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Boston/DC & NYC/Philly: Boston and DC Metro are the obvious most posh and elitist metros. They have the most European influence on architecture as well. Also they provide the highest Quality of life compared to the NYC Area and Greater Philly area. Boston and DC are also the clean ones while NYC and Philly are the dirty ones... DC/Boston are also the most highly educated metros at 50% and 47% respectively at a BA or higher.. NYC and Philly are both around 35% iirc. New York and Philly also can be compared as having the biggest skylines, while Boston/DC stay basically squat. DC and Boston also have the largest tech/biotech markets on this foursome pair, while NYC and Philly I think have the largest Banking economies and most Fortune 500 companies city proper.
Boston/NY & DC/Philly: Boston and NY are more ethnically similar. Both cities host vast Italian, Irish, Haitian, Jamaican and Caribbean populations. They are both the furthest North and have the thickest Sports rivalry. They also are the two most successful cities in Sports. DC and Philly are the most 'southern' of the two and have the most desireable weather. DC and Philly also were huge hubs for US Airways, now AA... while AA had smaller hubs in JFK and BOS (Latter doesnt exist anymore). Boston/NY have the largest financial services sectors while DC and Philly have alternative similars.
Philly/Boston & NY/DC: NY and DC are the most prominent cities and most influential on the global scale while Boston and Philly are very global, but not nearly as much as DC and NYCs influence. NYC and DC both have two or three major airports while PHL and Boston only have one major airport. Philly and Boston have the most Pre1900 Historical significance, while NYC and DC have the most Post 1900 History. PHL and BOS served as huge factors in early wars and early American history.
It's interesting you brought up the US Airways link between Philly and DC. Another one is Comcast. Comcast is heavily present in Philly and down to Baltimore/DC. Traditionally, the New York market was more covered with Time Warner and Cablevision.
From a Philly angle, I voted for New York and Philly though. It's just more connected / more easily to be traveled in a day trip, and Philly is a smaller scale less rich version of NYC.
I think the Philly / DC link is a bit more tenuous. New York and Boston have the stronger rivalries, leaving Philly and DC a bit out, although Philly has a rivalry with NYC teams and Boston to a lesser extent. There is a large area of rural NE Maryland that splits the Philly market from the Baltimore/DC market where as Bucks County then Central NJ density leads directly into the NY market, although that said, I'd rather drive down to the DC area to get past it (if I had to) than drive in through NYC to get past it. (For the latter, I'd take the train). I also feel personally when I cross into the DC market, I'm in the South. Everything is newer too.
The US capital history of Philly is just a historical footnote. Just less harsh weather but typically similar weather between DC and Philly, and a few random things like US Airways (now American Airlines) hubs, Comcast - corporations have a large presence in Philly, but more a monopoly presence than a well liked presence.
You really love taking shots at Philadelphia...
You realize there are many desirable neighborhoods outside of Center City? To make a claim that areas "will never gentrify" is beyond silly. Tell that to the several neighborhoods that went from ghettos to among the most desirable in a short period of time.
Philadelphia is behind the other 3 in terms of improvement/investment/gentrification, but its hardly a wasteland. Every time I visit the city, I am impressed with the positive changes. Heck, the first time I went to Fishtown (bordering South Kensington) 10 years ago I was leery of walking to my friends house at night, now its like an entirely different neighborhood.
My advice to you is to leave the false sweeping generalizations to yourself. I am not asking you to like Philadelphia, but you clearly have a negative bias toward the city.
For a period of time, Philadelphia was the epicenter of commerce and culture in the new world, 2nd to London, there were several factors that led to the shift, New York as a trade and immigration hub and the Erie Canal is one of the biggest catalysts.
Also, less known, the Quaker mentality among many didn't help Philadelphia (IMO).
To that poster's point though, there is a lot of area in Philly that is poor/ or ghetto. I used to commute by drive from NE Philly to Allegheny Avenue to Temple's Health Science campus. It was ghetto ten years ago. At times, I would take the Orange Line to/from Center City from Erie Station. Really ghetto station.
