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The Jews reject Jesus because He is too passive and nice for their sensibilities? Is this your assertion?
To them, Jesus represented or claimed to BE an unacceptable God of agape, period. Their War God was wrathful, vengeful, all-powerful, and no wimp. Jesus would have had to smite the Romans with His Godly powers to be accepted by them. Certainly the zealot, Judas, fully expected He was helping Him to do just that, IMO. Jesus's acquiescence to their unjust, savage, and brutal treatment of Him was utterly incomprehensible and inconceivable to them!
Their utter astonishment at His passivity is why they came up with the convoluted and absurd interpretation they did! God MUST have demanded it as a blood sacrifice for some dastardly human failings we were guilty of!! I remain utterly bemused that such primitive and barbaric ridiculousness has endured unchanged for over two millennia!!! We are clearly a species with widespread self-esteem issues.
To them, Jesus represented or claimed to BE an unacceptable God of agape, period. Their War God was wrathful, vengeful, all-powerful, and no wimp. Jesus would have had to smite the Romans with His Godly powers to be accepted by them. Certainly the zealot, Judas, fully expected He was helping Him to do just that, IMO. Jesus's acquiescence to their unjust, savage, and brutal treatment of Him was utterly incomprehensible and inconceivable to them!
Their utter astonishment at His passivity is why they came up with the convoluted and absurd interpretation they did! God MUST have demanded it as a blood sacrifice for some dastardly human failings we were guilty of!! I remain utterly bemused that such primitive and barbaric ridiculousness has endured unchanged for over two millennia!!! We are clearly a species with widespread self-esteem issues.
The Jews rejected God's Incarnation full stop. Anybody claiming to be God would draw their ire, no matter the personality of the claimant.
In any case, we are not Jews and we do not accept or reject Jesus based on His personality. We accept Him because He rose from the dead. Therefore, since Jesus is God, we know that He is the God who spoke to Abraham and Moses. There is no conflict whatsoever between the God of the Old Testament and the person of Jesus Christ.
God is love, and this love was demonstrated in His willingness to live among us and suffer and die as an offering to God the Father on our behalf. Only God is worthy of God.
The Jews rejected God's Incarnation full stop. Anybody claiming to be God would draw their ire, no matter the personality of the claimant.
In any case, we are not Jews and we do not accept or reject Jesus based on His personality. We accept Him because He rose from the dead. Therefore, since Jesus is God, we know that He is the God who spoke to Abraham and Moses. There is no conflict whatsoever between the God of the Old Testament and the person of Jesus Christ.
God is love, and this love was demonstrated in His willingness to live among us and suffer and die as an offering to God the Father on our behalf. Only God is worthy of God.
He was under no obligation to do this.
The uncritical acceptance of this primitive and barbaric rationalization of Jesus's passivity is truly sad and literally reeks of self-esteem issues.
You people have no idea how wrong you are about what Jews believe.
Jesus did not meet all of the criteria for the Messiah that are written in the Torah, so they are still waiting for someone who does. It's not something they concentrate on. Instead, they work on living good lives.
Wow. And that's exactly the problem, in my opinion, with American Christianity today. It's abandoned the Bible as authoritative.
I don't think so. The majority of Anerican Christians seem to still view the Bible as authoritative. Those who question its infallibilty/status as lterally God's Word are still in the minority.
You people have no idea how wrong you are about what Jews believe.
Which Jews are you referring to? There is no uniform code for "what Jews believe".
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Originally Posted by mensaguy
Jesus did not meet all of the criteria for the Messiah that are written in the Torah, so they are still waiting for someone who does.
This is an absurd, anti-Christian sentiment and has no place in this sub-forum. The Torah belongs to the Christian Faith, which is itself the fulfillment of the Hebrew religion; and we say that Jesus does in fact meet all the criteria for the Messiah. The Jews who reject Christ do not follow the religion of Abraham and Moses, but have started a new religion and appropriated the Torah into it.
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Originally Posted by mensaguy
It's not something they concentrate on. Instead, they work on living good lives.
What a ridiculous generalization. Sure, some Jews work on living good lives. Many are degenerates. So what?
Last edited by EscAlaMike; 12-29-2022 at 08:21 AM..
You people have no idea how wrong you are about what Jews believe.
Jesus did not meet all of the criteria for the Messiah that are written in the Torah, so they are still waiting for someone who does. It's not something they concentrate on. Instead, they work on living good lives.
Interesting post! I’m wondering what criteria do the Jews believe Jesus didn’t meet? The only thing I can think of is that first century Jews were looking for a conquering Messiah, one that would lead them in military battle out of Roman subjection. I don’t know what the criteria of today’s Jews would be.
This is an argument that will only ever go in circles, because your belief is that the Bible was not also written by fallible men, which not everyone agrees is the case, of course, and you are talking to someone who believes that the Catholic Church was just as much the work of God as you believe the Bible to be.
I don’t question whether you believe what you believe. I know you do, and I know you are sincere as most people here are. However, I think your view of God’s word is wrong. It puts you in a position of picking and choosing what you will or won’t abide by. It allows you to add or take away as you see fit. As for me, I believe the Bible to be God breathed. Therefore, I abide by it to the best of my ability. In the end God will judge. I leave it in His hands.
The Catechism does not contradict what I said. The baptized believers in the New Testament still needed the gift of the Holy Ghost, i.e. confirmation as was already explained by myself and CCCyou.
Did you forget about Acts 2:38? The gift of the Holy Spirit is given at baptism.
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God is infinitely capable of the completion of baptismal grace, and He normally does this by conferring the gift of confirmation upon baptized believers!
There is no such thing as “the gift of confirmation” in Scripture. The gift of the Holy Spirit is given at baptism.
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The grace of the beatific vision, for one.
. I’m sorry, but I don’t know what that is. I’m going to assume this is another tradition of the Catholic Church.
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It seems evident to me that when you and I are using the word "grace", we are not even meaning the same thing. Either that, or you are severely limiting the ways in which God's grace can be imparted to us.
Maybe you should tell me what you believe grace is. I doubt we’d see it differently.
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