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Atkins was ill, from heart disease, before he fall and its very likely that contributed to him falling. But regardless of that Atkins, a guy writing diet books, was overweight and had heart disease.
Atkins was a medical doctor and cardiologist, not a guy writing diet books. Likewise, you must admit that folks like Ornish are "just guys" writing diet books since he and Atkins are both equally educated. In fact, Atkins knows more about heart disease than Ornish does because his specialty is exactly that. Ornish lacks this expertise as it's just a passing interest to him rather than something he was formally schooled in as Atkins was. Was Ornish ever a cardiologist? BTW, I consistently use Ornish as an example because your user status has been "fueled on plant power" or some such, meaning you are likely heavily or all-the-way vegan. You are also a lowfat vegan to boot, as I've personally known very skinny high-fat vegans who eat tons of cashews and cook in lots of coconut oil. Therefore, I will continue to use Ornish and his non-statistically significant high p-value low population flawed studies as my whipping boy.
Speaking of cardiologists, Atkins own cardiologist was astonished how healthy Atkins was at the time of his demise, especially his arteries.
Quote:
Atkins' personal physician and cardiologist, Dr. Patrick Fratellone, confirmed this assertion, saying, "We have been treating this condition, cardiomyopathy, for almost two years. Clearly, [Atkins'] own nutritional protocols have left him, at the age of 71, with an extraordinarily healthy cardiovascular system"
Try again.
Last edited by saigafreak; 08-31-2014 at 04:22 AM..
The only saving grace of the ironic Atkins death was that it took 10 years for his diet to experience a renaissance. It is only now that foodstuffs like butter are being completely depleted. I almost wish people would go on "plant power" lowfat vegan diets so my butter and meat wouldn't be so darned expensive now.
Atkins was a medical doctor and cardiologist, not a guy writing diet books.
Atkins was a cardiologists.....but he was also a guy writing diet books and his diet program became his career. He was also overweight and had heart disease.....which is funny for a guy writing diet books.
I have no idea why you're talking about Ornish or vegans. My status, "Powered by Plants", has nothing to do with Ornish or veganism. But Ornish has a heart disease reversal program which, unlike Atkins, he conducted studies to demonstrate its effectiveness. US News ranked the Ornish diet as #1 for heart health:
Atkins was overweight and had heart disease....his fall was likely due to his poor health. But regardless of why he fell, he was overweight and had heart disease.
I'm pretty sure skinny people can slip on ice and hit their heads. Dr. Atkins had heart disease due to an infection (cardiomyopathy).
Ornish has a heart disease reversal program which, unlike Atkins, he conducted studies to demonstrate its effectiveness. US News ranked the Ornish diet as #1 for heart health:
I prefer my heart health advice come from a cardiologist rather than a guy writing books promising to "reverse heart disease" without statistically significant studies backing them up, or populist magazines touting them.
I also noticed your glossed over what Atkins' cardiologist noted about his diet, that it led to a very healthy cardiovascular system.
ETA: ROFL. USNews isn't particularly credible when they rate the insulin spiking highly artificial "Slim-Fast" or nostalgic 1980s redux grapefruit and dry toast diets such as "Jenny Craig" over whole foods Atkins. It's like the article was written during the Cold War.
Last edited by saigafreak; 09-02-2014 at 10:35 AM..
I'm pretty sure skinny people can slip on ice and hit their heads. Dr. Atkins had heart disease due to an infection (cardiomyopathy).
I'm sure they can....yet when you're overweight, unhealthy and ill falling is much more likely. In any case, Atkins was overweight yet he was out writing diet books. Only in America.....
I'm sure they can....yet when you're overweight, unhealthy and ill falling is much more likely. In any case, Atkins was overweight yet he was out writing diet books. Only in America.....
Dr. Atkins was 195 lb when he entered the hospital after his fall. That is a pretty healthy weight.
"He said Dr. Atkins did not have a history of heart attack, nor was he obese. He said that Dr. Atkins weighed 195 pounds the day after he entered the hospital following his fall....."
"Dr. Trager said Dr. Atkins did have cardiomyopathy, a heart muscle disease that was probably caused by a virus, not by what he ate."
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts.
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts.
Yes, let's stick with the facts....you're selectively quoting the article:
"The latest twist is the publication in The Wall Street Journal on Tuesday of details from Dr. Atkins's confidential medical report. The report concludes that Dr. Atkins, 72, had a history of heart attack and congestive heart failure and notes that he weighed 258 pounds at death."
You even cropped one of the quotes you did cite, here is the full quote:
"He said that Dr. Atkins weighed 195 pounds the day after he entered the hospital following his fall, and that he gained 63 pounds from fluid retention during the nine days he was in a coma before he died.:
Yeah, 63 pounds of fluid retention in 9 days? So you see he was overweight at the time of death but his people created a cute story about 63 pounds of fluid retention in 9 days to cover it up.
But Atkins was overweight when alive as well. Another thing is Atkins had no autopsy, his family kept his medical reports closed, etc. Not exactly the way you behave when you have nothing to hide.
Wow, interesting (and long) thread. I read it because I am thinking about changing out my diet a little. I've pretty much been doing Weight Watchers and excising and I lost a lot of weight doing so (most in the first year I started, a little in the second year, and even less this third year). Now I've stalled out over the past few months with 15 pounds to go on my weight loss plan (want to be squarely in my healthy BMI... plus, that puts me back at my college weight). I am happy that I fit into my old high school letterman jacket now though (it's my hips, legs, and butt that are holding on to the weight for dear life, lol).
I am considering low carb... but not no carb. I looked at Atkins, but I don't think I can do it. First of all, I like beans and eat a lot of them. I use them to stretch out meals so they stay low cost (make chili with half a pound of beef instead of a pound, for example, and then add an extra can of kidney beans to offset). I also like fruit (and I have a sweet tooth and fruit satisfies that and keeps me from eating candy, ice cream and other refined sweets).
I have more carbs I can cut... for example, a typical dinner for me might be baked chicken, green beans, and a starch or some sort (usually perogies or potatoes or something). I am cutting the starch and increasing the veggies (can't make a chicken breast bigger and I can't eat two--just can't eat that much). I've been indulging in refined carbs too (I am looking at my friends who bring doughnuts over every time... I eat only one and count it in Weight Watchers, but I think I will cut it for good). Stuff like that.
I had to change out my exercise from swimming to using the gym since they closed the pool on me I burn less WW points at the gym, but at least it's exercise.
I never heard of this Ornish diet. I might look into it and see what it is.
And oh, something interesting I read in the latest issue of National Geographic. It doesn't take long for a culture to adjust to a diet--only a few thousand years, not millions of years. I found it interesting. They cited an example: milk. European diets have a lot of milk in them where as East Asian diets don't. Along with that, most people of European ancestry can process milk and milk products well while a lot of people of East Asian ancestry are lactose intolerant. In other words, the people in that culture evolved to match their diets. The conclusion, one diet might work well for one person, but not another, based on genetics.
That's why I am thinking low carb. My mom is on one because of type 2 diabetes. The doctor put her on it. Turns out her diabetes is under control with her diet alone (she doesn't need to take insulin or anything, except once in a great while) and she lost a lot of weight. I figure, I share her genetics, so the same diet might help me lose those last few, stubborn pounds.
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I burn less WW points at the gym, but at least it's exercise. 
