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This is a distraction. Sure we can agree that there are unhealthy thin people.
I'm not sure what that adds to the discussion about dealing with obesity as a health issue.
Some people have arthritis, we still deal with heart issues...
Sure it is but not all overweight are indeed overweight because they overeat whether it is fats, carbs or calories. Are there a good number, sure. I am sure around half of not a little more than half but there is an increasing number overweight due to other medical issues or side effects. Remember if you can't excuse or burn calories, they are still in you. So you may eat say 1600 calories a day but if you aren't able to exercise, you won't lose much of any weight and perhaps gain it.
I'm not sure what that adds to the discussion about dealing with obesity as a health issue.
Because I don't believe that this is really a discussion about public health. Truth of the matter is, you can't always judge how healthy someone is by looking at them. But that's what people want to be given permission to do.
I'd said this back in the 80's when condemning smokers became all the rage. I don't understand the American fascination with dictating other people's lifestyles, but it is everyone's favorite hobby. Maybe it's ingrained into us as animals wanting to protect the herd by ousting the ones we deem weaker. But we love, love, love coming up with ways to discriminate against others.
It used to be smokers. Now the victim of choice is fat people. Allow it to continue to be away of life and trust me, it's only a matter of time before you are the one under the microscope. You'll be shamed for being seen in public eating animal meat, or watering your lawn, or scolding your child. Eventually, it will be you people are talking about.
And for the record, I am neither a smoker nor am I morbidly obese. What I have a problem with is the gathering of mobs for the purpose of trying to figure out ways to discriminate against others.
I agree, there's no point at all in ever mentioning anyone's size or shape. It's all about being HEALTHY, not aesthetically pleasing.
Shaming can make people angry and rebellious, or for those of us who are emotional eaters, it can make us upset. And what do we do to give ourselves comfort when we're upset? We eat. And get more unhealthy.
I have a brother who fat shamed his wife till she was morbidly obese. He honestly thought he was doing her a favor. He just didn't understand the psychology of the situation. They both would have been happier if he had concentrated on leading by example with healthy food and found an exercise they enjoyed together and laid off the body image crap.
At least in this society, shaming rarely works. Most people want to do things because it helps them.
And one thing I see with the fat shaming case that you brought up is this. He most likely viewed it as a "looks" thing.
Because I don't believe that this is really a discussion about public health. Truth of the matter is, you can't always judge how healthy someone is by looking at them. But that's what people want to be given permission to do.
I'd said this back in the 80's when condemning smokers became all the rage. I don't understand the American fascination with dictating other people's lifestyles, but it is everyone's favorite hobby. Maybe it's ingrained into us as animals wanting to protect the herd by ousting the ones we deem weaker. But we love, love, love coming up with ways to discriminate against others.
It used to be smokers. Now the victim of choice is fat people. Allow it to continue to be away of life and trust me, it's only a matter of time before you are the one under the microscope. You'll be shamed for being seen in public eating animal meat, or watering your lawn, or scolding your child. Eventually, it will be you people are talking about.
And for the record, I am neither a smoker nor am I morbidly obese. What I have a problem with is the gathering of mobs for the purpose of trying to figure out ways to discriminate against others.
Being overweight doesn't in it off itself create negative externalities on other people besides healthcare drains, while smoking can through second hand smoke and possibly smokers babies, alcohol with fetal alcohol syndrome and drunk driving accidents, and a whole host of other drugs but legal and illegal.
Okay, this is wrong on so many levels... first of the violence of course. I dont condone that at all. But even the guy who made the comments, what business is it of his what other people order? What if they'd been dieting and losing weight for a month and this was their "cheat day?" What if the pizza wasn't even for them (they were bringing it to a party)? Every week at the store I buy four liters of soda for my house and I don't even drink it (it's for my friends). Granted I am not overweight, but I would be pretty ticked if someone tried to shame me for buying something unhealthy. What's wrong with people?
Because I don't believe that this is really a discussion about public health. Truth of the matter is, you can't always judge how healthy someone is by looking at them. But that's what people want to be given permission to do.
I'd said this back in the 80's when condemning smokers became all the rage. I don't understand the American fascination with dictating other people's lifestyles, but it is everyone's favorite hobby. Maybe it's ingrained into us as animals wanting to protect the herd by ousting the ones we deem weaker. But we love, love, love coming up with ways to discriminate against others.
It used to be smokers. Now the victim of choice is fat people. Allow it to continue to be away of life and trust me, it's only a matter of time before you are the one under the microscope. You'll be shamed for being seen in public eating animal meat, or watering your lawn, or scolding your child. Eventually, it will be you people are talking about.
And for the record, I am neither a smoker nor am I morbidly obese. What I have a problem with is the gathering of mobs for the purpose of trying to figure out ways to discriminate against others.
But smoking has (at least in Canada) significantly reduced as a result of those campaigns, including making it very very difficult for smokers to find a place to do so. I for one am glad smokers were (as you put it) "condemned".
The health impacts of smoking are clear, and the costs (especially in Canada) to others are significant. Society DOES have an interest in health issues.
