Is Texas part of the South? (2014, move, Scottish)
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Always an interesting poll, but the problem is often that being Southern, Western, and just Texas are not necessarily at odds with each other. I don't mean to criticize the OP and wording, but it probably should have been a poll with "options." That is, Texas is definitely Texas, but when classified regionally -- as a whole -- it belongs to the American South, as in origins, roots, history and culture. It is "western" as in a "frontier state", and "southwestern" as in "western South"...which is something completely different from the "Southwest" of Arizona and New Mexico" which are "southern West."
This topic is and probably always will be, a subject of endless debate/discussion...
Glad you made it back to this umpteenth discussion on this.
You have taught me well through all these threads and I would like to summarize what you have explained in the past.
1) The majority of Texas was settled by southerners with the western parts of Texas being settled after the war. (Less so in the trans pecos and maybe the northern panhandle).
2) The state government was southern and the laws etc. of both the republic and the state were modeled after more southern customs and traditions.
3) While the terrain, and culture, and economy in west Texas was somewhat different than east Texas, the plains of Texas were southerners adapting to a more "western/arid" environment. Not unlike the Northerners and midwesterners who adopted to a somewhat similar western/arid environment in the northern plains state.
4) While the Mexican/Tejano influence (which may be considered "southwestern") has spread throughout the decades, their influence their numbers and political power were localized in south Texas/San Antonio and the Transpecos/El Paso during the early days of nation and statehood due to many Mexicans returning to Mexico after the loss of Texas.
How do you determine who to make an exception for?
Only if the people themselves make an exception is it valid. Most Cajuns living in Southern Louisiana embrace the southern Label. Most Catholics elsewhere in The South are going to refer to themselves as a mix or something else entirely. You aren't going to hear germans in Kentucky or Mexicans in Texas saying they are full blown southern. And they aren't.
Only if the people themselves make an exception is it valid. Most Cajuns living in Southern Louisiana embrace the southern Label. Most Catholics elsewhere in The South are going to refer to themselves as a mix or something else entirely. You aren't going to hear germans in Kentucky or Mexicans in Texas saying they are full blown southern. And they aren't.
Ah, so you've polled these Germans and Mexicans, I take it?
You think the Germans of Knoxville, TN are going to consider themselves Southern? They are the largest ancestry group there. What about Atlanta, GA or Mobile, AL where Germans make up the second largest White ethnic group? You think they've distanced themselves from the "Southern" label?
Ah, so you've polled these Germans and Mexicans, I take it?
You think the Germans of Knoxville, TN are going to consider themselves Southern? They are the largest ancestry group there. What about Atlanta, GA or Mobile, AL where Germans make up the second largest White ethnic group? You think they've distanced themselves from the "Southern" label?
There is no way germans are the largest ancestry anywhere in TN, and a huge chunk of the Germans in Atlanta are recent arrivals from the north, so I doubt they consider themselves fully southern.
Germans were a tiny, tiny piece of the southern ancestral make up. They probably weren't able to form cultural niches like the large waves of Germans in Kentucky were.
There is no way germans are the largest ancestry anywhere in TN, and a huge chunk of the Germans in Atlanta are recent arrivals from the north, so I doubt they consider themselves fully southern.
Germans were a tiny, tiny piece of the southern ancestral make up. They probably weren't able to form cultural niches like the large waves of Germans in Kentucky were.
First you say Pittsburgh is the Midwest. Now you say Germans aren't the main ancestry anywhere in Tennessee. Why did you join this forum if you simply have your own ideas of reality? It's called city DATA for a reason. Here's the DATA to back my claim up:
German beats out English, the traditionally "Southern" ancestry. While I don't discount that English is the traditional ancestry most associated with the South (other than Black), claiming that Germans make up no majority of anywhere in Tennessee is just intellectual dishonesty or complete disregard for the facts. I mean, here we have a city that is unquestionably Southern and German happens to be the most common ancestry.
Do you ever get tired of saying things that aren't true? I feel like you're just a troll, saying things to get a rile out of people.
Also, Kentucky isn't the South because of Germans? Really? If people say that Cincinnati, a very German city has a Southern feel and is more like Kentucky than Ohio, than how could Kentucky not be Southern? I guess all those Kentuckians I've met who consider themselves Southern need to visit the great Craving Mountains to get their card pulled since they must not know what they're talking about.
Last edited by EddieOlSkool; 10-30-2014 at 04:06 PM..
There is no way germans are the largest ancestry anywhere in TN, and a huge chunk of the Germans in Atlanta are recent arrivals from the north, so I doubt they consider themselves fully southern.
Germans were a tiny, tiny piece of the southern ancestral make up. They probably weren't able to form cultural niches like the large waves of Germans in Kentucky were.
The Germans, Poles, and Czechs who settled heavily throughout Central and certain coastal areas of Texas in the mid-19th century are an integral part of that area of the state's culture and history. I'm a descendant of the Polish part of it myself. The idea that this somehow make me any less Southern or Texan than those of Scots-Irish or British ancestry is ridiculous.
The vast majority of German immigration was to northern states though, esp the Midwest, and certain sections of NY and PA.
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