What if Jesus is not the God but a servant of God? (churches, exodus)
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Deu 6:14 KJV Ye shall not go after other gods, of the gods of the people which [are] round about you;
Indeed...NO other god...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubbrian
Jhn 20:27-28 KJV Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust [it] into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
The word bolded above is translated from 'theos', which not only means 'god', but also G-d's representative or viceregent:
4. whatever can in any respect be likened unto God, or resemble him in any way
God's representative or viceregent
of magistrates and judges
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubbrian
Luk 4:8 KJV And Jesus answered and said unto him, Get thee behind me, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.
Yes...Yeshua was refering to His Father...Not to Himself...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubbrian
Heb 1:6 KJV And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
G4352
Original: προσκυνέω
Transliteration: proskuneō
Phonetic: pros-koo-neh'-o
Thayer Definition:
to kiss the hand to (towards) one, in token of reverence
among the Orientals, especially the Persians, to fall upon the knees and touch the ground with the forehead as an expression of profound reverence
in the NT by kneeling or prostration to do homage (to one) or make obeisance, whether in order to express respect or to make supplication
used of homage shown to men and beings of superior rank
to the Jewish high priests
to God
to Christ
to heavenly beings
to demons
Origin: from G4314 and a probable derivative of G2965 (meaning to kiss, like a dog licking his master's hand)
TDNT entry: 18:38,9
Part(s) of speech: Verb
Strong's Definition: From G4314 and probably a derivative of G2965 (meaning to kiss, like a dog licking his master's hand); to fawn or crouch to, that is, (literally or figuratively) prostrate oneself in homage (do reverence to, adore): - worship.
As God, Jesus is co-equal and co-eternal with the other two Persons of the Trinity. But when Jesus became incarnate, He became the God-man. Fully God and fully man. As a man, God the Father is His God. But as God He is equal with God the Father.
A study on the doctrine of the Hypostatic Union and Kenosis of Jesus Christ may help your understanding.
As I've said before, some people get on here thinking they know all about theology and God and then proceed to show their ignorance.
Lk 1:36 Even Elizabeth your relative is going to have a child in her old age, and she who was said to be barren is in her sixth month. Lk 1:37 For nothing is impossible with God.”
Lk 1:38 “I am the Lord’s servant,” Mary answered. “May it be to me as you have said.” Then the angel left her.
Think of it this way. People today would say the resurrection from the dead is impossible. Yet Jesus rose and he raised 3 other people. But if the resurrection is impossible, then all religion is a waste of time because then there is no hope for people. So if people religion is a pointless waste of time, then why are they on a religion forum??? That really makes no sense.
The Day of Resurrection is for the Righteous only...
Luke: 7:1 Now when he had ended all his sayings in the audience of the people, he entered into Capernaum.
2 And a certain centurion's servant, who was dear unto him, was sick, and ready to die.
3 And when he heard of Jesus, he sent unto him the elders of the Jews, beseeching him that he would come and heal his servant.
4 And when they came to Jesus,they besought him instantly, saying, That he was worthy for whom he should do this:
5 For he loveth our nation, and he hath built us a synagogue.
6 Then Jesus went with them. And when he was now not far from the house, the centurion sent friends to him, saying unto him, Lord, trouble not thyself: for I am not worthy that thou shouldest enter under my roof:
Same account but showing the principle that someop0ne sent in the name of another is addressed as that person.
Matt 8:5 And when Jesus was entered into Capernaum, there came unto him a centurion, beseeching him, 6 And saying, Lord, my servant lieth at home sick of the palsy, grievously tormented.
7 And Jesus saith unto him, I will come and heal him.
8 The centurion answered and said, Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldest come under my roof: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed.
9 For I am a man under authority, having soldiers under me: and I say to this man, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it.
Matthew speaks of the centurion actually coming and Luke speaks of the elders ()Plural) sent by the man. This is the Shailach principle at work and even though it was the elders who spoke Jesus addressed themas though they were the centurion. It is all through the Bible.
Jesus as God's agent, sent by God, can be addressed as "God" in the same way.
with "the Schaliach Principle, or the Jewish Law of Agency, which is expressed in the dictum, 'A person’s agent is regarded as the person himself.'" (1967 The Encyclopedia of the Jewish Religion. Werblowsky, Raphael Jehudah Zwi; Wigoder, Geoffrey, joint editors)
"Here the category of agency sheds light. In the rabbinic writings there is reference to the figure of the saliah, which means literally 'one who is sent' (see Apostle). A saliah was a surrogate sent on a task or mission with specific instructions and authority to carry it out. According to the Talmud, a saliah could, among other things, carry out business transactions, make binding treaties and arrange marriages (b. Qidd. 41a, 42b-43a). A common saying in the rabbis was 'the one who is sent is like the one who sent him' or 'a man's agent is equivalent to himself' (m. Ber. 5:5;b. B. Mes. 96a; b. hag. 10b; b. Menah. 93b; b. Nazir 12b; b. Qidd. 42b, 43a). Because the saliah may act on behalf of the one who sent him, when one deals with the saliah it is as if one is dealing with the one who sent that person."
As I've said before, some people get on here thinking they know all about theology and God and then proceed to show their ignorance.
Lk 1:36 Even Elizabeth your relative is going to have a child in her old age, and she who was said to be barren is in her sixth month. Lk 1:37 For nothing is impossible with God.”
