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Yes, I agree that the Iranians are to blame, but it happened due to certain circumstances... I think you won't argue that if there wasn't a first event, there wouldn't be a second.. although this argue is already meaningless..What happened, that happened..
You could also say if Russia had never sold Missiles to an incompetent country that would shoot down a Civilian Airliner than the situation would never occurred.
So from what they are saying, only ONE plane ( the Ukrainian one) went into direction of the "sensitive" zone?
The rest were taking completely different routs then?
Agree.
There were 8 commercial flights which took off from the same airport that morning
from Imam Khomeini International Airport prior to Ukraine Airlines Flight 752
Iranian AA crews did not shoot missiles at any of those planes.
Flying to various destinations....Dubai...Moscow...Istanbul...Doha.. .Vienna...Frankfurt..etc
all arriving safely at their destinations.
For example, Austrian Airlines flight flew from Tehran to Vienna that morning
before Ukraine Airlines flight 752 took off ...without incident.
Ukraine Airlines flight was not the only flight that morning.
So I'm not buying accident....doesn't make sense...
I'm leaning towards intentional...accidental makes no sense
There were 8 commercial flights which took off from the same airport that morning
from Imam Khomeini International Airport prior to Ukraine Airlines Flight 752
Iranian AA crews did not shoot missiles at any of those planes.
Flying to various destinations....Dubai...Moscow...Istanbul...Doha.. .Vienna...Frankfurt..etc
all arriving safely at their destinations.
For example, Austrian Airlines flight flew from Tehran to Vienna that morning
before Ukraine Airlines flight 752 took off ...without incident.
Ukraine Airlines flight was not the only flight that morning.
So I'm not buying accident....doesn't make sense...
I'm leaning towards intentional...accidental makes no sense
but we'll never know...very hard to prove.
The Iranians deliberately kept the airport operating knowing civilian planes departing would deter/disrupt a US attack in the area that night. Part of their Air Defense if you will (the number of planes you note is evidence the Air Defense must have known the civilian airport was open).
No doubt there are a couple of very important Iranian sites (and I am not talking cultural heritage sites although that could provide additional cover) deliberately positioned near the civilian airport.
If the US shot down a plane during an attack (and it would have been very confusing for the US) - all the better from the cynical Iranian vantage.
But Iran miscalculated, the US did not attack that night. And in the course of switching on and off their radars (to avoid US HARM missiles) that plane appeared out of nowhere and Iranian Air Defenders did not see its recent takeoff so they fired away (they were assuming it was a US war plane...and if there were any US planes Iran could pin it on the US in any case ).
(I would add that Iran's miscalculation regarding a US response also indicates a childlike misunderstanding of the sort of munitions and tactics we would use but that is neither here nor there.)
Last edited by Quick Commenter; 01-11-2020 at 07:07 AM..
Anyone still wondering why folks are a tad nervous regarding Iran getting its hands on nuclear weapons?
Shooting down a lumbering civilian jet 3 minutes after it takes off from their very own (and largest and operational) airport is an immediate disqualification from future control of extremely dangerous weapons. (Even without those usual ‘Death to America’ blah blah blah chants.)
So presumably the US should be disqualified from having nuclear weapons because of Iran Air 655 and Russia shouldn't have them because of Korean Airlines 007?
Originally Posted by Quick Commenter
Anyone still wondering why folks are a tad nervous regarding Iran getting its hands on nuclear weapons?
Shooting down a lumbering civilian jet 3 minutes after it takes off from their very own (and largest and operational) airport is an immediate disqualification from future control of extremely dangerous weapons. (Even without those usual ‘Death to America’ blah blah blah chants.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MnM258
So presumably the US should be disqualified from having nuclear weapons because of Iran Air 655 and Russia shouldn't have them because of Korean Airlines 007?
Presumably you are aware the US has not shot down a lumbering (and duly scheduled) civilian jet 3 minutes after it took off from the US's very own largest and operational civilian airport.
(It is also true that 30+ years ago the US Navy shot down an incoming and non-responsive civilian jet over the Persian Gulf. And the Soviets deliberately shot down a jet liner it claimed penetrated its airspace. Beyond the obvious and vast differences in circumstances with the Iranian shootdown , the US and Soviets already had nuclear weapons.)
But Iran miscalculated, the US did not attack that night. radaAnd in the course of switching on and off theirrs (to avoid USM missiles) t HARhat plane appeared out of nowhere and Iranian Air Defenders did not see its recent takeoff so they fired away (they were assuming it was a US war plane...and if there were any US planes Iran could pin it on the US in any case ).
This is an interesting version. Official version: the plane had a strange trajectory and was approaching a military facility.
30 km North-West of Imam Khomeini airport, in a desolate mountain-desert area, is the base "Mallard" - a secret missile facility of the Islamic revolutionary guard Corps (Iranian ballistic missile launchers).
Seeing a launch and seeing a target capture are two different things.
They are. I think you mis translated the words there. We see launches with thermal sensors. We saw the radar with a different detection system. Radar of a type that is used by SAM targeting has a signature. We would not normally see this but we're watching the area closely at the time.
There were 8 commercial flights which took off from the same airport that morning
from Imam Khomeini International Airport prior to Ukraine Airlines Flight 752
Iranian AA crews did not shoot missiles at any of those planes.
Flying to various destinations....Dubai...Moscow...Istanbul...Doha.. .Vienna...Frankfurt..etc
all arriving safely at their destinations.
For example, Austrian Airlines flight flew from Tehran to Vienna that morning
before Ukraine Airlines flight 752 took off ...without incident.
Ukraine Airlines flight was not the only flight that morning.
So I'm not buying accident....doesn't make sense...
I'm leaning towards intentional...accidental makes no sense
but we'll never know...very hard to prove.
As I said before it was a good way to deflect news cycle from the situation at hand, and Russia would obviously want this plane chosen if they were helping do this. But it seems too complex to be true. Too messy and risky. I doubt it was intentional.
Plucked with a dark beef based gravy. Broccoli and large curd cottage cheese with Cheetos mixed in a bowl on the side. Fresh baked bread too with a glass of water.
I own it. I completely ignored most of the news and relied on the first videos, pictures and some obscure
aviation experts. It all seemed to fit together so I went with it.
/\ In retrospect it really would have been a totally wild coincidence for the crash to have been that particular night just outside of Tehran due solely to an engine malfunction.
At this point the only surprising thing is that Iran only shot down one civilian plane.
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