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Abe Lincoln used Gen. Grant and the US military to kill half a million men, women, and children - civilians as well as soldiers - in what he considered to be the southern portion of his own country, the USA.
Now you know who the real terrorists were.
the us military are terrorists ? you sound like you are recruiting for isis.
I grew up in the South, still live here in Georgia, and the folks that think this is just "goofy" are the trashy rednecks. They are also the ones freely using the N word, and throw their beer cans and cigarette butts out of their car windows, too. I am white and never thought this was cool.
I didn't grow up in the South (thankfully) and am only here now temporarily. The people are generally quite friendly though somewhat misguided in their thinking (some of them, not all).
I used goofy because teens are goofy. They don't are impulsive, they don't necessarily think, they just do, especially now with social media. It happens with the click of the send button. I'm not approving or condoning. I never used COOL (that was your choice of words).
I see the "Rebel" flag a lot down South on trucks, tee shirts, hats, bandanas, you name it. I don't like it. Usually it's on the back of a pickup full of beer cans with naked lady mud flaps. Does that make the driver a racist redneck. Not necessarily. Though I must admit I have yet to see it on a "person of color" so if the flag is for the sake of discussion only a representation of Southern pride, not racism, wouldn't proud Black Southerners wear it also?
And people that lived in the South could say their States where "Invaded" by the Northern States, who also created an Army to kill Southerners that did not comply with the wishes of the North. There are no good guy/bad guys here. That's is always only determined by who won, and that's not always accurate. Losers are always demonized. Its only by circumstances that the Confederate flag is not the United States flag, which it could have easily been, and they you would be Demonizing the Stars and Stripes instead, as a Patriot. To the South, the Union was the Terrorists.
Did you know that the North was first to hang Confederate Officers, when caught? The South condemned it, and caught and hanged several Northern Officers, then sent s letter telling the Northern General that it was not honorable and if they insisted on doing it, the South would do the same? Did you know the North was the first to use "exploding" bullets against other Troops? They only stopped because some of the ones carrying them where hit by gunfire and they started exploding on their person, maiming and killing some. Just because you had a "Blue" Uniform, did not mean it came with a set of white wings.
"Patriot" is only relevant to the person using it. Look at some of our Troops today. some of them still torture, kill civilians, rape, loot, and do things that they should not be doing.
The North and the south fought for what each was told the reason to fight was, by Politicians. They did not chose War because they where not Patriots, No matter what warped ideals you have.
They where all American Patriots . .
the us-civil war and ww2 are widely considered rightous wars in modern times. korean, vietnam, gulf war 1, gulf war 2, ... less so.
they werent patriots; they were secessionist traitors. you are on the wrong side of history my friend.
As, I've pointed out the north was indeed complicit in the establishment of slavery and profited well from it. However, that is the most simplistic view one which I didn't think need being expanded upon until now.
The slave trade was outlawed in 1808 which effectively shut down northern participation in the north Atlantic slave trade.
By 1803, less than a decade after the ratification of the Constitution New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, Massachusetts, New York, Rhode Island, Vermont and Ohio had outlawed slavery. Indiana, Illinois, Maine, Michigan, Iowa, Wisconsin, California, Minnesota, Oregon and Kansas entered into the Union as free states. So it is a bit disingenuous to claim that slavery was universal aspect of the United States prior to the Civil War.
By 1846 there were more slave states than free states, by a count of (15 to 14). So as late as 1846 more than half the country still allowed slavery.
Again as most have stated time and time again, the slave trade was popular in warm, large states, where large plantations still existed. The North didn't need slavery once it transitioned from an agriculture based economy to an industrialized economy. Basically the larger the state and the warmer the state, the more fertile climate to grow crops used slavery up until the time it was abolished following the civil war.
Even though California was admitted as a free state, they had a large supply of migrant workers that were paid very little to do the work of slaves.
Again as most have stated time and time again, the slave trade was popular in warm, large states, where large plantations still existed. The North didn't need slavery once it transitioned from an agriculture based economy to an industrialized economy. Basically the larger the state and the warmer the state, the more fertile climate to grow crops used slavery up until the time it was abolished following the civil war.
Ah, yes, Wiki does come in handy but....
The north was very much an agricultural area producing half of the nations corn, four-fifths of the nations wheat and seven-eights of its oats, which is why the South nearly starved to death. No the south chose to base there economy on slave intensive cash crops like, rice, tobacco, and cotton.
The north was very much an agricultural area producing half of the nations corn, four-fifths of the nations wheat and seven-eights of its oats, which is why the South nearly starved to death. No the south chose to base there economy on slave intensive cash crops like, rice, tobacco, and cotton.
I didn't say the north didn't produce crops, I said it was transitioning from a mostly agriculture based economy to a more industrialized economy. Industry also played a role in how the north produced crops. The north was far wealthier and there need for free labor or even cheap labor was no longer really needed by that point in time.
My point is that even if you look at westward expansion in the US in the early 1800's they used a healthy amount of migrant workers which were paid very little money and their living conditions often mirrored those of slaves. Really the term slavery was just replaced with the term migrant worker. Not much really changed until America as a whole become more developed and industrialized.
Personally, I don't have a problem with it. The difference I see though is that the pot is illegal (if its real) and for some reason smoking cigs is illegal for anyone under age while the confederate flag is not.
As long as we are within the law and not harming anyone we should be free to engage in, photograph and post photos on our own sites of whatever we want with out being crucified by others who are not being harmed and don't have to look at our deviances.
I found the difference in reactions from regular posters interesting between the two topics. One set of children is just goofing off and having fun, the other is mini-criminal.
Apparently the uneducated do not know that secession is not treason. Perhaps you should look up the definition of the word treason. The south "withdrew" from the union that it had voluntarily joined earlier. They desired to form their own country. All would have been peaceful if Lincoln let them be. There was nothing treasonist about the war, the south was a different country.
I think it should have a bearing on their college admission. It demonstrates how clueless they are to societal perception and how little they know about American history. If they did this impulsively (as the OP suggests even though s/he likely does not KNOW) that also suggests they don't think before they act. If I were a college administrator, I'd be attuned to that.
I was quite a rebel myself in my college days, yet it never once occurred to me to demonstrate that through display of a flag symbolizing a movement that acted to destroy the union of the United States of America and led to the bloody deaths of more than half a million of our citizens.
I find it puzzling that some of the same people who are horrified by movements like Occupy or the Black Panthers or other anti-government groups (including ordinary liberals in some cases), enthusiastically support the continual display of artifacts related to the political movement that actual DID almost destroy this country.
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