Grouping Deep South Cities (comparison, live, state, places)

[Mutiny77]

Originally Posted by Redlionjr

I don't get the Houston and St. Louis comparison. And I know this anecdotal but I know a few people from St. Louis who live in Dallas and they view DFW as the south. STL and Dallas(Black culture at least) also have similar accents with certain words. More so than Houston

I was just extending the Dallas/KC comparison to the other big city in their respective states, that's all. Don't read too much into it.

[As Above So Below...]

Originally Posted by chiatldal

Fort Worth and Dallas are twin cities in same metro they are more like then different. I would say Fort Worth is more blue collar than Dallas and Dallas is more flashy. Outside of that very similar. You can't describe Fort Worth as different region than Dallas. This also why I keep saying terms like "North Texas" because that the broader region as whole DFW is in it's called North Texas. Which culturally and environmentally very different from West Texas. Fort Worth in West Texas would not be Fort Worth.

Chicago has the "Bulls" for a reason the city was home to country largest stock in some sense Fort Worth and Chicago were opposite ends of connected cities. But this doesn't change that Chicago is a midwest city like Detroit and Cleveland. This is cause it's understood the identity of Chicago is broader and it can't be reduce to just cattle. But because some have so little understand of Dallas-Fort Worth this become principle understanding of these cities, which completely ignore they do overall would have more in common with places like Memphis. New Orleans maybe a little bit off because it's the gulf, but Memphis, North Louisiana, shreveport, Little Rock AK etc.

As far the plains goes the As stated before Dallas to Atlanta in the South culturally is like Cleveland to Kansas City in the Midwest.

I'm not say Dallas doesn't have similarities to others cities in plains but it's like flipping that and saying Atlanta and Birmingham have some similarities in common with Pittsburgh. Or Memphis have similarities with St Louis. The South nor the midwest are monolithic. And there similarities north and South at given point. but otherwise the similarities and difference between KC and DFW is just broad as the similarities and difference between Atlanta and Pittsburgh.

Fort Worth and Dallas are NOT twin cities. They are completely different in their flavor, feel, and in many ways their culture. Saying that is a kick in the balls to people from Fort Worth and they would be right to feel that way. I lived in DFW for 7 years on the Dallas side. We would often go to Fort Worth because it is completely different.

Heres the problem. People are trying to pigeonhole cities into one region where they are clearly on the border of regions. DFW is on the border of the South and the Great Plains. Its Southern, but its also a Plains metro area. Take the two statements below:

DFW is a Southern Metro area. True

DFW is a Great Plains Metro area. True

DFW is Southern to the exclusion of all other regions. False

As for the comparison to other cities, do I think Fort Worth has more in common with Kansas City than Birmingham? You bet I do! I also think Kansas City has more in common with Fort Worth than it does with Cleveland. On the other hand I think Dallas has more in common with Atlanta than it does with Kansas City.

So instead of screaming "DFW IS SOUTHERN" from the top of the mountains, we should recognize the cultural nuances that it does have and realize that it doesnt comfortably belong in just one region.

[ParaguaneroSwag]

Dallas or DFW whichever way it’s put resembles Kansas City in no way. That’s all

[As Above So Below...]

Originally Posted by ParaguaneroSwag

Dallas or DFW whichever way it’s put resembles Kansas City in no way. That’s all

I think you’re wrong but whatever. This isn’t a data based topic so I have no interest in arguing it.

[Mutiny77]

Originally Posted by ParaguaneroSwag

Dallas or DFW whichever way it’s put resembles Kansas City in no way. That’s all

Makes you wonder what Kansas City might look like today if it preserved its stockyards like Fort Worth did.

[ParaguaneroSwag]

Originally Posted by Mutiny77

Makes you wonder what Kansas City might look like today if it preserved its stockyards like Fort Worth did.

True

[atadytic19]

Originally Posted by Redlionjr

Dallas doesn't have that much in common with New Orleans but I can see some similarities with Memphis as far as Black culture go. Black Dallasites accents are a little more similar to a Memphis one as well. Of course that's just one spectrum of Dallas identity and culture.



Dallas Black culture and roots are deeply tied to East Texas/Arkansas/Northwest Louisiana and Oklahoma to a lesser extent. If people consider Northeast Texas to be the closest Deep South relative in Texas than I don't see how Dallas Black culture shouldn't be included in that category considering how close both of those regions are to each other. There's actually more North East Texas influence in DFW than it is in Houston. Houston East Texas influence is definitely there but it's just as much of a Southwest Louisiana influence there as well that's different than the area labeled Ark-La-Tex.



Phoenix?? LMAO first time I heard that comparison. I get OKC, Tulsa, Little Rock or even Kansas City. But I don't get Phoenix at all. I'd probably compare Denver to Dallas before I'd compare Phoenix.



I don't get the Houston and St. Louis comparison. And I know this anecdotal but I know a few people from St. Louis who live in Dallas and they view DFW as the south. STL and Dallas(Black culture at least) also have similar accents with certain words. More so than Houston

This! A million times this.
A post with actual logic.

People on here get really silly with their logic.
The south is a billion miles wide with changes periodically.

This is how silly posters are with their logic:
East Texas is definitely southern. It's not quite like Birmingham but we agree it's southern.
Dallas is like East Texas but I'm going to choose to compare it to Birmingham instead Because...

