all part of the law. If you read the context, you'll see that the young man was unable to do that.
Are you able to do that?
Quote:
So am I going to eternal damnation because I reject salvation by faith alone, or am I going to heaven because I believe salvation involves believing in Jesus plus doing good works for my fellow man?
Are you able to live by the Law? I've never met someone that can do it perfectly. The requirement for entrance into heaven is perfection. You will not be able to be righteous by living 99.9%.
Those are all part of the law. If you read the context, you'll see that the young man was unable to do that.
Are you able to do that?
Are you able to live by the Law? I've never met someone that can do it perfectly. The requirement for entrance into heaven is perfection. You will not be able to be righteous by living 99.9%.
The young man stated he had kept all those from youth and Yeshua said to sell everything he had and give it to the poor and then follow Him...
Those are all part of the law. If you read the context, you'll see that the young man was unable to do that.
Are you able to do that?
Are you able to live by the Law? I've never met someone that can do it perfectly. The requirement for entrance into heaven is perfection. You will not be able to be righteous by living 99.9%.
Those are all part of the law. If you read the context, you'll see that the young man was unable to do that.
Are you able to do that?
Are you able to live by the Law? I've never met someone that can do it perfectly. The requirement for entrance into heaven is perfection. You will not be able to be righteous by living 99.9%.
I'm not saying I try to keep the law without believing in Jesus. That of course is impossible and that's what Paul was trying to emphasize when he said the law is dead. He simply meant that Jesus made it unnecessary for us to strive to keep the law BY ITSELF (without faith) to earn our way to heaven, which is of course impossible. Even I acknowledge that. But my interpretation of Jesus' commands is to believe on Him AND do good works to inherit eternal life. So I'm doing two requirements as commanded by Jesus, where SFTGA'ers are doing only one. That should mean I am talking out insurance by doing the second (good works) in case the first one (Faith alone) is not enough.
Now some will say, "Faith alone is enough" but they don't realize that they are themselves playing a game of "Pascal's Wager". What if "Faith alone" isn't enough??? Wouldn't a person who wasn't sure "faith alone" was enough be prudent to do both so as to cover all his bases?
Again, please don't say, "Faith alone" IS covering all your bases." A fair number of Christians do not believe "faith alone" is enough for salvation.
Do what Jesus said....``Repent of sin or perish to Jesus ``.. See repent to Jesus in your prayers and ask Jesus to help you and make a plan for your life and talk to God ......... If you talk to God He will eventually make a plan which salvation is there , still you can get demons coming and talking back and trying to deceive you that these demons will try to get you to believe that they are god , so you need to rebuke the one who talks back in Jesus name , as `Jesus is Lord ``............But taking to God is a must as God will never talk to people who do not talk to Him ........... Have faith then faith is a action word so give a charity to the name of Jesus believing in a Jesus promise , see this charity can be money to the Works of Jesus and His great commission of saved souls , or it could be helping others and believing that this is charity of helping other to Jesus believing in a Jesus Biblical promise ..........See expecting promises from Jesus will get Jesus attention ........... Love the people of God which Jesus cleansed , and there are many people anointed in Christ and they are all walking around with Jesus Christ through His spirit ........... See when Jesus was at a wedding in Cana His mother told the attended ``Do what Jesus said ``, and the water was turned into wine and it was the best wine .....
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