Along with Camden to the east of Philly, it just seems like a lot of impoverished area in Philly. Has it gentrified or chance of happening? Does Boston or DC have large areas/equivalents like this?
One way Philly is totally unlike Boston, New York and DC is the amount of tourists, international flights from foreign airlines, higher income salaries, house values and wealth those cities have. In some ways, I think Philly is like a mini Chicago metro, or maybe it is like Cleveland, just that it's larger than that, with characteristics of it being in the Northeast. I think the Ivy leave link of Philly (with U. Penn) to the NE which is always brought up really is so marginal to most people who live in Philly region or pass through it.
That is the most false stereotype played on this site. Other than row houses, how exactly are Baltimore and Philly so similar?? Baltimore and DC are far more similar. They both are majority black cities that have similar African American somewhat southern/mid-Atlantic culture.
Agreed. DC and Baltimore are far more similar. After all, it's the same "urrea" (area in their similar sounding black accent) lol.
To that poster's point though, there is a lot of area in Philly that is poor/ or ghetto. I used to commute by drive from NE Philly to Allegheny Avenue to Temple's Health Science campus. It was ghetto ten years ago. At times, I would take the Orange Line to/from Center City from Erie Station. Really ghetto station.
Along with Camden to the east of Philly, it just seems like a lot of impoverished area in Philly. Has it gentrified or chance of happening? Does Boston or DC have large areas/equivalents like this?
One way Philly is totally unlike Boston, New York and DC is the amount of tourists, international flights from foreign airlines, higher income salaries, house values and wealth those cities have. In some ways, I think Philly is like a mini Chicago metro, or maybe it is like Cleveland, just that it's larger than that, with characteristics of it being in the Northeast. I think the Ivy leave link of Philly (with U. Penn) to the NE which is always brought up really is so marginal to most people who live in Philly region or pass through it.
To say that those areas exist is one thing; to say that they will remain the way they are forever (or at least for the foreseeable future) quite another. It was that latter aspect that drew fire from cpomp and me.
As for DC, do you remember what the area around U Street-Shaw Metro station looked like before the subway arrived? It sure didn't look like what it does now. Much of the north central part of the District remained scarred by the 1968 riots much the same way that a part of North Central Philadelphia west of Temple along Columbia (now Cecil B. Moore) Avenue was by the 1964 riots. U Street's come back completely; Temple is trying to turn Cecil B. Moore Avenue into an extension of its campus, which is not a strategy for durable revitalization but will make the street look better, if superficially so.
So once again: much of what you see in DC now didn't look like that 20 or even 10 years ago. Parts of Philly don't look like they looked 10 or even five years ago now - and there were people back then saying that the rundown neighborhoods that have changed since then would never change. Let's revisit this question wrt Philly in another 10 years.
To that poster's point though, there is a lot of area in Philly that is poor/ or ghetto. I used to commute by drive from NE Philly to Allegheny Avenue to Temple's Health Science campus. It was ghetto ten years ago. At times, I would take the Orange Line to/from Center City from Erie Station. Really ghetto station.
Along with Camden to the east of Philly, it just seems like a lot of impoverished area in Philly. Has it gentrified or chance of happening? Does Boston or DC have large areas/equivalents like this?
One way Philly is totally unlike Boston, New York and DC is the amount of tourists, international flights from foreign airlines, higher income salaries, house values and wealth those cities have. In some ways, I think Philly is like a mini Chicago metro, or maybe it is like Cleveland, just that it's larger than that, with characteristics of it being in the Northeast. I think the Ivy leave link of Philly (with U. Penn) to the NE which is always brought up really is so marginal to most people who live in Philly region or pass through it.
I didn't deny that Philadelphia has more bad / under developed areas compared to NYC, DC and Boston, but the city and metro especially are far from wastelands.
The Cleveland metro has 1/3 the residents of the Philadelphia metro, and the general statistics of poverty, income rates, housing values, jobs, etc. etc. are not that comparable, so not sure why Cleveland was the choice? That is certainly an inaccurate and unfair comparison, why not compare the Boston metro to Cleveland then?
I would say from a metro standpoint Boston, Chicago, Dallas, SF and Atlanta are Philadelphias competition.