Lk 1:38 “I am the Lord’s servant,” Mary answered. “May it be to me as you have said.” Then the angel left her.
Think of it this way. People today would say the resurrection from the dead is impossible. Yet Jesus rose and he raised 3 other people. But if the resurrection is impossible, then all religion is a waste of time because then there is no hope for people. So if people religion is a pointless waste of time, then why are they on a religion forum??? That really makes no sense.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965
The Day of Resurrection is for the Righteous only...
another example of what augiedogie was speaking about " some people get on here thinking they know all about theology and God and then proceed to show their ignorance."
The resurrection of all:
Righteous \ unrighteous = good \ evil
“Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his
voice and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned. ...... Jesus
Righteous \ unrighteous = sheep \ goats
All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.
He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. ...... Jesus
Righteous \ unrighteous = the godly \ the unrighteous
then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from trials and to hold the unrighteous for punishment on the day of judgment. ..... 2 Peter 2:9
"What if Jesus is not the God but a servant of God?"
Jesus is God but he is also the Son of God who serves Him with great love. "Servant" is a wrong description in a sense. A son is not his father's servant; a father is not the master of his son. A father and son relationship is very different from that of master and servant.
"What if Jesus is not the God but a servant of God?"
Jesus is God but he is also the Son of God who serves Him with great love. "Servant" is a wrong description in a sense. A son is not his father's servant; a father is not the master of his son. A father and son relationship is very different from that of master and servant.
So, all those mentioned in the OT as Son's of G-d were in fact G-d???...
another example of what augiedogie was speaking about " some people get on here thinking they know all about theology and God and then proceed to show their ignorance."
The resurrection of all:
Righteous \ unrighteous = good \ evil
“Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his
voice and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned. ...... Jesus
Righteous \ unrighteous = sheep \ goats
All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.
He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. ...... Jesus
Righteous \ unrighteous = the godly \ the unrighteous
then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from trials and to hold the unrighteous for punishment on the day of judgment. ..... 2 Peter 2:9
And you know all about it???...I was referring to what the Jews believe to be Truth...And since Christianity was originally a Jewish sect...Wellll?...
sadly MANY christians post scriptures which they believe Jesus or someone else saying he's the Almighty God/Father. But who are we to believe, man who come at times with their OWN knowledge ,(Pro.3:5,6 Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths). this false belief can lead one to destruction ,(Pro.16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death). And for those who refuse to believe the truth, Jehovah God.... will let them believe what they choose,which would lead to death ,(James 1:28And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient). Also (2Thess. 2:9-12).
and yes I said Jehovah, (english), God, (Exo.6:3 And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them). a name that even one minister snatch a this page out of his bible when he was shown that the name was ALSO in his bible. And stated ,”not anymore”, how sad! Other scriptures shows this name ,(Isa.12:2, Psa. 83:18 and Exo. 17:15). the God of Israel, Jesus Father,name was removed and placed with capital letters L,O,R,D, which small letters Lord is used for Jesus. I at one time didn't believe the name was in the bible. Because in 1985 I had a new kj bible and at Exo.6:3 it said LORD! But a friend prove me wrong when she brought to me an older version of kj. In that bible it said Jehovah! there are SO...many scriptures showing Jesus is NOT the Father, and has one!
If we say we follow Jesus, than BELIEVE HIM! , (John17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent). He showed in order to gain life, we have to know him AND... the true God. Did he say he was God? Jesus said GOD... love the word so much that he SENT... HIS SON,(John 3:16). Jesus didn't say he came on his own. When Jesus got a little afraid of he had to do, (die), he prayed to hisFather ,(Matt.26:39 And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed,saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me:nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt). Jesus showed ALL he did wasn't of his OWN WILL, but of his Father ,(John5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me).
Many are taught to pray to Jesus, but what did HE TEACH ,(Matt. 6:9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name). He also said it's God... who hears or don't prayers ,(John9:31Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth). Jesus said calling on him WON'T SAVE US, if one doesn't do his Father's WILL ,(Matt.7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven). Jesus showed he LOVE the Father, and does whatever heasked ,(John14:31 But that the world may know that I love the Father; and as the Father gave me commandment, even so I do. Arise, let us go hence).
And for the MANY who said Jesus was the son on earth ,but the Father in Heaven, THEY ARE WRONG ,(John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren,and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and tomy God, and your God). As one can see if they choose to Jesus showed he will be IN Heaven with his GOD and FATHER. Paul, a man Jesus from Heaven chose, shows Jesus is NOW sitting next to his Father in Heaven. NOT is the Father in Heaven ,(Heb. 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down atthe right hand of the throne of God). He also said ,God was overJesus, (1Cor.11:3But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God).
And finally, John, who was the last writer of Jehovah and Jesus words.Basically shows That at the time when destruction of the wicked comes. Man would be in such fear of him and his Father, (the one on the throne), that they would rather the mountains kill them instead,(Rev.6:16,17And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand)? So again, instead of disbelieve a religion group because some teach theTRUTH concerning Jesus NOT being the Father/God. MANY “christians”need to accept what Jesus himself had said, he's NOT... the Father and ALMIGHTY God. We can accept the truth or be destroyed, it's your world! peace
John 8:56-59
Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.
Why did they want to stone him? Because he referred to himself as "I am"
Exodus 3:14
And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
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