Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Living overseas for many years I've met many American men who have resigned from American society entirely. They keep a low profile and the U.S. news media largely ignore them but there numbers are growing. Once Democratskies criminalize wealth the "great resignation" should turn into a flood.
I agree these people exist, but I characterize them differently and more harshly than you do.
Lazy people exist in any society. There are always those who refuse to understand the concept that civilization requires work and taxes. Its not a question of laying on the beach all day. Its a question of doing enough work so that one can retire at a respectable age and afford a decent retirement. The kind of men you describe are the sort of people whose favorite words in the English language are "Me" or "I". I have little in common with them and little sympathy for them. Most of us who have worked hard and have a good income look down on people like that. We don't understand the kind of mentality that seeks something for nothing or a free ride in life.
I agree these people exist, but I characterize them differently and more harshly than you do.
Lazy people exist in any society. There are always those who refuse to understand the concept that civilization requires work and taxes. Its not a question of laying on the beach all day. Its a question of doing enough work so that one can retire at a respectable age and afford a decent retirement. The kind of men you describe are the sort of people whose favorite words in the English language are "Me" or "I". I have little in common with them and little sympathy for them. Most of us who have worked hard and have a good income look down on people like that. We don't understand the kind of mentality that seeks something for nothing or a free ride in life.
Jimmy Rogers, James Cameron, Eduardo Saverin, Edward Snowden are just the tip of the iceberg of men who have flown the coop because life in the USSA just isn't worth if for them any longer. They're all "jobless" living off their wits in a foreign land where their money just goes further. Many more men have withdrawn from American society and gone into a shadowy internal exile because "their services are no longer needed."
Some grandparents are in a retirement home or assisted-living facility, because they need some kind of medical supervision, meal assistance or other support. It's very costly to pay for a home health aid. It's more economical to sell their house, and have them move into a smaller unit that may have good meal service, and some kind of medical staff or at least emergency staff, at hand. Some grandparents can't handle the stairs in homes where the bedrooms are on the 2nd floor, or where the basement potential apartment-conversion or rec room or whatever, also involves stairs.
Re: converting basements (or garages, or whatever) to mini-apartments: not allowed where prohibited by zoning.
You're also assuming that the grandparents get along with their adult children and grandchildren. That's not always the case.
These things may look like good ideas on paper, but what works economically can unravel when there are all-too-human personalities involved. Multi-generational households tend to work better in other cultures, for some reason.
That's how it is here. There are no retirement facilities at all, and kids expect to take the parents/grandparents in. They grow up knowing that, and plan accordingly.
What I haven't been able to figure out, is what happens when the aging have special needs like you mentioned. Dementia or 24/7 help of some kind. I could never get an answer for that from the locals.
I think everyone is forgetting one - crime. Unless "illegal work" was meant to include crime, though most people are taking it literally as "work". Pimps, drug dealers, burglary rings, auto theft chop shops, and various other professional crime occupations abound.
Our system relies too heavily on incomes at a time where everyone is realizing that assets are more valuable and grow faster than incomes. Jobs have become undesirable for large swaths of the workforce. And many jobs, even good ones, don’t pay enough to live. The solution is to live off of capital, be it earned, inherited or borrowed.
Our system relies too heavily on incomes at a time where everyone is realizing that assets are more valuable and grow faster than incomes. Jobs have become undesirable for large swaths of the workforce. And many jobs, even good ones, don’t pay enough to live. The solution is to live off of capital, be it earned, inherited or borrowed.
Capital is not as liquid as cash/credit. If I want to eat at a restaurant, I would need to covert some form of capital into a payment as fast as handing over cash. Also, will the value of that capital be stagnant or dynamic? Think about planning to purchase a car the next time you get paid and then the value of the capital you need to make the transaction falls.
Income -> cash will always be king because it is liquid and tangible. Direct deposit is instant. It took me T+2 days to convert capital into cash. Let's get to T+0 for any capital/cash conversion and then we can talk getting paid in capital.
Last edited by adelphi_sky; 10-02-2021 at 11:50 AM..
I realize that you were just clarifying. I was just shocked that they included high school minors in the "men not working" group.
I see your point, but it doesn't change the overall picture.
Quote:
Originally Posted by michigan lizard
That was the 80's, but lately, up until last year/covid, teenagers had a lot of difficulty finding a job if they wanted one/had time for one. Older adults had those jobs instead, and the culture shifted away from high school kids working in order to focus on college. It's weird that they are ragged upon for living off family, too. They're still kids--of course they are!
I think that's probably at least partly due to the jacking up of the minimum wage in a lot of places.
Quote:
Originally Posted by michigan lizard
I'm almost as old as you, and I worked my way through college (the firsttimearound), which made me take longer to graduate. With the cost of college these days, that no longer makes sense. It's cheapest to finish as quickly as possible and try to maximize scholarships, while working for minimum wage doesn't even touch tuition costs.
I did something similar. And I agree. I hate seeing people who are my age or older go on and on about how they "worked their way through college". So tone deaf. Most of those people would never have been able to do that today witih the kinds of jobs they had.
That said, I'm not sure everyone is really out there trying to maximize scholarships, either. Sure, a contingent may be, but probably not the majority.
I don't totally disagree with the gist of the article (that men are dropping out of the workforce and it's not a good sign). And I think blaming men, to at least some degree, is warranted. But I also think there are deeper issues have caused men to drop out of the workforce that this article didn't touch. They don't wanna touch on those issues because they don't wanna see their politics have contributed to those issues.
I have a cousin (aged 57 now), who hasn’t worked in 13/14 years. He had a solid career working in the semiconductor industry, and was terminated in an apparent layoff (although he was reluctant to disclose all of the details.)
He ended up moving back home with his elderly mother. He has never worked again. We believe the job loss caused emotional trauma and a loss of self confidence and affected his ability to find employment.
He helps his mother by maintaining the house, her car, helping her with errands, etc.
He survives by living off of his mother’s SS check and his own savings.
I agree these people exist, but I characterize them differently and more harshly than you do.
Lazy people exist in any society. There are always those who refuse to understand the concept that civilization requires work and taxes. Its not a question of laying on the beach all day. Its a question of doing enough work so that one can retire at a respectable age and afford a decent retirement. The kind of men you describe are the sort of people whose favorite words in the English language are "Me" or "I". I have little in common with them and little sympathy for them. Most of us who have worked hard and have a good income look down on people like that. We don't understand the kind of mentality that seeks something for nothing or a free ride in life.
That's part of the story, but not the whole story. Not all men in that situation are as you describe. Yes, a good many of them are. But certainly not all. And there are definitely more such type men that you describe than there used to be. It horrifies me as well. I don't condone the behaviors and attidues that have led to this. But if we look more closely, there has been a concerted effort for many decades to make men irrelevant, especially those who are average or less ambition. Even a few liberal academic types like Camille Paglia have mentioned this.
I'm considering joining them. But I have ample savings and investments to support me, thankyouverymuch.
And no, I won't be watching TV or drinking or doing drugs or hanging out at the beach all day.
There are other ways to be productive in life that don't involve running a business or earning a paycheck. Based on your posting history, I don't think you wanna get that.
Last edited by mysticaltyger; 10-02-2021 at 05:55 PM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