As we see more and more focus on public health CARE then the public interest is legitimate.
We can argue about the extent to which obesity is a health issue, but it's clearly NOT a positive. If it was, you wouldn't see the vast majority of overweight people trying to lose weight. In the same way as smoking campaigns prevent people from starting, we need to have a significant focus on preventing young people from getting fat in the first place.
Similarly, I disagree that focusing on the other things (animal rights, water conservation, parenting), you identify is a bad thing - society DOES pressure others. Frankly it's that positive peer pressure that has led to some significant advances in equality rights (for example).
It's NOT okay in a collective society to say "do whatever you want".
Are you saying being overweight is a psychiatric condition? Just to be clear I am NOT seeing this comparison. One is largely behavioural (eat too much, move too little) with the few exceptions for underlying medical conditions. The other (anorexia) is a significant psychiatric condition.
The more appropriate analogy is between anorexia and one of the conditions that cause weight gain as the loss of weight is a symptom of the psychiatric condition not the reason.
Starving yourself to death is really not that much different than eating yourself to death. Saying that you can fix your morbid obesity by not eating as much is no different (or more effective) than saying you can fix your anorexia by just eating a little more. What is different about anorexia that makes a psychiatric condition as opposed to behavioral?
But smoking has (at least in Canada) significantly reduced as a result of those campaigns, including making it very very difficult for smokers to find a place to do so. I for one am glad smokers were (as you put it) "condemned".
The health impacts of smoking are clear, and the costs (especially in Canada) to others are significant. Society DOES have an interest in health issues.
As we see more and more focus on public health CARE then the public interest is legitimate.
We can argue about the extent to which obesity is a health issue, but it's clearly NOT a positive. If it was, you wouldn't see the vast majority of overweight people trying to lose weight. In the same way as smoking campaigns prevent people from starting, we need to have a significant focus on preventing young people from getting fat in the first place.
Similarly, I disagree that focusing on the other things (animal rights, water conservation, parenting), you identify is a bad thing - society DOES pressure others. Frankly it's that positive peer pressure that has led to some significant advances in equality rights (for example).
It's NOT okay in a collective society to say "do whatever you want".
As a former smoker, I will say that it was much, much easier to quit smoking than it is to lose a few pounds, let alone a significant amount of weight. Once I stopped smoking, I stopped. You can't just stop eating.
I struggled for a year to lost the weight I gained during pregnancy. And I mean struggled. I eventually did it, but those 30 pounds were 100 times harder than quitting smoking was, and I smoked 1-2 packs a day for 15 years. Like I previously mentioned, I just don't smoke anymore. No one can just not eat anymore. I also didn't have people buying me packs of cigarettes for my birthday telling me to smoke up - it's your birthday! But I sure as heck had people buying me cake telling me to go ahead - it's your birthday!
Telling someone to just eat less is like telling an alcoholic to just have one drink a day. It's not that easy for a lot of people. It may be for some, but those that are morbidly obese have brains that truly do not react to food like everyone else. Just like alcoholics don't react to alcohol like those who can just have a drink every now and then and stop.
Starving yourself to death is really not that much different than eating yourself to death. Saying that you can fix your morbid obesity by not eating as much is no different (or more effective) than saying you can fix your anorexia by just eating a little more. What is different about anorexia that makes a psychiatric condition as opposed to behavioral?
Please research this as anorexia is a very complex set of psychiatric conditions and is about a life threatening disordered view of self and food. Read the psychiatric journals as I'm not a psychiatrist.
Just know that the poster above is wrong, very few anorexics are dieters taken to the extreme. Most have never been overweight and struggle significantly with OCD like thoughts. Some morbidly obese people may have similar thoughts but the vast majority don't.
Even though I don't believe the analogy works in other than a limited number of morbidly obese cases, it actually supports the proposition that we should not take an "I'm okay, you're okay" approach to obesity.
NO parent or family member would let anorexia go untreated, including forcing treatment to aid the patient as their thoughts are so disordered they don't see the harm they're doing. The same can't be said about morbid obesity.
Even posters above argue they should "just be left alone". That seems sad to me.
As a former smoker, I will say that it was much, much easier to quit smoking than it is to lose a few pounds, let alone a significant amount of weight. Once I stopped smoking, I stopped. You can't just stop eating.
I struggled for a year to lost the weight I gained during pregnancy. And I mean struggled. I eventually did it, but those 30 pounds were 100 times harder than quitting smoking was, and I smoked 1-2 packs a day for 15 years. Like I previously mentioned, I just don't smoke anymore. No one can just not eat anymore. I also didn't have people buying me packs of cigarettes for my birthday telling me to smoke up - it's your birthday! But I sure as heck had people buying me cake telling me to go ahead - it's your birthday!
Telling someone to just eat less is like telling an alcoholic to just have one drink a day. It's not that easy for a lot of people. It may be for some, but those that are morbidly obese have brains that truly do not react to food like everyone else. Just like alcoholics don't react to alcohol like those who can just have a drink every now and then and stop.
Nobody is saying it's easy.
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