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I would like to see what would happen to such staunch Republican States like Oklahoma, Kansas, Nebraska and Iowa if all the Federal crop and fuel alcohol subsidies were dropped? Then I would like to see what would happen if the money was used to reindustrialize the North East and the States around the Great Lakes.
By calling on Jeb Bush to "remake" the party's image?????
Geez, I really dislike the Dems badly, but the Republicans are looking just as bad to me right now. They will continue to get thumped in the elections until they ditch the neocons.
I don't get it....the Repugs want to WIN elections, don't they?
Yet they continue with party leaders /spokesmen like Limbaugh, Cheney, Gingrich, and now bring up another Bush ??!!!!
Pssst! They don't have a clue......shhh...don't tell 'em that the old white male ultra-conservative maniac party doesn't win anymore.....
So long as the "spokesmen" of the Republican Party are being paid so well there will never be any change. Why should they? If moderates took over the Republican Party there would be less controversy and less money for the loudmouth cynics riding the destruction of the party all the way to the bank.
This is a triumph of individual greed over group necessities. I say they should keep it up and get on with destroying their party. Then the Democrats could continue to be elected and only have arguments between the moderate and left wing Dems. Yhat would suit me just fine.
No offense, but it seems to me that much of the dogma from you and Reads2MUCH, along with others here, pretty well illustrates the current difficulties facing the GOP's efforts. It's not that Libs may disagree with you on so many things, but it's that y'all seem to have so many basically unexamined "kneejerk" ideological positions, which on scrutiny are really nothing more than assumptions that you don't even feel the need to support with facts. "Central planned Economies have not worked in other countries", "Obama's ideas have failed everywhere else they have been tried", "the ever increasing move towards communism in this country", "the herd mentality dominates America" (and voted for Obama), "Dubya had nothing to do with the foreclosure crisis", etc., etc.
These are just a few examples, and maybe they're true, maybe not. But that's the trouble with unexamined "ideological" arguments... they gradually become party "gospel", continually repeated by the "faithful" (and shaping strategy), even as they may no longer bear any relation to other, more current "realities". So like now, eventually the party becomes stuck in a morass of outmoded dogma, but unable to even examine it's predicament, let alone change.
To quote that distinguished military strategist, Donald Rumsfeld, "...we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns -- the ones we don't know we don't know."
My assertions are thought out and evidence based. Its been said over and over that the big Government high tax states have either been losing people or growing slower than the rest of the nation for quite some time. Because of their high taxes and regulatory hurdles, they're not well positioned to attract successful people and businesses once the Economy rebounds. California and NY aren't disasters for no reason. They tax their most productive residents very heavily, while they should be treating them well. W was not a major cause of the foreclosure crisis; it would have happened (and been just as bad) had Gore or Kerry been President. W's Admin tried to reign in Fannie and Freddie starting back in '01 but their efforts were blocked by (D)s.
Think for yourself... why would someone bring their business to California where there is so much red tape and higher taxes (plus other higher costs)? It would be much better to work in a more business friendly state.
Central planned Economies don't work and Obama's proposals (higher taxes, unions, bigger government, cap and trade, universal healthcare run by the federal Government) HAVE failed in the past and WILL fail if and when he implements them. This year's budget deficit will be $ 1.8 Trillion +, which is 4 times larger than the largest deficit under W (who, himself, had a bad record on fiscal conservatism). The stimulus hasn't helped yet and won't work.
If I were starting a high tech company, particularly in aviation, I would only locate in California because of the generous state support of those industries. If not in aviation, I would locate in Massachusetts or Connecticut.
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
8,852 posts, read 10,467,170 times
Reputation: 6670
Quote:
Originally Posted by LIS123
My assertions are thought out and evidence based. Its been said over and over that the big Government high tax states have either been losing people or growing slower than the rest of the nation for quite some time. Because of their high taxes and regulatory hurdles, they're not well positioned to attract successful people and businesses once the Economy rebounds. California and NY aren't disasters for no reason. They tax their most productive residents very heavily, while they should be treating them well. W was not a major cause of the foreclosure crisis; it would have happened (and been just as bad) had Gore or Kerry been President. W's Admin tried to reign in Fannie and Freddie starting back in '01 but their efforts were blocked by (D)s.
Think for yourself... why would someone bring their business to California where there is so much red tape and higher taxes (plus other higher costs)? It would be much better to work in a more business friendly state.
Central planned Economies don't work and Obama's proposals (higher taxes, unions, bigger government, cap and trade, universal healthcare run by the federal Government) HAVE failed in the past and WILL fail if and when he implements them. This year's budget deficit will be $ 1.8 Trillion +, which is 4 times larger than the largest deficit under W (who, himself, had a bad record on fiscal conservatism). The stimulus hasn't helped yet and won't work.
You may be right, and actually I don't disagree with you in some areas, like the issue of "Cali red tape".
But rather than argue about those things, my point is that much of what folks in the GOP seem to be glibly passing off as "facts" these days, still has alot of room for debate and disagreement among the larger voting population, beyond just the "faithful". So any party that continues to assert the same self-serving "dogma" without any need to support it, not only ain't "listening", it does so at its peril in the elections (where it counts).
By calling on Jeb Bush to "remake" the party's image?????
Geez, I really dislike the Dems badly, but the Republicans are looking just as bad to me right now. They will continue to get thumped in the elections until they ditch the neocons.
You mean McCain won Florida as part of the Republican dominance you speak of?
Central planned Economies don't work and Obama's proposals (higher taxes, unions, bigger government, cap and trade, universal healthcare run by the federal Government) HAVE failed in the past and WILL fail if and when he implements them. This year's budget deficit will be $ 1.8 Trillion +, which is 4 times larger than the largest deficit under W (who, himself, had a bad record on fiscal conservatism). The stimulus hasn't helped yet and won't work.
well said! as our government gets bigger and eats the private sector to try to stay afloat americans will wish for change once again....
if the government cared at all about its citizens it would do something about illegal immigration and outsourcing (the 2 biggest issues for working americans). that would be the #1 priority for a government who wanted its citizens to do well and to live well and yet it is not even being addressed. employment is the engine that drives the economy, NOT DEBT, as we found out when we turned from the world's largest creditor nation to the world's largest debtor nation.
we have a president who is about to try to legalize illegal immigration and we have a non-manufacturing economy try to absorb this unskilled labor pool and that will be a disaster for this country. look at the facts! mexico's economy improved when they jettisoned their excess labor pool, while our country deteriorated even faster into bankruptcy.
LOL, looking at the right wingers on this board, it looks like the GOP is never going to change. When you choose your spokesman to be Rush Limbaugh, and Dick Cheney supports him over a level minded, intelligent honerable man such as Collin Powel, it just says that the GOP that is today is over with. Yeah, there are a lot of crazy right winged nut jobs on this board (and this is coming from somebody in the center). I see a third party becoming the new Republican party. The GOP will never be voted in as far right batsh()t crazy as they are. You guys may think you are the majority. You are the majority in the little crazy Christian republic that you live in, but that is only a small percentage of the average American, which shares none of your far right views.
If the Republican party is indeed rebuilding I wonder what it is going to look like when they are finished?
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Pssst! They don't have a clue......shhh...don't tell 'em that the old white male ultra-conservative maniac party doesn't win anymore.....
