Transubstantiation??? (pagan, Romans, witness, gods)

[MissKate12]

Originally Posted by EscAlaMike

The words "faith alone" are not found anywhere in Scripture; except in James where it is written that we are NOT saved by faith alone.

On this we agree! If faith were alone, it would be dead!

[MissKate12]

Originally Posted by EscAlaMike

Not explicitly, though it can be inferred.

In Luke 22:32 we see Jesus command Peter to "confirm [or strengthen] your brothers".

In Acts 8:14-17 and Acts 19:1-6, we see Peter and John, and then Paul, respectively, laying on hands and imparting the "gift of the Holy Ghost" upon those who had already been baptized.

At the end of Luke, we see Jesus giving His disciples a special blessing just prior to His Ascension; and in Acts 1 He promises them the gift of the Holy Ghost. It's possible that this was a reference to what we now call confirmation.

It seems you are reading an awful lot into these passages. You’ve made them to be ongoing rituals. The context of each doesn’t allow for that. Unlike baptism and the Lord’s Supper, the imparting of spiritual gifts ended with the apostles.

Does the Catholic Church consider confirmation to be a formal entry into the church?

[KathrynAragon]

Originally Posted by MissKate12

It seems you are reading an awful lot into these passages. You’ve made them to be ongoing rituals. The context of each doesn’t allow for that. Unlike baptism and the Lord’s Supper, the imparting of spiritual gifts ended with the apostles.

Does the Catholic Church consider confirmation to be a formal entry into the church?

There are seven sacraments, the first being Baptism. Another one is Holy Communion/Eucharist. The third one that has to do with entry into the Catholic Church is Confirmation. It's confirmation of the presence of the Holy Spirit actually.

The other sacraments are the Healing of the Sick, Penance, Marriage, and/or Ordination.

[LookinForMayberry]

Originally Posted by MissKate12

Yes? No?

Of course not. It is a spiritual ritual, not a physical one.

[BaptistFundie]

Originally Posted by EscAlaMike

The words "faith alone" are not found anywhere in Scripture; except in James where it is written that we are NOT saved by faith alone.

It's all over Scripture. Galatians, Ephesians, Romans.

I mean seriously. Was it by works of the Law that you were justified? Or by faith?

[EscAlaMike]

Originally Posted by MissKate12

Does the Catholic Church consider confirmation to be a formal entry into the church?

No; baptism is formal entry into the Church.

[Jesus'Truth]

Originally Posted by BaptistFundie

It's all over Scripture. Galatians, Ephesians, Romans.

I mean seriously. Was it by works of the Law that you were justified? Or by faith?

Whenever Paul spoke of 'not by works', he was speaking of the purification works, which circumcision in the flesh is the sign.

The works of the law are the purification/ceremonial works.

Check it out yourself.

GALATIANS

Galatians 3:10 For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse, as it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.”

Galatians 2:12 For before certain men came from James, he used to eat with the Gentiles. But when they arrived, he began to draw back and separate himself from the Gentiles because he was afraid of those who belonged to the circumcision group.

Galatians 5:6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.

Galatians 5:11 Brothers and sisters, if I am still preaching circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been abolished.

Galatians 6:11 Not Circumcision but the New Creation
See what large letters I use as I write to you with my own hand!

Galatians 6:13 Not even those who are circumcised keep the law, yet they want you to be circumcised that they may boast about your circumcision in the flesh.

Galatians 6:15 Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is the new creation.


ROMANS

Romans 2:25 Circumcision has value if you observe the law, but if you break the law, you have become as though you had not been circumcised.

Romans 2:27 The one who is not circumcised physically and yet obeys the law will condemn you who, even though you have the written code and circumcision, are a lawbreaker.

Romans 2:28 A person is not a Jew who is one only outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical.

Romans 2:29 No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person’s praise is not from other people, but from God

Romans 3:1 [ God’s Faithfulness ] What advantage, then, is there in being a Jew, or what value is there in circumcision?

Romans 4:11 And he received circumcision as a sign, a seal of the righteousness that he had by faith while he was still uncircumcised. So then, he is the father of all who believe but have not been circumcised, in order that righteousness might be credited to them.


EPHESIANS


Ephesians 2:11 [ Jew and Gentile Reconciled Through Christ ] Therefore, remember that formerly you who are Gentiles by birth and called “uncircumcised” by those who call themselves “the circumcision” (which is done in the body by human hands)—

[EscAlaMike]

Originally Posted by EscAlaMike

The words "faith alone" are not found anywhere in Scripture; except in James where it is written that we are NOT saved by faith alone.

Originally Posted by BaptistFundie

It's all over Scripture. Galatians, Ephesians, Romans.

I mean seriously. Was it by works of the Law that you were justified? Or by faith?

The words "faith alone" are found nowhere in Galatians, Ephesians, or Romans.

We are not Jews; and the Mosaic law to which Paul repeatedly refers to never had saving power - then or now.

[Jesus'Truth]

Originally Posted by EscAlaMike

No; baptism is formal entry into the Church.

Confession and repentance and faith is the way into the Church, the Body of Christ.

[Jesus'Truth]

Originally Posted by EscAlaMike

The words "faith alone" are found nowhere in Galatians, Ephesians, or Romans.

We are not Jews; and the Mosaic law to which Paul repeatedly refers to never had saving power - then or now.

Most all denominations that I know of don't do what Jesus says to do and that is to confess and repent of sins to get saved.

Acts 2:38 Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

An infant cannot repent. Many denominations perform infant baptisms. The way to salvation changes by infant baptism. Infant baptism is not biblical. Catholics, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Episcopalians, a sect of Methodists, and Reformed denominations perform infant baptisms; they preach this falseness, which is a damaging blow to those needing the truth.


And there are other denominations that don't baptize infants, but they preach faith alone and say not to confess and repent of your sins to get saved.


James 2:24 You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone.

Many misunderstand Paul about ‘no works’. The works that Paul is speaking about that do not save are the ceremonial works. The only time the Bible tells us “faith alone” is to tell us what kind of faith not to have. Baptists, Lutherans, and many denominations teach and practice this falseness, it interferes with helping others to seek God and find Him. It goes against God and His Truth.