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Then why bother wasting electrons posting here? It's all over and decided.
Because the truth will set you free. Do you love the truth? “ because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:” 2 Thessalonians 2:9–11 (KJV 1900)
There is a fixed number marked out for salvation and a fixed number marked out for damnation. Nothing can change that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wellsmaine
Then why bother wasting electrons posting here? It's all over and decided.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1689dave
Because the truth will set you free. Do you love the truth? “ because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:” 2 Thessalonians 2:9–11 (KJV 1900)
How does knowing the truth bring about your version of salvation if the number of the saved is set and the number of the damned cannot be altered?
How does knowing the truth bring about your version of salvation if the number of the saved is set and the number of the damned cannot be altered?
Why did God create the universe and all that is in it? You cannot understand salvation until you study to answer this. Hint, Paul spends lots of time on this.
There is a fixed number marked out for salvation and a fixed number marked out for damnation. Nothing can change that.
God is a God of Justice. What you are proposing is not in any way just.
Deuteronomy 32:4 "He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he."
Jesus is our advocate with the Father. He payed not only for our sins, but for the sins of the "whole world."
1 John 2:1 "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world".
If God choses who will be saved and who will not be saved, he is not a just God. If God is not just, there would be no need for a Savior, as there would be no need to meet the demand of justice. God could just say you are saved and you are not! That is that! No justice required!
Through God's mercy, Jesus Christ paid for our sins so those who believe in Jesus Christ and follow his teachings will be saved. Jesus paid the demand of justice!
Titus 3:5 "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour."
All must have this opportunity to chose to follow Christ or not.
God is a God of Justice. What you are proposing is not in any way just.
Deuteronomy 32:4 "He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he."
Jesus is our advocate with the Father. He payed not only for our sins, but for the sins of the "whole world."
1 John 2:1 "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world".
If God choses who will be saved and who will not be saved, he is not a just God. If God is not just, there would be no need for a Savior, as there would be no need to meet the demand of justice. God could just say you are saved and you are not! That is that! No justice required!
Through God's mercy, Jesus Christ paid for our sins so those who believe in Jesus Christ and follow his teachings will be saved. Jesus paid the demand of justice!
Titus 3:5 "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour."
All must have this opportunity to chose to follow Christ or not.
You teach salvation by works.
You are holding God to your standards and saying he is immoral. Yikes! Here's what Protestanism says in history. (From the Westminster Confession)
III. By the decree of God, for the manifestation of his glory, some men and angels are predestinated unto everlasting life, and others foreordained to everlasting death.
IV. These angels and men, thus predestinated and foreordained, are particularly and unchangeably designed; and their number is so certain and definite, that it cannot be either increased or diminished.
This is what the bible says in summary. Hit the books before risking the blasphemey of God.
You are holding God to your standards and saying he is immoral. Yikes! Here's what Protestanism says in history. (From the Westminster Confession)
III. By the decree of God, for the manifestation of his glory, some men and angels are predestinated unto everlasting life, and others foreordained to everlasting death.
IV. These angels and men, thus predestinated and foreordained, are particularly and unchangeably designed; and their number is so certain and definite, that it cannot be either increased or diminished.
This is what the bible says in summary. Hit the books before risking the blasphemey of God.
If I am predestined, I risk nothing.
My God is a God of Justice and a God of love. He welcomes all of his children to come unto Christ.
Romans 10:12-13 "The same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved".
Jesus is the Savior of the "whole world". (1 John 2:1)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1689dave
There is a fixed number marked out for salvation and a fixed number marked out for damnation. Nothing can change that.
If "nothing can change that" why does God sends out missionaries to the whole world to preach His Gospel? What would be the point? Missionaries are sent out to preach the Gospel, for:
"How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? 15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent?" (Romans 10:14:15)
My God is a God of Justice and a God of love. He welcomes all of his children to come unto Christ.
Romans 10:12-13 "The same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved". Jesus is the Savior of the "whole world". (1 John 2:1)
If "nothing can change that" why does God sends out missionaries to the whole world to preach His Gospel? What would be the point? Missionaries are sent out to preach the Gospel, for: "How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? 15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent?" (Romans 10:14:15)
I can't find the ^above^ words at ( 1st John 2:1 ) but I do see the word " IF" at 1st John 1:7.
"IF" we are walking in the light.......
"IF" is the reason why Jesus' ransom covers MANY and does Not say all at Matthew 20:28.
Those who commit the unforgivable sin of Matthew 12:32 are never forgiven.
I can't find the ^above^ words at ( 1st John 2:1 ) but I do see the word " IF" at 1st John 1:7.
"IF" we are walking in the light.......
"IF" is the reason why Jesus' ransom covers MANY and does Not say all at Matthew 20:28.
Those who commit the unforgivable sin of Matthew 12:32 are never forgiven.
The "above" words meaning "whole world"? Actually, they are in verse 2. The complete intended scripture was 1 John 2:1-2 which in KJV reads:
"My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."
Here, the Bible clearly shows that God does not exclude any man/woman in the whole world from salvation by predestination. Salvation is available to all who believe and follow Christ. Yes "many" because all will not accept to follow Christ. (but that is another subject)
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