How on Earth are you guys seriously going to use cities 9 hours away to compare DFW with when there are a plethora of Southern cities nearby that DFW are very similar too.

By this weird logic you can say that Charleston is nothing like Jackson so it's not southern.

Another thing I don't understand is people saying Houston is southern but DFW is not.
Those metros are two sides of the same coin. You take one you gotta take the other. And neither are southwestern.

The south is the only region people expect to be completely uniform. And it's the largest area.
Minneapolis and Indianapolis are night and day but we hear nothing about them being in different regions. Iowa and Michigan have little in common but there's never a peep from people.

Even in metro areas you get tons of variety. People use silly arguments that Dallas doesn't look like some distant city 900 miles away. Well no shi Sherlock. In LA you go from beaches to mountains to deserts.

The south is a big place but what ties it together is common history and centuries of shared culture.
But on the edges of the south there will always be transitions where variations show.

Miami is definitely southern but it has that Caribbean/ Latin transition.
Houston, New Orleans, Mobile and Tampa are all southern but they have variations of that Gulf coast transition.
San Antonio if you spend time in it instead of tourist traps you will see it is southern with that Mexican transition.
DFW and OKC are southern with a great plains transition.
Saint Louis is a southern city with Midwestern influences not the other way around.
Louisville is the same.
DC and Baltimore are also both southern with heavy Northeastern influences.


Harriet Tubman didn't help slaves escape the northeast to the northeast. She helped them escape the south (largely Maryland) to the northeast (Pennsylvania, New York and New England).

Tubman was born in Dorchester County Maryland. For those that also would like to discount Delaware too.
Dorchester County borders Delaware and is certainly more connected than anywhere in Virginia. And yet it and neighboring Caroline County were the stomping grounds of the most famous conductor of the underground railroad. If that legacy is not southern then I don't know what is.

Southern is not a look, it is is a shared legacy.
It stretches from the Delaware, Maryland and DC, West to STL, down through DFW and Houston and on along the gulf coast through New Orleans down to Florida. They will have their differences of you compare cities from different subregions but they all have that southern spark.

As far as the deep south I consider it to be synonymous with the blackbelt:
http://bjn9t2lhlni2dhd5hvym7llj-wpen...1338222453.png

[As Above So Below...]

How closely people seem to cling to the Southern title seems to depend solely on whether or not you have black skin. Black posters seem to cling much harder to it being a strictly southern thing and less open to the idea that a place can be southern but something else as well. I am not black so I dont understand that perspective, but I also dont want to minimize it.

Its just a different approach, not wrong, but different. What that underscores to me is that we simply need to be understanding and willing to listen to how someone from a different race might see a place different culturally.

[ParaguaneroSwag]

Originally Posted by Redlionjr

Dallas doesn't have that much in common with New Orleans but I can see some similarities with Memphis as far as Black culture go. Black Dallasites accents are a little more similar to a Memphis one as well. Of course that's just one spectrum of Dallas identity and culture.



Dallas Black culture and roots are deeply tied to East Texas/Arkansas/Northwest Louisiana and Oklahoma to a lesser extent. If people consider Northeast Texas to be the closest Deep South relative in Texas than I don't see how Dallas Black culture shouldn't be included in that category considering how close both of those regions are to each other. There's actually more North East Texas influence in DFW than it is in Houston. Houston East Texas influence is definitely there but it's just as much of a Southwest Louisiana influence there as well that's different than the area labeled Ark-La-Tex.



Phoenix?? LMAO first time I heard that comparison. I get OKC, Tulsa, Little Rock or even Kansas City. But I don't get Phoenix at all. I'd probably compare Denver to Dallas before I'd compare Phoenix.



I don't get the Houston and St. Louis comparison. And I know this anecdotal but I know a few people from St. Louis who live in Dallas and they view DFW as the south. STL and Dallas(Black culture at least) also have similar accents with certain words. More so than Houston

Originally Posted by As Above So Below...

How closely people seem to cling to the Southern title seems to depend solely on whether or not you have black skin. Black posters seem to cling much harder to it being a strictly southern thing and less open to the idea that a place can be southern but something else as well. I am not black so I dont understand that perspective, but I also dont want to minimize it.

Its just a different approach, not wrong, but different. What that underscores to me is that we simply need to be understanding and willing to listen to how someone from a different race might see a place different culturally.

I agree with both of these. That said, supposing this were true, that Houston's black culture resembles SW Louisiana more while DFW's resembles East Texas/Arkansas more, and white culture as well, this would make DFW more southern than Houston. Because South Louisiana is much more unique than East Texas as compared to the rest of the South.

Now that's just culturally ofcourse. Topographically, Houston resembles the south a lot more then Dallas.

However, I don't look at it this way. To me, each region is its own. Houston and DFW are both southern while neither is Deep South to me.

[ParaguaneroSwag]

As mentioned above, the white population in DFW following the general southern trends more than Houston can be seen with the Bible Belt.



In this scenario, the Houston-South Louisiana connection shows, as both Houston and South Louisiana sit just below on the edge of the Bible Belt while DFW is entirely within it.

But again, I see all regions individually. Evidence of influences can be shown, but Houston and DFW are both unique enough to be their own.