From a city standpoint, those cities would also be Phialdelphias competition, though Philadelphia is a lot slower at shaking off many problems that Boston and DC shook off years ago.
(I don't count NYC since its in a league of its own).
The outlier city is DC because it isn’t Northeastern like the other cities and doesn’t have the same vibe or feel. If you have to pair, I’d probably go DC/Boston and NYC/Philly. But honestly, the east coast cities are best paired as NYC/Philly/Boston and then DC/Baltimore. These two groupings share the most similarities.
When I talk about the “Major 4 Northeastern Cities,” I am talking about the four major cities serviced by the Northeastern Corridor. Not archaic definitions of North/South as demarcated by the Mason-Dixon Line. Sure D.C. has a different built environment, as much because it is a city that grew “inorganically” from its foundation as the nation’s capital (as opposed to serving as a major immigration / industrial hub like the other three) as it does with the city’s distinct zoning codes. I think by nitpicking the Northeast Corridor into mini regions, it would be just as easy isolate Boston, because it is in New England, while the others are Mid-Atlantic. I am talking about the major four metros in the megalopolis here, not subdividing into smaller regions.
D.C. is included in the major Northeastern megalopolis, despite the features that makes it so distinct from the other three. In fact, all four of the cities have features that make them quite distinct from the others. That’s what makes this poll so fun.
Last edited by Muinteoir; 07-21-2019 at 03:37 PM..
That is the most false stereotype played on this site. Other than row houses, how exactly are Baltimore and Philly so similar?? Baltimore and DC are far more similar. They both are majority black cities that have similar African American somewhat southern/mid-Atlantic culture.
I long understood Baltimore as somewhat similar to Philadelphia before joining this site. Philadelphia really is sort of a hybrid of NYC and Baltimore in many ways. DC does not remind me much of Baltimore, besides its historic African American heritage which Philadelphia of course also has. I guess there is a link in accent as well? Not sure there is a verifiable link of Baltimore accents to DC over Philly, but I’m interested in learning about this.
When I talk about the “Major 4 Northeastern Cities,” I am talking about the four major cities serviced by the Northeastern Corridor. Not archaic definitions of North/South as demarcated by the Mason-Dixon Line. Sure D.C. has a different guilt environment, as much because it is a city that grew “inorganically” from its foundation as the nation’s capital (as opposed to serving as a major immigration / industrial hub like the other three) as it does with the city’s distinct zoning codes. I think by nitpicking the Northeast Corridor into mini regions, it would be just as easy isolate Boston, because it is in New England, while the others are Mid-Atlantic. I am talking about the major four metros in the megalopolis here, not subdividing into smaller regions.
D.C. is included in the major Northeastern megalopolis, despite the features that makes it so distinct from the other three. In fact, all four of the cities have features that make them quite distinct from the others. That’s what makes this poll so fun.
Thanks for stating that so clearly, I totally agree. Someone said DC isn’t in the same region. DC is 140 miles from Philly and yes, it’s a little different but every city is.
Agreed. DC and Baltimore are far more similar. After all, it's the same "urrea" (area in their similar sounding black accent) lol.
Baltimore and DC aren't alike just because they're both historically black. Baltimore is much olde feeling, more ghetto, more laid back, no metro, always been more blue-collar, very little international visitation, much less gentrification. It's way blacker now by almost 20%. History is Baltimore is based around the water whereas in DC its an afterthought. Extreme racial polarization, strong city culture, extreme neighborhoodism/provincialism, bar vibe, water culture and little brother factor make it more like Boston than DC-just Boston is sort of like flipped demographically from Baltimore.
Also the accents are different in Baltimore and DC although similar. DC is more southern and mumbly. THey don't finish the ends of their words. Baltimore's is almost like northern except for things like dugg tooo avenoo throoo etc. When they say things like 'muvva' 'favva' and 'bruvva' that can be heard in NYC and Boston as well. They have a few southern things as well but it varies form person to person.
Saying this as a person who has lived in Boston Baltimore and Prince Georges...
Last edited by BostonBornMassMade; 07-21-2019 at 07:15 PM..
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