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Nashville, Phoenix, and Charlotte are all growing at less than 2% annually. Quite pathetic considering that Phoenix and Charlotte were growing at more than 3% annually prior to the recession.
Nashville has never had big growth. It has always and still is just above average.
Average would be the US average of 0.7% for 2012-13, or 2.4% for 2010-13.
Nashville's MSA grew by 1.8% from 2012-13 and 5.2% for 2010-13.
More than twice the national average isn't just "above average". It's not at the rate of the very top group, but it is very strong. Nashville has been hovering around about the #10-12 mark for percentage growth of 1 million+ metros for about 20 years now (about 60% total growth since 1990). Maybe not "big growth" by your definition, but not just "above average" either.
The metro area is right around 7 million. Dallas feels larger because it shares another fast, growing city which is Fort Worth. If one were to divide the 2 cities separate, Dallas (excluding FW) would only be about 4.6 million. Fort Worth would have a population of around 2.3 million.
Thanks for offering that separation. I've often wondered how large each city would be if it stood alone. HOWEVER, I'm curious if you took into account the fact that the airport, sports teams and theme parks all fall in the Fort Worth side of the Metroplex? How does that swing things?
Here, I direct you to figure 3 (hold ctrl and press the F key) and you will see that Phoenix crashed from growing nearly 4% annually to barely above 1 percent in 2009. To this day, Phoenix has not recovered. It probably never will.
Now, lets move on to all metros as a whole.
Moderator cut: link removed, linking to competitor sites is not allowed
Here, you can see that Charlotte grew 32% between 2000 and 2010. The secret data in there though is that Charlotte was growing at nearly 4% annually, just like Phoenix, until the Great Recession hit. Today, it is growing at a 1.8% annual rate. Pathetic considering what it was prior to the crash.
Looking at Nashville, its metro grew by 21.2% between 2000 and 2010. Today, it is growing at a rate of roughly 1.7% a year. Slightly down from what is was growing prior to the recession but it was never a miraculous grower to begin with.
Here is the list of metro areas and their growth rate post 2010 census. Don't worry, Wikipedia has the data sourced correctly.
As to the MSA vs CSA debate, one thing I've never seen discussed on this site is the handful of MSAs / CSAs that constitute two entirely separate media markets. For example, despite being barely 40 miles apart and having overlapping suburbs, Washington DC and Baltimore are both independent TV markets with the full range of network stations that can be viewed by viewers in both markets.
And though further apart, the same thing holds true for Miami and Palm Beach. The Miami/South Florida MSA contains two completely separate TV markets with viewership that overlaps. Are there any others?
Then, of course, there are a handful of MSAs/CSAs that are served by split TV licenses. Dallas-Fort Worth is probably the largest, with the Fox and ABC stations based in Dallas and the CBS and NBC stations based in Fort Worth.
The strangest may be Greenville-Spartanburg-Asheville, in which each city holds a license to one of the three legacy network news station: NBC is in Greenville, CBS is in Spartanburg and ABC is in Asheville.
And there are adjacent MSAs of respectable size in which all the TV stations are licensed to one city. For example, a sizable portion of Savannah's TV market (and advertising base) covers the adjacent South Carolina Lowcountry, yet the Hilton Head and Savannah MSAs remain separate. All of the Savannah TV stations market themselves as "Savannah-Hilton Head" and their news operations cover both states equally.
Ditto Macon-Warner Robins, which is especially odd since the city's are only 19 miles apart and the urban areas of both MSAs physically touch each other. Again, Macon's media market fully incorporates Warner Robins, which doesn't even have a daily newspaper. But despite the cities being so closely related, the OMB has them in two separate MSAs.
Thanks for offering that separation. I've often wondered how large each city would be if it stood alone. HOWEVER, I'm curious if you took into account the fact that the airport, sports teams and theme parks all fall in the Fort Worth side of the Metroplex? How does that swing things?
I've often felt that if you carved off the city of Fort Worth from the Metroplex (not the whole Tarrant County however) you would have a metro area that almost mirrors Atlanta. The main difference in Dallas and Atlanta in basic growth patterns is Dallas does not sprawl to the east as much as Atlanta. Where Gwinnett sits in relation to the core of Atlanta, the eastern/NE burbs of Dallas start to taper off. The pull of Fort Worth and more specifically the DFW airport has drawn the outward growth of Dallas more to the west. Drive 20 miles due west of Atlanta and you feel like you are starting to leave the metro area. The same distance west of Dallas and you are in the middle of Arlington with both the NFL and MLB stadiums, Six Flags, etc. Both Dallas and Atlanta have grown disproportionately north, the south sides of both have lagged.
I always said Atlanta feels like a 4-5 million metro...around 4.5 million...I don't see how Atlanta's metro is even 5.5 million. Dallas is way bigger than Atlanta anyway when it comes to metro size...isn't it like 7 million? It's 1.5 million more.
Why are we as a nation paying millions for a Census Bureau when all we need is for you and your "feeler" to report on how big or small a region is?
Average would be the US average of 0.7% for 2012-13, or 2.4% for 2010-13.
Nashville's MSA grew by 1.8% from 2012-13 and 5.2% for 2010-13.
More than twice the national average isn't just "above average". It's not at the rate of the very top group, but it is very strong. Nashville has been hovering around about the #10-12 mark for percentage growth of 1 million+ metros for about 20 years now (about 60% total growth since 1990). Maybe not "big growth" by your definition, but not just "above average" either.
This is true. Compared to the national average, Nashville definitely shines. But I am just saying compared to what the country was pulling before the recession is pretty sad.
Example - NYC at 23million!? Hell the are only 17 million in the state of NY! Are they counting all of Jersey as dependent of NYC? LMAO! Washington-Baltimore-ARLINGTON!? Arlington is the smallest county in the U.S. so to put it here as if it is some huge contributor is ludicrous. I've been to the bay area. It's not as big as D/FW for sure and neither is Boston; are they counting eastern Canada? lol
The US Census bureau lists the three largest cities (or Census Designated Places) in order of population in both the MSA and CSA listings. Arlington has over 200k, no other burb in all of northern VA or Maryland has a population approaching that, so Arlington wins the title. It is because the Census Bureau lists Arlington as a Census Designated Place that it gets to be listed. That it is also a county is neither here nor there, the Bureau does not lists counties as such. They do list cities that have consolidated with their counties, but they don't list counties.
The listing cities will change after each census. Marietta, GA has dropped off the Atlanta list as Roswell has surpassed it in population on the MSA listing). Athens gets the second listing and Roswell drops in the CSA listing.
Different states will have differing rules on cities and counties, some states (Georgia) have many small counties. Some (California) have fewer but geographically larger counties. Some areas of the country will have physical boundaries that limit the growth (SF/Oakland... ocean, bay, mountains; Miami/Fort Lauderdale... ocean, swamp) while others (Dallas, Atlanta) have few geographical impediments in any direction.
It all makes for unique situations for every area looked at. That you don't like the "feel" of what makes up a CSA is neither here nor there. To blast one area as being crazy because of your perceptions is nonsensical. Dallas' CSA now goes into Oklahoma. New York's goes into PA. What would be disingenuous would be to compare the CSA of one city with the MSA of another.
It would do well to study up on what the Bureau has defined as a CSA and MSA before getting the knickers in a twist.
Why are we as a nation paying millions for a Census Bureau when all we need is for you and your "feeler" to report on how big or small a region is?
What is funny about that poster's post is that I think Atlanta feels way bigger than Dallas. lol. I have spent a lot of time in both cities. Atlanta has the rapid transit rail and a massive skyline and way denser neighborhoods.
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